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Jaybro
Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
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Apr 29, 2013 - 04:42pm PT
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Fist fights on Everest? That's like getting lost in the snow in the alps and getting eaten by st Bernard's!
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kaholatingtong
Trad climber
Nevada City
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Apr 29, 2013 - 04:44pm PT
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dave, maybe im weird, but i laughed out loud really hard at the pic above. +2.
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Gunkie
Trad climber
East Coast US
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Apr 29, 2013 - 04:44pm PT
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Dave729... how did you get the actual encounter image?
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nah000
climber
canuckistan
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Apr 29, 2013 - 04:53pm PT
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dave729 that pic is the funniest thing i've seen on this site in a while.
thanks for the hilarity.
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orangesporanges
Social climber
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Apr 29, 2013 - 05:19pm PT
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I have seen otherwise delightful Sherpa Guides
First hand
Threatening alpinists before
Who were not using their ropes (or paying for their service)
Their is a problem
Westerners who hump their own loads are seen to be taking money from these guys mouths
Same with Westerners that don't use and pay for fixed lines and ladders
Feeling threatened by climbers that don't need their support to climb by fair means
And for all that AC, HIMEX et. al. voice in appreciation for the Sherpa Guides work
Sherpa Guides (who do the bulk of the sharp-end guiding work) are asking, why aren't we getting paid something more in-line with what the Western Guides score
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Jan
Mountain climber
Okinawa, Japan
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Apr 29, 2013 - 05:26pm PT
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It isn't just the Sherpas. The western owners of the guide companies are unhappy about it too. If the free lancers were entirely self sufficient, that would be one thing but they're essentially dirt baggers using other people's work and equipment for free and then bragging how they got up Everest on their own. There have also been cases where gear and fixed ropes were stolen at the end of the season when clients were still on their way up.
The inevitable result I'm guessing, is that everyone will have to pay for a guide service whether they use it or not, and have ID badges they wear on the mountain.
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local1
Mountain climber
CH
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Apr 29, 2013 - 05:31pm PT
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As much as I know, Ueli is paying the toll for passing the Khumbu
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orangesporanges
Social climber
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Apr 29, 2013 - 05:37pm PT
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Ueli and Simone on E
House and Prezelj on Makalu
Dirt-baggers that don't pay their way?
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Jan
Mountain climber
Okinawa, Japan
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Apr 29, 2013 - 05:51pm PT
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That is the truly sad part of this. They were the ones who just happened to be there annoying the Sherpas when the pot boiled over and ended up being the victims of a lot of other frustrations. There have been so many other candidates, but they happened to be the ones in the wrong place at the wrong time.
Let us hope that Moro and Griffith make apologies in which case the Sherpas will also, they have a reconciliation ceremony, and continue on with a realistic discussion later about the problems on Everest. Something good could yet come of this.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Apr 29, 2013 - 06:00pm PT
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Something good could yet come of this.
Color me sceptical. Why don't they go do something far from the maddening
crowds like, say, Gasherbrum or K2? Oh, I forgot, Paris Match won't pay for
stories on those peaks.
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Jennie
Trad climber
Elk Creek, Idaho
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Apr 29, 2013 - 06:05pm PT
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Your comments are fabulous annotation to the thread, Jan...
...appreciate your contributions!
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Snowmassguy
Trad climber
Calirado
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Apr 29, 2013 - 06:10pm PT
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Jan is totally correct. However, I am still hoping it involves spies and a plot similar to the Eiger Sanction or better yet Vertical Limit.
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Slabby D
Trad climber
B'ham WA
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Apr 29, 2013 - 06:19pm PT
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...Jans comments strike me as incredibly biased but to each their own.
I certainly hope these guys don't apologize for trying to get to their tent. Nowhere in the world should stepping over a fixed line be punishable by stoning.
The romanticized image of the always noble and strong Sherpa seems like it needs some serious questioning. Plenty of money-grubbing as#@&%es in every culture.
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Jan
Mountain climber
Okinawa, Japan
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Apr 29, 2013 - 06:30pm PT
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Snowmassguy-
It sounds like you're ready to write a prize winning novel!
You have to admit that Everest provides a good thread for this site every spring now.
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Vitaliy M.
Mountain climber
San Francisco
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Apr 29, 2013 - 06:36pm PT
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Let us hope that Moro and Griffith make apologies
I can totally see it....
"Please excuse us for having the courage to hike up the mountain before you 'fix' the route for everyone. And for us having enough courage to step over your rope. We should have hiked half way around the mountain to avoid stepping over it. It was our fault you guys decided to threaten our life, throw rocks at our face, and beat us 100 vs 3. We will tip you well!"
