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'Pass the Pitons' Pete
Big Wall climber
like Ontario, Canada, eh?
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Just so you guys know, Ammon's partner's name is Kait Barber, and it's spelled thus. She is a sweetie and so is her mom [apparently our only live reporter!], but there is only one Princess of the El Cap Bridge. ;)
When I saw Ammon recently, I asked him about enhancements - any enhancements, micro or otherwise - on the first few pitches he had climbed, and he told me he couldn't see any. I couldn't see any, either, when I was up there a few years ago, and I was specifically looking for them. It would appear that Mark and Richard did a very precise job in their enhancing/cheating/creating, and did it precisely as explained in the "WoS Confessions" post here:
http://www.supertopo.com/climbing/thread.php?topic_id=963934&tn=0&mr=0
I doubt Ammon will report "great" climbing, but I know he will report hard climbing. The absence of a complete second ascent appears to be mostly a function of how difficult the climbing is, and how "samey" the climbing is with long hard runouts and multiple falls required to piece together the hooking sequence.
I really loved Hummermachine's selections of previous posts, and laughed out loud at some of the stuff I and others wrote! The whole Wings of Steel story - right from the beginning - has been amazingly captivating to me. I think I might try to write up something of a recap - it's been interesting how many myths have so far been debunked, yet how many continue to remain. The personalities are so powerful, along with the stands that certain individuals have taken [rigid, unyielding] while others' minds have appeared more open.
But I think at the heart of the matter - and the reason Wings of Steel is so fascinating to all of us - is not necessarily the climb itself, but rather the way Mark Smith and Richard Jensen have been treated over the years, and the slow but gradual realization that perhaps they are not the villains they were once made out to be.
When someone puts up a first ascent on El Cap, the route gets repeated, and on this particular crag, pretty much every route is good - El Cap climbing is really that superb. You don't hear people say "such and such a route on El Cap is crap". In fact, I've never heard that said. I can tell you I disliked NA Wall because of its traversing or SOH because of its chimneys, but it doesn't mean I'm dissing the routes. There are plenty of people here who believe those are two of the finest routes on El Cap, even though they are among my least favourites.
So first ascensionists come and put up a route, and then go on their way, and for the most part, the route they put up is a small portion of their lives. It's something on their resume. But Wings of Steel was far far more than that for Mark and Richard - it very much became a DEFINING point in their lives. Not THE defining moment, because by all accounts they lead rich lives with loving families and successful careers, but certainly a very significant moment.
And this significance was not of their own seeking. What happened to Richard Jensen and Mark Smith was arguably the most vicious character assault in the history of climbing! It began on the wall with the chopping of their route and the sh|tting upon of their ropes, continued with open hostility from some of the "in crowd" of Valley Locals, went on to include snide guidebook entries and libellous big wall textbook references, and extends into internet forums to this day. I'm surprised they never got beat up.
Has there ever been a climber who was so maligned as Mark and Richard? Has any other climber ever been assaulted with the unending libel and slander that Mark and Richard have had to endure? I'm trying hard to think of someone, but nobody comes to mind. [Help me out here, eh?] And the attacks weren't confined merely to the route, but rather to the identities, characters, and credibility of the first ascensionists themselves. It was something that followed them around wherever they went, especially within the climbing community and to a lesser degree outside of it too, and had far reaching implications in their lives beyond El Capitan.
Since climbing Wings of Steel, Mark and Richard spent a quarter-century trying to simply be understood, and were pretty much shut down on all fronts. They wrote magazine articles, which were either rejected, disbelieved, or unnoticed. They wrote a book, but their detractors accused them of seeking fame or adulation. They talked to other climbers, but nothing really seemed to work. When I began regularly climbing El Cap in 1995, I too believed the lies, assuming that the two of them were mad bolters who had done a botch job on El Cap and had thus been run out of the Valley on a rail, never daring to show their faces here again.
It really wasn't until they were heard and begun to be understood here on McTopo five and a half years ago that the tide began to slowly turn in their favour. They and their route may never achieve "acceptance", but they are at least on their way to being "understood".
I very much look forward to hearing Kait and Ammon's feedback from the route, and wish them continuing success!
Cheers, eh?
Pete Zabrok
Ontario, Canada
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#1SuperMama
Social climber
Oakdale, Ca
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From Ammon and Kait this A.M.:
"Pitch 5 the real deal - heads up scary!
No bolts or rivet ladders so far.
We see no evidence that anyone has come past the anchor at pitch 4, due to no bail slings."
And this mama has no clue what any of the above means - hahaha
But they assured me you all do.
So onwards and upwards pitch six they will begin soon.
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bergbryce
Mountain climber
South Lake Tahoe, CA
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THANK YOU for the update!!
OP, please do not nuke this thread.
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Burt
Big Wall climber
Las Vegas, Nv
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god I have been sucked in...
