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TripL7
Trad climber
san diego
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hoipolloi- "take it over here..."
They are not climbers/Mtn/outdoor type people that we can relate to on different levels...communicate with.
So you prefer censorship evidently. NOT allowed were I the almighty HOIPOLLI roams and lurks.
Are you going to be offended and so embittered by three (3) words? Three words on the front page..."Favorite Bible Passages?"
How self centered can a person be?
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'Pass the Pitons' Pete
Big Wall climber
like Ontario, Canada, eh?
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Ya know, the first quote in this thread is pretty relevant. Jesus didn't say you HAVE to knock, or seek. He gave you the choice: You can walk past the door, same as you can bypass this thread by knott clicking on it.
Or you can knock. His promise comes to those who choose to seek.
Wow, good thing Christians can live by grace and not by the law! Some pretty nasty stuff back there in the OT!
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TripL7
Trad climber
san diego
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fattrad- "Ezekiel"
You remind me of Samuel L. Jackson's character "Jules"(the hit-man)in Pulp Fiction. "I'm sorry, did I break your concentration?" After he shoots him. LOL!!
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Jaybro
Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
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I thought of using that one Fatty,
but,
"When i became a man, i gave up childish things," 1st corinthians thirteen.
-Me? give up childish things? yeah right.
But I really don't get sh#t like this;
""You shall fear only the Lord your God; and you shall worship Him and swear by His name!" Deuteronomy 6:13.
Why would anyone ever worship the only thing they fear? Does that make any sense, in any way?
Why would anyone have any respect at all, for a bully?
I'm not dissing "God", I'm suggesting that that passage was not thought out, very well, if at all.
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Tobia
Social climber
GA
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Avoiding a fight is a mark of honor; only fools insist on quarreling.
Proverbs 20:1
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Gary
climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
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My favorite is also the most ignored. Go figure.
1Take heed that ye do not your alms before men, to be seen of them: otherwise ye have no reward of your Father which is in heaven.
2Therefore when thou doest thine alms, do not sound a trumpet before thee, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and in the streets, that they may have glory of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward.
3But when thou doest alms, let not thy left hand know what thy right hand doeth:
4That thine alms may be in secret: and thy Father which seeth in secret himself shall reward thee openly.
5And when thou prayest, thou shalt not be as the hypocrites are: for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward.
6But thou, when thou prayest, enter into thy closet, and when thou hast shut thy door, pray to thy Father which is in secret; and thy Father which seeth in secret shall reward thee openly.
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'Pass the Pitons' Pete
Big Wall climber
like Ontario, Canada, eh?
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Jaybro, if you check out the ancient Hebrew from which the word is translated, "fear" is more like "love and revere".
Tobia is right, isn't there something about pearls and swine? ;)
And as for the KJV above, gads Gary, way to make us look preachy and old-fashioned. How about a New International Version instead? Does anyone reading this even know what "alms" are? Sheesh. [Good verses, though, if you can figure out what the hail they mean]
As for the I Cor 13 about giving up childish things, um yeah. My ex-wife used to preach that one to me all the time. Oh well, it's a journey, not a destination, right? I'll be made perfect one day later.
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TripL7
Trad climber
san diego
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Jaybro- "You shall fear only the Lord your God..."
Jay- "Why would they worship the only thing they fear?"
Jay- "Why would anyone have any respect at all, for a bully?"
The word means to revere/respect/adore/fear and admire. It is translated as such from Hebrew.
I can testify to this statement from the bible "To know Him, is to love Him."
This isn't just rote memorising of passages without experience and a relationship over decades to relate to.
On the other hand, many people love their fathers and also fear the consequences of disobeying them. Generally that obedience is called for because it protects, or is best for you. Playing in the street. Or by a river when you can't swim etc.
Likewise with our heavenly Father, He knows what's best for us. Although we would sometimes rather risk certain actions. Like our earthly fathers, we learn there are consequences which, as we grow, we learn to obey.
Jesus quoted this verse one of the three times that Satan tempted Him...
"You shall fear only the Lord your God, and worship only Him..." Deut. 6:13.
God is no bully! He is very wise, patient, and loving.
EDIT: I have a special experience/reason to choose this verse as my favorite!!
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Jaybro
Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
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Thanks you guys, it makes a lot more sense the way you say it. So why leave that translational typo in/ and why quote it that way?
I really wasn't saying that god was a bully, just saying someone needs an editor because as that line was presented, that IS what it's saying!
"An that ain't right!"
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Terry
climber
Spokane
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Resting the temptation to chime in is apparently futile... sigh.
