Discussion Topic |
|
This thread has been locked |
monolith
climber
albany,ca
|
|
|
Jul 27, 2012 - 09:09pm PT
|
Not difficult to come up with the lists, Jody. Been done by both conservative and liberal US governments. Don't let perfection be the enemy of progress. Do we let citizens have anti-aircraft weapons? Some of the more portable ones are only a little more powerful then some of the bad-ass weapons legal now?
Oops, I guess you are happy with that arbitrary line. Or, maybe not.
If I were in the Aurora audience I'd rather have Holmes using a 22 semi-auto, than the rifle he used.
Hope you are headed out for the weekend as I am. Have a good weekend!
|
|
Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
|
|
|
Jul 27, 2012 - 09:26pm PT
|
Actually the book Backyard Rocketry has plans for constructing a multi-engine heat seeking rocket out of commonly available components.
Hours of fun,... with the kids!
|
|
Ed Hartouni
Trad climber
Livermore, CA
|
|
|
Jul 27, 2012 - 11:44pm PT
|
nice try Jim... perhaps you could riff on "rope gun"
Ron wrote: Could it be, Ed, that you have never been subject to a lethal threat?
which I would have to think about, my guess is that I have, I did live in NYC in the 1970s, which was a nadir for that city... but I never thought I should have to "fight my way" out of a situation... never once thought of owning a gun, in fact, didn't even lock the apt. door... living on the upper west side near Columbia U.
As for hunting, today, 90% of total mamamalian biomass is made up of domesticated animals...
10,000 years ago, it was just 0.1%
so while hunting is totally relevant part of our history, we've seemed to successfully provided for ourselves quite adequately without the need to hunt, and the amount of game seems rather small.
But my point is guns are for killing, people or animals...
that is what they do.
|
|
Ed Hartouni
Trad climber
Livermore, CA
|
|
|
Jul 28, 2012 - 12:14am PT
|
http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/ss6005a1.htm
Firearms
Firearm-related injuries are the second leading mechanism of injury death in the United States (62). Since 2000, approximately 30,000 persons have died each year from firearm-related injuries (63). Firearm-related head injuries are especially lethal; approximately two thirds of these injuries result in death (64). Approximately 75% of intentionally self-inflicted and 40% of firearm-related assault injury deaths result from injuries to the brain (64). Although the rates of firearm-related TBI [traumatic brain injury] deaths decreased during 1997--2007, males continued to have statistically significantly higher rates of death than females. The circumstances of the deaths in these groups might be attributed to homicide, suicide, and unintentional injury or other causes. Identification of the particular groups that are at risk provides opportunities for targeted prevention efforts.
The substantial number of boys aged 10--14 years who died from a TBI-related firearm injury suggests the potential for public health prevention measures. Interventions to reduce the risk for firearm-related deaths or injuries can be behavior oriented (e.g., education regarding safe storage and handling of guns, modification of other identifiable risk factors, and counseling) (65,66), product oriented (e.g., changing the design of firearms or making them more difficult for children or others to use unintentionally or intentionally if stolen or obtained illegally) (67), or policy oriented (e.g., licensing requirements and gun storage laws) (68--70). Because these measures have not been adequately evaluated, it is difficult to know which are the most effective in reducing firearm-related deaths or injuries (71). Continued targeted public health efforts and promotion of safe storage of firearms in households with children or households frequently visited by children is warranted.
Implementation of evidence-based strategies for the primary prevention of violence also is needed to reduce risk for homicide among adolescents and young adults. A substantial amount of research has identified risk factors for violence and weapon carrying and prevention strategies. For example, the Blueprints for Violence Prevention has identified 11 model programs and 19 promising programs that have shown significant, sustained reductions on youth violence or risk factors for youth violence (72). The substantial rate of firearm-related TBI suicide among older adults calls for improved screening for signs and symptoms of suicide, access to mental health care, and prevention strategies designed for this population. In 2004, persons aged ≥65 years comprised 12% of the U.S. population but accounted for 16% of suicide deaths (73). In addition, in 2004, the rate of suicide among persons aged ≥65 years was 14.3 per 100,000 population, compared with 11 per 100,000 in the general population (73). Previously, comorbid conditions including depression, mood disorders, and cancer have been associated with suicide among older adults (74). In addition, older adults who commit suicide are more likely to live in lower per capita income areas than persons in other age groups (75). Strategies that might be implemented to prevent firearm-related TBI suicides among older adults include health policy measures and population-based interventions to improve mental health care access in lower socioeconomic areas (76). An additional strategy to prevent suicidal behavior in all age and racial/ethnic groups includes building and strengthening individual, family, and community connectedness (http://www.cdc.gov/violenceprevention/pdf/suicide_strategic_direction_full_version-a.pdf ).
61. U.S. Census Bureau. Current population reports. Projections of the population of the United States by age, sex, race, and Hispanic origin: 1995--2050 (no. P-25-1130). Washington DC: US Census Bureau; 1996.
62. CDC. Web-based Injury Statistics Query and Reporting System. 10 leading causes of injury. Atlanta, GA: CDC. Available at: http://www.cdc.gov/injury/wisqars/nonfatal.html. Accessed February 23, 2010.
63. CDC. Web-based Injury Statistics Query and Reporting System. Injury mortality reports, 1997--2007. Atlanta, GA; CDC. Available at http://www.cdc.gov/injury/wisqars/fatal.html. Accessed February 23, 2010.
64. Beaman V, Annest JL, Mercy JA, et al. Lethality of firearm-related injuries in the United States population. Ann Emerg Med 2000;35:258--66.
