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JuanDeFuca
Big Wall climber
Stoney Point
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Topic Author's Reply - Jul 17, 2006 - 05:40pm PT
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At what point does a assist become a rescue?
That's a good question.
Without the assist, what would have happened?
These are very serious questions that need to be addressed.
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skotty
climber
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Jul 17, 2006 - 06:06pm PT
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Fattrad,
I know this is diluting a good thread and splitting hairs, but since I'm bored at work right now: I think a "rescue" includes a deliverance from danger. In our case the only deliverance was our packs, so I think it could be appropriate to say our packs were rescued, but I think since we delivered ourselves from danger on our own power (i.e. the webbing that Ranger Rob held just in case, wasn't used/weighted), I don't think "rescue" is the apt term. "Assist" seems appropriate, as it just denotes help but does not involve deliverance.
In retrospect, I don't think the lack of this assist in this particular case would have necessarily made it a rescue, though it would have increased the liklihood. In other cases I could see how it would turn into a rescue.
By diction alone, I think the fine line between rescue and assit rests on the deliverance of the person. Other dictionaries may provide loser definitions, but my four seem to support this.
Another thought: some dictionaries seem to give "rescue" a broader meaning of "saving life", which would bring us into subjective territory.
DISCLAIMER: I like discussing diction. Don't take this as me down playing the risk that Ranger Rob bravely took in volunteering his help, or me trying to down play my bad judgment or lack of skill.
P.S. Dirtbag, good theory. I probably would have thought the same thing. Unfortunately, I'm not that clever: skotty ≠ jody.
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dirtbag
climber
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Jul 17, 2006 - 06:20pm PT
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Damn, another crappy conspiracy theory of mine has been debunked.
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dirtineye
Trad climber
the south
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Jul 17, 2006 - 07:18pm PT
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Laugh at my climbing soap opera parody names, damn you all to H3LL!
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dirtbag
climber
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Jul 17, 2006 - 10:33pm PT
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"Dingbat milkdud and slimebag are just peeved that Jennie thinks I am level headed and they are not."
Actually, "relieved"--not "peeved"--is a better description of how I feel.
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JuanDeFuca
Big Wall climber
Stoney Point
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Topic Author's Reply - Jul 17, 2006 - 10:44pm PT
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Where exactly did the climbers fall that died last year?
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Ken M
Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
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Jul 19, 2006 - 08:12pm PT
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Juan, they died in this exact chute. They were both on the snowfield above the rock band halfway up the picture (which is probably 1/3 of the way up the chute). In one case, the fellow was glissading, lost control on the icy surface, in the other case, just a fall.
From the photo's perspective, behind the photographer is a cliff, with a steep rock slope a thousand or two drop to the bottom of that valley.
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scuffy b
climber
Chalet Neva-Care
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Jul 20, 2006 - 05:56pm PT
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Hey Skotty
I'm glad things worked out. Some questions:
You bring up diction and dictionaries. I'm curious about one of
your statements in the story: "We admonished our stupidity."
Isn't admonish something you do to a person (because of his stupidity or whatever)? More like "my grandfather's ghost admonished me for my..."
(it's hair-splitting time I guess)
relationship/partner issue
You say relationship stronger (great) but may have lost a partner. But you also say that you and your girlfriend have signed up for a course on climbing stuff at JT. So it's not a given? If she digs what you two learn at JT, it's not like she's gonna be shopping around for someone else to climb rocks with, right?
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426
Sport climber
Buzzard Point, TN
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Jul 20, 2006 - 11:06pm PT
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Skotty, I enjoyed the betamax personally---having done Whitney in all sorts of weather from nice warm sun to graupple storms, I think the notch is harder at times than the E. Face/E. Butt route. It was the "worst part" of climbing Keeler Needle for me personally (says a lot) because of the icy conditions and light footwear.
We watched a navy bird come in for a kid who slipped down the main gully and died. Literally broken in half on talus at the bottom according to some guys at Iceberg.
So, Muir class 3....yeah, means watch your step.
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