Some people have stated (in this thread and many others) that this is a climbing forum so we should all stick to climbing related threads. Well, the truth is, this is not a climbing forum it is a climbers forum (with a few notable exceptions ie. LEB) and the topics represent what is going on in our lives. I'm sure many resent this, even Chris Mac has vented but his TR & Beta tab is evidence that he has recognized how this site has evolved. But this very diversity is what makes the Taco such a great site. In one thread you get to rub elbows with Legends of the Sport and in the next you're introduced to its greatest Dumbass. As others have said, its a virtual campfire, and everyone gets to sit in.
As for those who reacted violently to the thread I suspect they are threatened by it. I know that I avoid God when I feel guilty.
And lastly, Ghost stated it very well when he said...
The religious folks say "The Holy Bible is the Word of God" They say it over and over and over. But when someone asks the perfectly logical question "Well, what about where the bible says we should [insert bizarre verse about slavery, rape, killing], the answer is "Oh, well, that part doesn't count any more." Which leads to "Well, is it the word of god, or isn't it?" To which no one has a satisfactory answer....with religion it's always the same non-answers when real questions are asked. Totally frustrating.
I agree and I think this occurs for a few reasons.
#1 - People don't try and give real answers because its the Taco and in all my years here I've yet to see someone convinced and change their mind from a thread. It may occur but if it has it has happened anonymously. These arguments just turn into flame wars that lead no where. Ed Hartouni, may be an exception - he rarely has a knee jerk reaction. In other words arguing here really is a waste of time and I'd rather spend my time on other things (and there is the Pearls and Pigs thing)
#2 - many professing Christians don't know the answers to these questions.
#3 - Giving a cogent answer to difficult questions is difficult. But that doesn't mean there isn't an answer. Understanding some passages takes long, honest study and this venue doesn't lend itself to such a discussion
That's my take in brief - fwiw.
Oh, one of my favorite passages -
Romans 13:9 The commandments, "Do not commit adultery," "Do not murder," "Do not steal," "Do not covet," and whatever other commandment there may be, are summed up in this one rule: "Love your neighbor as yourself." 10Love does no harm to its neighbor. Therefore love is the fulfillment of the law.
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TripL7
Trad climber
san diego
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Jaybro- "So why leave that translational typo in, and quote it that way?"
Well, another aspect/angle is to NOT FEAR anything else.
We could paint alot of scenarios in regards to that.
To not fear death, not fear the enemy of our souls/Satan, or not fear what tomorrow may bring...to worry.
"Fear not for I am with you always sayith the Lord."
So, we understand what you are saying, and I had the same questions as a young Christian.
EDIT: In other words, you should not serve anyone else out of fear.
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'Pass the Pitons' Pete
Big Wall climber
like Ontario, Canada, eh?
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Jaybro,
Many biblical scholars - Believers and Non-Believers alike - study ancient Hebrew [the language in which the Old Testament was written] so we can better try to understand what the writers really meant to say. And even regular guys like me and TripL7 have a bit of an idea of what the word really means, and what its root comes from.
I have a study bible that has lots of cool footnotes about language and history that helps you better understand the stuff. Although admittedly some of it is quite baffling.
A lot of people studying to become pastors study ancient Greek [the language the New Testament was written in] to better understand the words and the true meanings. Sometimes in bible studies, we'd all read from different translations, and when you heard it said different ways, you got it better.
Now Gary above seems to like the King James Version, which goes back to the 1600's about the time the Bavarian Purity Act came into being, which is a far more important historical date in my opinion. Reading the King James Version is like reading Shakespeare - it's hard to understand. [What the hell is an alm?]
There are many more recent translations, such as the New International Version that I really like. Not only are these versions in modern easier-to-understand English, but they are also a hella not more accurate in terms of the translation. And if they used a word like "fear" you know there would be a detailed footnote explaining precisely why and what the word really means.
What makes the NIV more accurate than the KJV, besides the better translation, is that far more "scripture remnants" have been found since the KJV was published. Biblical scholars find bits and pieces of scriptures going way back, in church basements and tombs and caves and stuff, and as many of these bits have been found since the 1600's as were known prior to that, and some are much older than what had been known previously. So modern translations have more original texts to go back to.
The most famous remnants are the Dead Sea Scrolls, which were found I think in around 1947. I could look it up, but well, Anders knows why. These scriptural remnants include a very early copy of the book of Isaiah among other things, that predated everything used to write the King James translation. Older remnants are reckoned to me closer to what the original text might have read, since fewer people would have copied it. What is very interesting about the Dead Sea Scrolls is that even though they were so ancient, they were almost word for word perfect compared to later remnants, which is suggestive that translations and copies of this book had been handed down pretty accurately.