Plenty of money-grubbing as#@&%es in every culture.
+1
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Jan
Mountain climber
Okinawa, Japan
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Apr 29, 2013 - 06:44pm PT
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I am defending the Sherpas because I know their culture and because there's no one else to defend them. I am not justifying violence. The Sherpa culture and religion is very pacifist so what I'm telling you is that if they resorted to violence there's a lot else going on that we don't know about, maybe involving the three climbers who set it off, maybe not. Since the three western climbers involved are all experienced in the Himalayas, and Moro in particular has a good reputation for rescues, it is especially puzzling that the three of them would breach climbing protocol like they did.
For 60 years, the rule on the mountain has been that no one interferes with the Sherpa teams who have the job of fixing the ropes, quite a few of whom have died doing that in the Khumbu icefall. Normal civilization involves following the rules and customs of the local people. If climbers don't want to play by those rules, they should go to a mountain without crowds of tourists and Sherpas. They have options and the Sherpas don't.
And I say it is up to the westerners involved to apologize first (the Sherpas will follow), as they initially caused the problem by breaking protocol, they caused a huge loss of face to the Sherpa sirdar by swearing at him which they know is important in that culture, and they're the ones who get to tell their side of the story on the internet and make money by writing it up in books, and they're the ones who have created distrust between the two groups on the mountains. Every westerner on Everest will now feel the results of what happened and lots of Sherpas once they're down from the mountain, and all for what? So three guys out of thousands could climb where they felt like on a given day?
The next time someone dies on Everest because the Sherpas refuse to do heroics anymore at the risk of their own lives, this incident should come to mind.
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Jan
Mountain climber
Okinawa, Japan
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Apr 29, 2013 - 06:58pm PT
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As for mercenary cultures, climbing Sherpas who work on Everest make at best between $5,000 and $6,000 for risking their lives. For many that is 90-100% of their yearly income. A lot of the climbers pay five times that to be on the mountain and the profits go to western airlines and the western owners of the guide companies.
Every Sherpa has stories of extra money and gear they were promised to help a client down after that client refused their advice, went for the top and got in trouble. Every Sherpa has stories of the client disappearing or forgetting the conversation when they were back in base camp.
Not all Sherpas are good or western clients foolish and bad. If you study the history of Himalayan moutaineering starting back in the 1920's however, it is the Sherpas who have suffered the overwhelming amount of exploitation, not the westerners.
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Jan
Mountain climber
Okinawa, Japan
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Apr 29, 2013 - 07:26pm PT
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And here's the best article so far along with the latest news.
http://www.adventure-journal.com/2013/04/violence-hits-mt-everest-as-sherpas-fight-with-ueli-steck-others/
In a statement released Monday on Steck’s website, the expedition said, “The three climbers feel that they don’t believe that their actions were the reasons behind such a mass attack. They believe that the reaction was from a far more deep rooted and long term problem, which is the way that Nepalis feel treated by westerners on the mountain and this was a uprising against that.”
Later Moro comes across as the better person of all involved.
In an interview with Planet Mountain, Moro said, “We’re abandoning the expedition…Despite having met those who attacked us, having embraced and having forgiven them, I wanted that the meeting with everyone at Base Camp ended with my words that underlined the esteem I have for the Sherpa and Nepal, but I also stated that this violence killed our climbing dream and that we are leaving. I will probably stay on, but only to fly the helicopter and carry out rescue operations, but Ueli and Jon will return home. I want to add that that fact that I wish to stay and help with rescues (free for the Sherpa people) shows my desire to help these people. Everyone here is shocked and aware of the violence that was committed, they realised that a simple handshake isn’t enough to change a relationship that has mutated too much since that one in 1953. Today Everest is too much of a business and there are too many heroes.”
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klk
Trad climber
cali
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Apr 29, 2013 - 07:35pm PT
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If the free lancers were entirely self sufficient, that would be one thing but they're essentially dirt baggers using other people's work and equipment for free and then bragging how they got up Everest on their own.
given that this thread has been specifically about simone and ueli, that comment seems more than a bit sharp.
worse, it's the kind of thing some dumbass outsider journalist will seize on as a money quote.
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Jan
Mountain climber
Okinawa, Japan
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Apr 29, 2013 - 07:48pm PT
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In a statement released Monday on Steck’s website, the expedition said, “The three climbers feel that they don’t believe that their actions were the reasons behind such a mass attack. They believe that the reaction was from a far more deep rooted and long term problem, which is the way that Nepalis feel treated by westerners on the mountain and this was a uprising against that.”
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