65. Hardy MS. Behavior-oriented approaches to reducing youth gun violence. Future Child 2002;12:100--17.
66. Grossman DC, Cummings P, Koepsell TD et al. Firearm safety counseling in primary care pediatrics: a randomized control trial. Pediatrics 2000;10:22--6.
67. Teret SP, Culross PL. Product-oriented approaches to reducing youth gun violence. Future Child 2002;12:118--31.
68. Loftin C, McDowall D, Wiersema B, Cottey TJ. Effects of restrictive licensing of handguns on homicide and suicide in the District of Columbia. N Engl J Med 1991;325:1615--20.
69. Lampert MT, Silva PS. An update on the impact of gun control legislation on suicide. Psychiatr Q 1998;69:127--34.
70. Cummings P, Grossman DC, Rivara FP, Koepsell TD. State gun safe storage laws and child mortality due to firearms. JAMA 1997;278:1084--6.
71. Hahn RA, Bilukha O, Crosby A, et al. Firearms laws and the reduction of violence: a systematic review. Am J Prev Med 2005;28(2S1):40--71
72. Mihalic S, Irwin K, Elliot D, Fagan A, Hansen D. Blueprints for violence prevention. Washington, DC: US Department of Justice, Office of Justice Programs, Office of Juvenile Justice and Delinquency Prevention; 2001.
73. National Institute of Mental Health. Older adults: depression and suicide facts [fact sheet]. Bethesda, MD: National Institute of Mental Health. Available at http://www.nimh.nih.gov/health/publications/older-adults-depression-and-suicide-facts-fact-sheet/index.shtml. Accessed April 26, 2010.
74. Rockett RH, Wang S, Lian Y, et al. Suicide-associated comorbidity among U.S. males and females: a multiple cause of death analysis. Injury Prev 2007;13:311--5.
75. Purselle DC, Heninger M, Hanzlick R, et al. Differential association of socioeconomic status in ethnic and age-defined suicides. Psychiatry Res 2009;167:258--65.
76. Schmutte T, O'Connell M, Weiland M, et al. Stemming the tide of suicide in older white men: a call to action. Am J Mens Health 2009;3:189--200.
|
|
zBrown
Ice climber
chingadero de chula vista
|
|
|
Jul 28, 2012 - 01:05am PT
|
those stats include legal shootings, self-defense, suicide
Would the world be a better place if some of the so-called gun afficianados would just commit suicide by legally shooting themselves in self-defense.
|
|
Chaz
Trad climber
greater Boss Angeles area
|
|
|
Jul 28, 2012 - 01:18am PT
|
Cars are much more dangerous than guns.
Almost every single person killed by a car was killed by accident.
Most people killed by someone using a gun were killed on purpose, whether it be murder, self defense, or suicide.
Cars are out of control.
|
|
Marlow
Sport climber
OSLO
|
|
|
Jul 28, 2012 - 02:39am PT
|
Weapon discussions the Umerican way end up as admiration for the technicalities of the weapons.
Weapon sellers and the weapon industry are excellent at it. You start with people being killed unnecessarily and end up with admiration for the weapons. The media let military and industrial strategists set the agenda. Ain't it a riff?
[Click to View YouTube Video]
|
|
Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
|
|
|
Jul 28, 2012 - 10:25am PT
|
I bought juice at that store a few days ago.
I remembered that incident as I walked past the spot where it happened.
"You killed my people"????
This kind of stuff happens all the time.
THE NATIONAL MEDIA DOESN'T REPORT IT.
|
|
Chaz
Trad climber
greater Boss Angeles area
|
|
|
Jul 28, 2012 - 11:24am PT
|
"A guy pulled gun on him and told him to drop his weapon or he would shoot him."
In California, that's what's known as Assault With A Deadly Weapon and issuing a Terrorist Threat. Both violent felonies, and both considered "strikes" under California's Three Strikes Law.
If you had just done that, would you be eager to call the cops and confess?
Most of the time when guns are used in self defense, it goes unreported.
|
|
Chaz
Trad climber
greater Boss Angeles area
|
|
|
Jul 28, 2012 - 11:35am PT
|
Is there such a thing as a non assault weapon?
That is to say, a weapon that's impossible to use in an assault. Can you think of one?
|
|
Crimpergirl
Sport climber
Boulder, Colorado!
|
|
|
Jul 28, 2012 - 11:58am PT
|
Skinwalker - how exactly would you count the lives saved? It is very difficult (impossible?) to count things that don't happen.
The chart too - and others like like it - parse out justifiable homicide and other things. It is based on violence. The fact is the increase in violent crime in the early/mid 90s was largely due to firearm violence. And the major decline in crime we've seen since then has been largely due to a drop in firearm violence.
Why are people defensive about that?
|
|
Ed Hartouni
Trad climber
Livermore, CA
|
|
|
Jul 28, 2012 - 12:33pm PT
|
crimper scared skinwalker away?
|
|
Chaz
Trad climber
greater Boss Angeles area
|
|
|
Jul 28, 2012 - 12:35pm PT
|
Scared away "Lady" at the same time.
|
|
Crimpergirl
Sport climber
Boulder, Colorado!
|
|
|
Jul 28, 2012 - 12:38pm PT
|
I didn't realize when I responded to Skinwalker (who I accidentally called Slywalker the first time. Doh), that it was Roxjox.
After I posted here, I saw the LEB note thread, went over there and saw him posting. Clearly it was Rox - he doesn't try to hide it. Looks like he's already whack-a-moled.
edit: Yeah, looks like Lady (LEB) is gone too.
|
|
|
SuperTopo on the Web
|
Let us know!