So as Paul writes in I Cor 13, right now we see dimly, as though looking through a bad mirror. But one day we'll see it all, and know it all. [The drawback being, you gotta die first] But for us Believers, that's supposed to be a good thing.
Or so I'm told. ;)
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Lost Arrow
Trad climber
The North Ridge of the San Fernando
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A ND seeing the multitudes, he went up into the mountain :
** and when he had sat down, his disciples came unto him :
2 And he opened his mouth and taught them, saying,
3 TI Blessed are the poor in spirit : for theirs is the kingdom
of heaven.
4 If Blessed are they that mourn : for they shall be comforted.
5 If Blessed are the meek : for they shall inherit the earth.
6 If Blessed are they that hunger and thirst after righteous-
ness : for they shall be filled.
7 If Blessed are the merciful : for they shall obtain mercy.
8 TJ Blessed are the pure in heart : for they shall see God.
9 If Blessed are the peacemakers : for they shall be called
sons of God.
10 f Blessed are they that have been persecuted for righteous-
ness' sake : for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
1 1 Blessed are ye when men shall reproach you, and persecute
you, and say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake.
12 Rejoice, and be exceeding glad : for great is your reward
in heaven : for so persecuted they the prophets which were
before you.
13 If Ye are the salt of the earth : but if the salt have lost
its savour, wherewith shall it be salted ? it is thenceforth good
for nothing, but to be cast out and trodden under foot of men.
14 Ye are the light of the world. A city set on a hill cannot
be hid.
15 Neither do men light a lamp, and put it under the bushel,
but on the stand ; and it shineth unto all that are in the house.
1 6 Even so let your light shine before men, that they may
see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven.
1 7 U Think not that I came to destroy the law or the prophets
I came not to destroy, but to fulfil.
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Gary
climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
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And as for the KJV above, gads Gary, way to make us look preachy and old-fashioned. How about a New International Version instead? Does anyone reading this even know what "alms" are? Sheesh. [Good verses, though, if you can figure out what the hail they mean]
It means your faith is between you and your god. Only a jerk shows off and plays holier-than-thou to the crowd.
Or in the words of Buddha:
"Seek your own salvation with diligence."
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TripL7
Trad climber
san diego
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Randisi- "Please he begged, don't do such a wicked thing..."
I found a companion scripture to go along with your favorite one concerning Sodom and Gomorrah. It refers to anyone that has heard about Jesus Christ and His sacrifice for them...like the vast majority of the people in the USA, with a church on every corner and Bibles everywhere...
"And whoever will not receive you nor here you, when you depart from there shake off the dust from under your feet as a testimony to them. Assuredly I say to you, it will be more tolerable for Sodom and Gomorrah in the day of Judgement then for that city." Mark 6:11.
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50
climber
Stumptown
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My favorite from Old King George: "I've been in the Bible every day since I've been the president."—Washington, D.C., Nov. 12, 2008.
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Rob_James
Mountain climber
Aoraki/Mt. Cook Village, New Zealand
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I praise:
"Jesus giveth. And Jesus taketh. Thy name of Jesus is Indian giver." - Mark 20:43?
And
"Have a hap hap happy birthday." - Geronimo 3:12 (or close there to.)
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Klimmer
Mountain climber
San Diego
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It is hard to pick just one really. I mean the whole book is incredible and inspiring, so it is hard to pick only one or a favorite!
But here is a great one. Near the end of The Good Book we read . . .
Rev.21
[1] And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
[2] And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
[3] And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.
[4] And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.
[5] And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.
[6] And he said unto me, It is done. I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely.
[7] He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son.
As bad as it can get here on planet Earth, I have the above promise to keep me going and comfort me. No matter how bad it gets, I believe and I have his promises close to my heart. We have to take care of the Earth, since it is our only home and we are the Earth's stewards. He expects us to do the right thing and to care for his creation.
We are not doing a good job now though.
I look forward to the 1000 years of peace (the millenium) where war is no more and we can finally be the stewards we are supposed to be, with GOD in our midst walking among us, living with us, and showing us the proper way. It will be nice seeing Earth finally cleaned up and cared for properly and using only clean renewable energy resources. The military-industrial-spy complex will be no more. Corporatism will be no more. Corrupt goverments will be no more. The oil cartels will be no more. Earth will be free, and Earth will be one. I would imagine there will be no access issues. You can climb, explore, adventure where ever you like, just leave no trace. Perfection.
You know, I love the physical Earth and Universe that GOD created over time. I don't see how he could do better, but he will, and he will do it again.
A new Universe of first ascent possibilities and all the time in the World to do them. Awesome.
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Chinchen
climber
Anacortes, wa
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F*#k this.
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