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paganmonkeyboy
climber
mars...it's near nevada...
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climber chicks rock...nuff said...
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Fluoride
Trad climber
Hollywood, CA
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Topic Author's Reply - Mar 7, 2010 - 12:22pm PT
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Bluering, it doesn't climb.
Please don't include those that don't climb.
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philo
Trad climber
Somewhere halfway over the rainbow
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Honestly Fluoride, until you posted your avatar pic I didn't know what gender you were nor did I care. Now that I've seen your (hubba, hubba) pics I can't imagine anyone calling you a witch. Unless they caught you brewing love potions in a cauldren. haha Sorry our cyber family is a little dysfunctional. But we love ya lady!
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Fluoride
Trad climber
Hollywood, CA
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Topic Author's Reply - Mar 7, 2010 - 12:37pm PT
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Aw thanks Philo. Wasn't going looking for it in this thread.
I really only started this thread in response to the "L" attack thread. She's an amazing woman and did not deserve that.
But seriously, there's not very many women who post here anymore. I'm talking ones who CLIMB (hint, non-trolls).
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tuolumne_tradster
Trad climber
Leading Edge of North American Plate
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climbing chicks are cool...
Hanna on the Piz Badile
Professional dancer and climber Paris Wages on Hogwash
Little girl on the dike route
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zeta
Trad climber
Berkeley
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hey!
i'm a girl who climbs! and i post! though not all the time...I've learned to stay away from:
-flaming threads--because they go too far
-political threads--they go on forever and it's the same people posting the same stuff
-and i don't respond to threads with pics that offend/piss me off
that said, this ST place somehow sucked me in...i lurked for a long time reading other people's posts before i ever got around to posting...i spend WAY too much time on this site--in fact my first reaction to the 'diss thread' was that it was about climbers suffering while trying to write a dissertation (like me!) but then i found it was just another thread about dissing people...
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Melissa
Gym climber
berkeley, ca
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Any time you suggest that there is misogyny here, many will shout you down and tell you that there is none.
I feel like my only choices are to ignore it and focus on the people that are above it or decide that there is not enough value left here to justify participating in something that offends my core values.
Of the list that nita made, I'd love to meet nearly all of those women. They seem like genuinely nice people. A big % are here for a social reason that has little to do w/ climbing though, so I'd agree that it's not always the best place to look for sister-psyche. Although, I think the guys often feel this way about their counterparts here too.
The Lord Slime thread has given me some fresh nostalgia for the days of rec.climbing. Every one of the women that posted there that I can think of was intelligent, self-respecting, and could handle herself on the sharp end of a rope. And to that I could add that the men over there on the whole treated women as peers to the extent that we earned it. We were held to a standard, and generally tried to conduct ourselves accordingly, I think. It made me a better climber. Maybe I've idealized my memories a bit, but it really was a cool time.
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L
climber
Hangin' by a thread and lookin' for my wings
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"In any group of one hundred men you'll have 5 or 10 second tier sub-males who have no hope of currying the favor of the opposite sex. They understand this deep down and so gather together in small groups and hump one anothers' legs whilst they reassure themselves of their climbing superiority."
Gads DMT--you make me laugh!!!
Beth, you are such an awesome chik, climber and friend! But I said it all in Edzilla, so won't repeat it here.
Happi, Beth's reason for posting this thread was Graniteclimber's ENTIRE WHITE-TRASH ENTITLED THREAD dedicated to "burning me at the stake"--her oversite of your name and climbing accomplishments was not intentional, believe me.
Her point was, and this is important...there are things happening on this site which are not acceptable to a "climbing community". People have been banned for what most of us consider unacceptable behavior--banned. So all of this "it's a guys' club so just buck-up" is pure rhetorical nonesense. That wasn't her point.
So tell me--have you seen Crimpie post a TR lately? Hmmm? Even a post in response to something is rare for her these days. Do you know why? Do you know what certain kinds of harassment do to women of any intellect at all? Hmmm? Do you know why there are LAWS against certain kinds of harassment in every area of our society today?
Crimpie doesn't want to be treated like fragile china. I don't want to be treated like fragile china, nor does Beth or most of the women who post here. We don't climb because it's a "parlor room bridge club" sort of deal, fergodsake!
But we DO want respect...and there isn't a person on this site that doesn't know what respect means. (Even you, Locker! ;-)) Graniteclimber did not respect me, and I was able to absorb and get over it. But I shouldn't have to do that...not in my community.
That's one of the reasons I've been teasing LEB about her HowWeirdDean duplicity--I felt it wasn't respectful to this community to lie multiple times in each and every post, to attempt to discredit the people who saw through her masquerade. (Don't argue about this Lois--ST management knows that HowWeirdDean and LEB post from the SAME IP address...that means the SAME computer...that means the SAME perpetrator.) Nor is it respectful to derail threads with your own agenda simply to fulfill your need for attention, or to litter the front page with multiple Me-Me-Me threads. Once in a while is excusable. Continuous is not.
This is a Climbing Community, like it or not. It isn't always politically correct, but that's bearable compared to predator behavior and sexually demeaning thread titles/content. I've met and climbed with many of the folks on this site, and like and appreciate all of them. ALL OF THEM. And there are many I haven't met but feel great affinity for anyway.
That's Community. That's what Beth is talking about.
So leave the Mistress of the Offal-Widths alone, you detractors...or you'll have to deal with, as GC put it, the heartless witch (remove W insert B) in the catsuit.