Pete, for once you make perfect sense. I agree whole heartily with what you just wrote. Thank you.
Ammon and Kait, good on you guys, hope all is well up there! Finally someone decides to shut up the masses and just go do it. Ego aside and climb the climb for what it is... a climb.
My question is why attack these two? Yes we have heard the argument about the Bird but what about the others? What about Jim Beyer while doing the Martyrs Brigade route and chopping parts of other routes and booby Trapping others? Why is Eric Sloan not ran out of the Valley for drilling on classic routes? The list could go on... these are guys that are affecting other routes, not doing first ascents. Just seems weak sauce in my book.
For those who have done an FA bigwall most will do whatever they can to produce a climb that you are proud of when finished. It becomes your "baby" of sorts, but as the FA team they are the captain of their own ship and leave behind a small legacy of the type of climber that they where. Steve G. along with Mr. Cole left behind routes with min drilling, hard free climbing, and boldness. The WOS guys left behind a few routes that climbed the great slab and still as of today remained unrepeated! That to me says something way more then "the Sea" or "Jolly Roger" this climb has had attempts by some of the strongest wall climbers and turned them all back... So bravo Richard and Mark looks like a wonderful route that has stood the test of time. I believe in the benefit of the doubt, I hope your motives were pure up there and soon if Ammon and Kait send we will know the truth. If that happens I hope that Mr. Steve G. can look past his own ego and write up a reply to the boys. Apology I think it is called these days, which in my opinion would be the boldest and raddest move done to date.
Kurt Burt
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Tarz
Mountain climber
Calli
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Rock on daughter! Ammon and you are kicking some butt up there! Pete: You are right ..Kait is a sweetie but she's a tough sweetie. you're right about Annie too! Thanks for the support!
Pops
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Floyd Hayes
Trad climber
Hidden Valley Lake, CA
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I've enjoyed lurking on the WoS threads for years without ever commenting, so this is my first. The comments of 'Pass the Pitons' Pete--who I have never met (I'm a small wall climber)--have always struck me as being the most reasonable, rational and cool-headed of anybody commenting on these threads. Thanks, Pete, whoever you are! The more I read about this controversy, the more I respect the achievements of Richard and Mark. In my mind the reputation of WoS has been enhanced more by Richard and Mark's critics than by anything they are alleged to have done wrong.
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Studly
Trad climber
WA
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Well said Pete! Pete has spent more time on El Cap then just about anyone, except maybe Chris mac. Pete's a super nice guy in person, generous with his wisdom and advice on big wall gear and stuff. Respect!
Go Ammon and Kait, Rock it!!!
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Tarz
Mountain climber
Calli
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I might head up there Sunday for a looksee. Pics will be forthcoming. I don't have a ELCAPPICS lens, but a decent one.
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TwistedCrank
climber
Ideeho-dee-do-dah-day boom-chicka-boom-chicka-boom
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I would suggest that there have been many more climbers that have been more maligned than Richard and Mark. Most of them were from the alpine zone or flaunted their lycra though.
Pff. Outside Mag or Nat Geo Adventure never got glossy on their character assassinations.
Nonetheless, in the microcosm of weirdness that is the valley - especially in the post-Stonemaster twilight, those guys are right up there. WOS stands as a testiment to their singularity.
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Slakkey
Big Wall climber
From Back to Big Wall Baby
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Well said Pete,
And I do know Pete personally and although I do give him a bit of crap now and then he is a good guy and unlike many others here he takes it in stride:) He is in the Valley every spring and every fall which is more than a lot of other people.
Climbing is more about ones personal journey or challenge. WoS was Richards and Marks personal journey and Challenge now it will be Ammons and kaits. Climbers walk by the base of that route every spring and fall. Some may take notice and some may not. Good climbs surround it that have seen many ascents . IMO more interesting routes than WoS but like Pete said a route that may appeal to one may not to another.
Go Ammon and kait
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Gerg
Boulder climber
Calgary
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The amount of text written about this could publish a WOS book #2. I have not read the first** book, but I am so intrigued to get a copy now. Not Christian so I hope that part is not too heavy, but from what i have skimmed over 652 posts(growing every hour)we could all do with some spiritual insight. I agree with Pass Piton Pete's words, well said.
**2nd ascentionists should write book #2.
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Karl Baba
Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
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My question is why attack these two ?
The valley was traditionally unkind to "outsiders" back in the day. Particularly ones not climbing like the status quo.
Skinner, Jardine, and the WOS crew. They did it different. Some of their acts are still being condemned while many innovations are not standard practice
Peace
Karl
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Mighty Hiker
climber
Vancouver, B.C.
