Discussion Topic |
|
This thread has been locked |
Patrick Sawyer
climber
Originally California now Ireland
|
|
Yeah, I know Kevin, I was just trying to be humorous about Valhalla. I'd still love to climb it (with more modern shoes, sigh) but I haven't led 5.11 for years. There are some great routes at T/S, I remember one article/pictorial, I think in Mountain or Summit that shows Tobin Sorenson leading this really neat looking climb, a 10c I believe. I can't recall the name but I can probably still lead 10c if I get back into shape.
|
|
o-man
Social climber
Paia,Maui,HI
|
|
"I'm with you fellers" Delmar
|
|
inyoupyos
climber
California
|
|
I Am, don't get discouraged. There are more climbers out and about climbing who get you and would defend an original route than will be found on forums.
|
|
Gary
climber
"My god - it's full of stars!"
|
|
Saw the picture of the route. That's disgusting what they did.
|
|
Don Paul
Big Wall climber
Colombia, South America
|
|
Sadly they must be chopped. It does trash those routes even more but if its not enforced then rock climbing will eventually transform into sport climbing.
|
|
TYeary
Social climber
State of decay
|
|
I always thought the Stonemaster criteria was to lead all of Valhalla,(check, back in '74) Smoke copious amounts of bunk weed( check and double check) and be an arrogant punk( guilty on all accounts) , however Martin is no more an "original" Stonemaster than I. That is not in question. What is is question are the ethics of some individuals who are adding bolts to routes that were put up without them. I would like to see our community talk about this without resorting to character assassination. I have always operated on the ethical principle that if I couldn't climb a route , in the style in which it was put up, then I waited until I could. Pure and simple. Adding bolts to an existing route to fortify ones lack of sack is wrong. Period.
My two cents....
TY
|
|
Elcapinyoazz
Social climber
Joshua Tree
|
|
This thread is custom made for Donny the OHHH-Riginal.
Whatever happened to that dude anyway?
|
|
johnx01
Trad climber
UK
|
|
Hi
As a foreigner I always understood the rules to be something like this
"Welcome to Stone Masters. The first rule of Stone Masters is: you do not
talk about Stone Masters. The second rule of Stone Masters is: you DO NOT
talk about Stone Masters! Third rule of Stone Masters: someone yells "stop!", goes limp, taps out, the climb is over. Fourth rule: only two guys to a climb. Fifth rule: one climb at a time, fellas. Sixth rule: No shirts, no shoes (only EB’s). Seventh rule: climbs will go on as long as they have to. And the eighth and final rule: if this is your first time at Stone Masters, you have to climb."
But I may have been confused.........
-John
|
|
survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
|
|
I am Stonemaster.
|
|
DanaB
climber
CT
|
|
There was (is) a thread on Gunks.com about whether a local convienience anchor (an anchor that is about 20 feet or so from the top, old pins, a stuck cam)) should be replaced with bolts or if the anchor should be removed and nothing put there at all. Reading the opinions that have been offered on the subject, it would be reasonable to assume that there are a fair number of climbers who would support the removal of discomfort, risk, and uncertainty from their climbing.
|
|
johnx01
Trad climber
UK
|
|
hey survival
you checked rule 1 and 2?
-John
|
|
Jon Beck
Trad climber
Oceanside
|
|
John - so that is where the term "belay slave" came from
|
|
Todd Gordon
Trad climber
Joshua Tree, Cal
|
|
Which would you choose;...to have your route chopped (bolts removed), or have someone add bolts to your route?......Both seem irritating to me;....If your route gets chopped;...it's irritating to go back and replace them;...especially sad if the chopper has done a poor job of chopping. If someone adds bolts to your route....that's irritating, but at least your climb still exists......something to chew on......
|
|
johnx01
Trad climber
UK
|
|
Hey Jon
"Like so many others, I had become a slave to the Ikea nesting instinct."
Is that what you mean?
BTW. I dont believe adding bolts to pre-existing climbs is acceptable.
^^^^^ Just incase my view wasnt clear
-John
|
|
fresh pow
Gym climber
Plastic Paradise
|
|
what's missing here is the voice of those responsible for adding bolts to an established climb. And with the universal disapproval for retrobolting without the FA'er consent, it is highly unlikely that anyone else involved will speak up. Soo...
The retro bolters have been characterized as Sackless Gym Rats out to pedestrianize and sanitize the rock routes. Maybe they are.
The OP's origional post @ MP seems to be a rebuttal against the retrobolters (duh) and what was written about his routes in the San Diego County Climbing Guide. The routes get two or three stars, which is an indication the climbing on them is good. The complaint in the guidebook seems to be that bolts themselves are inadequate and abnormally far apart.
With that...
Respect each other Respect the Rock and Climb!
|
|
PRRose
climber
Boulder
|
|
Regarding the religious claptrap (as Hankster put it), I don't think Jesus had much to say on the subject of retrobolting. However, he was reported to have said, "But I tell you, Do not resist an evil person. If someone strikes you on the right cheek, turn to him the other also." Or, to go Old Testament, "Do not say, 'I'll pay you back for this wrong!' Wait for the LORD, and he will deliver you." Not to mention, "Do not take revenge, my friends, but leave room for God's wrath, for it is written: 'It is mine to avenge; I will repay,' says the Lord."
|
|
Largo
Sport climber
The Big Wide Open Face
|
|
I don't know, Hank. Maybe if we let Baby Jesus into the conversation we might really cover some ground.
It's really such a goofy notion - talking to Jesus about bolting.
I sometimes wonder what it would be like to actually meet Jesus as a living person/God, and what we might rap about. Not sure rock climbing would ever come up but maybe. I guess I'd first ask about my friend Tobin S. If anyone would know about Tobin, it would have to be Jesus Christ.
Amen, brother . . .
JL
|
|
GDavis
Social climber
SOL CAL
|
|
reading this thread
|
|
TYeary
Social climber
State of decay
|
|
Amen Largo, Amen...
TY
|
|
|
SuperTopo on the Web
|
Let us know!