Meeeeeeeeeeeeeeeoooooooooooowwwwwwwww >^..^< hsssssss-hssssssssss!
heh-heh-heh...
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Lynne Leichtfuss
Sport climber
Will know soon
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Gezzzz, went to Culp Valley to try and teach myself how to recognize boulder problems and climb them and come back to this......
Yikes, on melllllow days or in times of loss we call each other a community, a family, a virtual campfire. Then the biorhythms of life take a dive and yowza !
All I gotta say is that when I needed a new life Many of you on this forum helped me create one. I don't consider myself a "climber" yet, but I do climb and have posted numerous TR's of climbing with family and friends.
I have learned more about grace and caring on this forum than in all my years in parochial school....let me rephrase that. I Learned about those topics in school, I actually have had them demonstrated to me on this forum and in the real by many of Yo.
My point, heck, I don't know. :D But it is true nothing remains static and none, not one of us are guarenteed tomorrow. I guess right about now Locker should chime in with a chorus of Kumbaya......hehehe. Peace, from Lynne
PS, got rained out or I would still be out there.
Edit: Just read your post L. Rude people suck. But can you imagine what their lives are like ?
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Melissa
Gym climber
berkeley, ca
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coz, I don't think that wishing for more women who do climb (and post about it) here is the same as being down on the people that don't.
I'd agree w/ "once a climber always a climber", and I think the climbing contributions of a couple of our "retired" women climbers are pretty highly valued (at least by me).
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L
climber
Hangin' by a thread and lookin' for my wings
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You're incorrect Jeff. I spoke/heard from her this morning.
A sore foot does not keep you from posting on the Internet.
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L
climber
Hangin' by a thread and lookin' for my wings
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Jeeeeeffffffffffffffff....most of the women on this site--especially Crimpie--don't complain about the incivilities dished out to them.
They just go away.
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Roger Breedlove
climber
Cleveland Heights, Ohio
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There are lots of folks who read and sometimes post on ST whose response to insults and crude posts follow the Chrimpster’s lead.
In the 3-D world (love that phrase) it is equivalent to drunks thrashing a party--you just leave. No guest confronts them, Jeff, especially since there is no host.
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Lynne Leichtfuss
Sport climber
Will know soon
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Just my two cents worth. I have never been good at or even able to confront people. In the last two years with no real life defender I have had to think much about this. Do I just fade or what ? Well, I have learned one thing. If fading is your response the obnoxious ones have gained. If one can learn to have enough quiet strong chi to rebuff and perhaps even turn the tide it benefits the whole. Jess sayin'
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Binks
Social climber
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"The hostility is just getting too much for me also." I hope you're joking. You started half the fights yourself.
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phylp
Trad climber
Millbrae, CA
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Hey Fluoride-
I'm a bit late to this party, for the usual reason - too busy to check stuff here every day.
I'm a woman, I climb quite a bit, have been climbing for a long time, and I lead a lot more than I follow.
I don't post a whole lot as I'm not interested in all the politics and most of the general interest stuff. When I do post, I doubt most people even realize I'm a woman, even now that I have a photo icon. I come to this forum because I love all the climbing stories and trip reports, and because some of the non-climbing threads are interesting.
On the whole I feel that this is a good community. A whole lot of the "regulars" on the forum seem like good people. The ones who don't seem so wonderful, I just ignore. In this forum, as in life, reactivity gets you nowhere. I really don't pay any attention to who's male or who's female.
Big hug, Phyl
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Crimpergirl
Sport climber
Boulder, Colorado!
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The foot is great. I've been climbing for five weeks (in the gym, weather sucks,) and while it's "only" the gym, I'm climbing grades higher than pre-surgery. The foot is 100%. Thanks for asking.
Just post TRs?
The last two TRs I posted here were "vandalized". One got photos of naked women, and the other was decorated with the most vulgar statements said about me from a poster I've never met.
Both the photos and statements were removed from someone and I appreciate that. But my response has been to go away and post very little. And I certainly won't post TRs any longer. It's that simple.
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Chiloe
Trad climber
Lee, NH
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Thanks to Crimpergirl for telling it like it is. All this "just be thicker-skinned" stuff seems to miss many points at once.
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zeta
Trad climber
Berkeley
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Just post TRs?
The last two TRs I posted here were "vandalized". One got photos of naked women, and the other was decorated with the most vulgar statements said about me from a poster I've never met.
Both the photos and statements were removed from someone and I appreciate that. But my response has been to go away and post very little. And I certainly won't post TRs any longer. It's that simple.
wow, crimpie that's awful! There is definitely some misogynistic crap that emerges in these forums, and while I'm sorry to hear that you don't want to post more TRs, I understand where you're coming from.
I totally get why women disengage from offensive posts...I am really good at confronting people in person, it's way harder for me to do online. I just stay away from ST a while...
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Chaz
Trad climber
greater Boss Angeles area
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We had a problem like this at one of the bars I worked.
Women wouldn't walk in, (or stay very long or come back again if they did walk in) as long as the joint was dominated by loud, rude, dirt-workers who showed up early and stayed all night ( couldn't go home because that's where their wives were ). Too rude or too stupid to keep their hurtful language to themselves.
We fixed that by getting rid of the things they liked, like Budweiser Draft ( replaced with Guiness ), the pool table ( replaced with a piano and dance floor ) and the Lottery ( replaced by nothing ).
The positive results were immediate. The loud dirt-workers found another sausage-bar and couples and groups of women and educated guys started coming in. It became a cool place to hang and a fun place to work.
I don't know how you would work that here, though.
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