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The occasional clannish hostility to outsiders in Yosemite goes back to well before Wings of Steel, certainly to Dihedral Wall in 1962. A lot may have to do with insecurity, that is that "outsiders" would show up and prove themselves every bit as good climbers as those in Yosemite, who promoted themselves and their techniques as leading edge. Some to do with personalities - small groups always have difficulty accepting new members. And a lot to do with adolescent testosterone loaded behaviour.
Ultimately, neither side is right. Right through the 1960s and 1970s, outside climbers appeared in the Valley and did quickly make a mark. Baldwin and Cooper with Dihedral Wall in 1962, Jim Madsen, Kim Schmitz and Mead Hargis in the late 1960s (plus Neil Bennett, Gordie Smaill and that wave of Canadians), then in the early 1970s Charlie Porter, Jimmie Dunn, Steve Sutton, Hugh Burton and other Canadians, and in the later 1970s Eric Weinstein, Daryl Hatten, and Peter Croft. (And others - sorry, easier to remember the Canadians.) Some culturally fitted in, some didn't. Some were poorly treated, usually for specious reasons. (Dihedral Wall may have been a step back in style, given use of fixed ropes, but its steepness, difficulty and lack of ledges justified it. Likewise WoS seems sui generis, and the fact that it's unrepeated after 30 years, and inspires respect in those few with actual knowledge of the route and its difficulty, speaks for itself.) Most were as competent as the "natives".
There's also some possessive, territorial behaviour underneath it all.
I doubt that WoS will ever be popular, whatever may actually have been done (or not) to climb it. It's one of a kind.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Don't overlook Kroger's and Davis' commando plum heist. They didn't want
to get 'embroiled'.
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'Pass the Pitons' Pete
Big Wall climber
like Ontario, Canada, eh?
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Wow! Thanks, Annie. If Ammon says that pitch 5 is the Real Deal and is heads up scary, then that has got to be one pretty darn hard pitch indeed! Ammon has climbed some of the hardest routes on El Cap, and climbed some of them in a push. So if he says it's hard...
Dang. Sweaty hands again. Could the fifth pitch be harder than the first two? Or as hard?
It's especially great to see Kait's family responding! Welcome aboard, Tarz! Grab your vine and swing on up there, dude - us Cubical Pukes are dying for some pix! And we still await the arrival on this thread of that reprobate pirate first mate, Gabe.
Fatty, you are right. Caesar Maestri was more maligned than Richard and Mark. However it would appear that he deserved it, because all evidence indicates he did knott reach the summit of Cerro Torre - ever - but that he lied and said he did. Here on Wings of Steel, the more hard evidence that comes to light, the more corroboration we have that Mark and Richard didn't lie about anything.
Vindication is a journey not a destination, but we are making significant inroads here now.
Thank you for your kind comments, and especially your thoughtful input and analysis. I never thought of myself as an historian, philospher or psychologist, but this whole Wings of Steel story captivates me like none other. I need to do some more writing.
I love to root for the underdog, the maligned, and the downtrodden. I like to see the truth revealed as best as possible as objectively as possible. I like to see the goat horns chopped, and I especially love to see credibility restored where previously stolen.
Someone get up there with a damn camera, will ya?! This is history in the making. Randy, where the heck are you? Tarz, can you get there any sooner? Nanook - throw the kid in your backpack and take a run down there! Bullwinkle - you've got a camera, don't you?
Go go Ammon and Kait!
Cheers,
Pete
P.S. Studly, I have indeed spent more time on the side of El Cap than anyone - 463 nights not counting base and summit bivis. I've done more routes than Chris Mac [43 different ones] although he has made more ascents of El Cap than me. Ammon has climbed over 50 different routes, everything from single day pushes on hard and dangerous nailups to multi-day big wall camping expeditions, which is more along my style. Erik E. and Steve Gerberding remain out front, both of them pushing sixty different routes. All three of those guys are moving targets, but I remain tenacious ... for a Big Wall Parvenu. And speaking of upstarts, Nanook and Steve Schneider are nippin' at me 'eels knocking on around forty different routes.
P.P.S. Annie - please ask if they have seen any signs of enhanced or chipped placements, or any holes. Have they replaced any more of the existing fixed anchors like we did on the first two pitches, or just gone for it with the existing bolts and Z-mac rivets from the first ascent party? Also, any more whippers [falls], and if so how many and how long? Thanks again for your reports!
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hollyclimber
Big Wall climber
Yosemite, CA
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I can say this - Ammon's screaming up there is IN-tense. We were up doing some climbing in that zone on Wednesday. Knarly.
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'Pass the Pitons' Pete
Big Wall climber
like Ontario, Canada, eh?
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It must be all the A3. He never screams on A2.
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Prod
Trad climber
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Where'd Mimi go?
This thread needs conflict.
Prod.
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Prod
Trad climber
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The best WoS question that I was just reminded about was from Russ.
Something along the lines of....
If you were required to micro enhance, then is the SA required to also do this? If so, how are they supposed to know where to do this?
Prod.
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