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badreligion
Trad climber
Barcelona
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Jan 22, 2013 - 10:02am PT
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A litle respect David is Catalan the same land that Silvia Vidal one of the best ... May be the route is not correct but Richard didnt act like a climber he looks like a american marine !!
In our land aid climbing is still alive and there is a sauvage and traditional methods that in yosemite can increase the grade etc ok no matter just the way he made this was very bad .
Richard say in 2009 " American team will know the Truth about this route " thatīs explains hismentality like tea party ...
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Da_Dweeb
climber
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Jan 22, 2013 - 10:40am PT
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Rivet hanger
Trad climber
Barcelona
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"notreallyanaidclimber" it's a great name for you and Jensen!
The problem with the American high inbred coefficient aid climbing community is that do not even know what a wood wedge or a lead head is, some basic things that in Europe has been used for years because in addition of granite, here we also do climb on soft rocks like conglomerate, sandstone or limestone. Perhaps the "new wave" stopped in the late 70's?
That's why all of you and God Jensen keeps thinking that FA drilled so many holes and even lifted up a saw to cut the wood when they just placed lead or wood+piton in natural holes! But instead of asking first, Jensen turned the route into a bolt ladder on the pretext of "if you drill, you fill", when they didn't really drilled. My God, the same "person" that in Wings of Steel drilled more than 150 batholes! A great example of coherence for the next generations (have a look at Ammon's report on Rock&Ice #198 december 2011)! Or maybe it was just pure blind rage against foreign climbers...
And in addition, a lot of Catalan climbers come every summer to repeat hard aid routes like Sea of Dreams or Zenyatta Mondatta in Yosemite, including Pelut. Perhaps you should come to Europe to climb and learn some other tactics...
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Yes, learn new and valuable tactics like placements 70 or even 80 cm apart! Up yer game!
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Big Mike
Trad climber
BC
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What is it about wood wedges you guys don't get. They aren't sustainable, neither is trenching. These tactics are not acceptable in North America. We don't come to Spain and tell you guys how to treat your rock, so why don't you give us the same respect and go home if you're not willing to play by our rules! Artificially manufactured danger is just that. Artificial!
Go climb a building!
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Rivet hanger
Trad climber
Barcelona
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Wood wedges are not sustainable? My god!
If you fill a hole with wood and then place a piton, that's not a sustainable tactic? The wood can be removed without difficulty...
If you fill a little hole with lead wich has a little wire, isn't sustainable tactic? The lead can be removed with ease...
Wow, here in Europe are widely used. Come to Spain and France and you'll see!
Or is just a problem of fear? Because hanging on a ladder of leads is not the same that hanging on a ladder of rivets...
I begin to understand a lot of things! My god, my god, my god!
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j-tree
Big Wall climber
Classroom to crag to summer camp
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What do you do when you realize that you couldn't be a better troll than RH even if you tried?
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Big Mike
Trad climber
BC
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No wood wedges aren't sustainable because each time you place and remove it, especially in a mud infested place like the fishers, you damage the rock, requiring a bigger piece of wood. Pretty soon you're bringing 2x4's up with you.
I don't think you really understand how fragile the "rock" is. It's not even really rock. More like petrified mud or to use a term that you might understand, really old wet dirt.
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Rivet hanger
Trad climber
Barcelona
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DON'T TRY IT IN THE USE, THESE ARE NOT SUSTAINABLE TACTICS!
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Rivet hanger
Trad climber
Barcelona
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And then, beaks do not damage the rock? Obviously the mud can resist better against iron than against wood...
And what's up with coppers and aluma heads? They can be used in the Towers as they are sometimes used (even for the same Jensen)?
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Lead, yeah, that's good for the environment.
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TwistedCrank
climber
Dingleberry Gulch, Ideeho
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I mean really. Who fukking cares?
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raymond phule
climber
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when they just placed lead or wood+piton in natural holes!
Cool! They found a completely natural line of perfect holes spaced a convenient distance apart.
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raymond phule
climber
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aid routes like Sea of Dreams or Zenyatta Mondatta in Yosemite, including Pelut.
When did Pelut climb in Yosemite? Which routes did he climb?
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Paul Brennan
Trad climber
Ireland
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This still alive? At least its climbing related. Interesting to see wall climbers bashing each other, and non aid climbers bashing certain aid techniques. I think what's needed is an impartial party, with no cloud of controversy hanging over them (not offering judgment on you Richard, just an observation) to do the 3rd ascent and report back to clarify what's going on up there. Or that Spanish guy could go to Yosemite and do the 2nd ascent of some Klaus route. There must be some unrepeated ones. It wouldn't definitively prove anything, but would strengthen his case.
In reference to all the vaunted aid horror shows of europe, where are they? I might have to move back to Ireland soon, but don't want to give up wall climbing. Information on interesting European walls would be appreciated.
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crunch
Social climber
CO
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Hey Rivet Hanger
Lead used like this:
What is this called?
Is this called plomo?
And pitons and wedges in holes:
What is this called?
is this called empotradura?
Thanks!
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BASE1361
climber
Yosemite Valley National Park
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American high inbred coefficient aid climbing community
Can you please give us this equation? And how are you calculating your coefficient? Please take into account striking a beak 69 times and beating it into submission will change your calculation.
And when you run the numbers for this rather complicated problem you've discovered please also take into account gear placements every 6cm(Spanish standard) vs. every 2-3 meters (USA standard)
would be a factor.
Spanish rating A6
Yosemite rating A1 bolt ladder.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Don't worry Klaus, he wouldn't be able to follow one of your routes as they aren't an unbroken line of holes.
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notreallyanaidclimber
Trad climber
CO
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Rivet Hanger,
ahora eres tu quien peca de xenophobo. antes que nada no soy Americano, y para que quede claro no estoy de acuerdo con lo que hizo Jensen, y si los Fisher fueran mi tierra ya hubiese quitado los parabolts y rivets que el coloco.
My questions seemed valid ones and were very respectful.
I simply want to understand if this "issue" is the result of a significantly different approach to aid climbing ethics between the North American and Spanish communities, or if Pelut is an independent thinker that has invented his own ethic. I think this would be good to know.
so here are my questions again:
 Are "hole counts" not kept during ascents in Villanova, Montrebey, Montserrat and aid climbing routes in general?
Can you use chisel and hammer to enhance placements at wish in those places?
is the concept "if you drill it, fill it" new to Spanish aid climbers?
is the concept that "a hole is a hole is a hole" new to Spanish aid climbers?
This questions are not meant to be critical. I am asking out of curiosity. I have "trad" climbed a fair bit in Spain (Roca Regina, Terradets, Villanoba, Montebei -solo en Aragon-, Puig Campana, Ordesa, Pedriza, Riglos, etc, etc) but have never done any aid climbing.
Obviously wooden wedges are very useful in many kinds of rock. In the Dolomites they have been used since the first pitons were made, and are still very much in use today. I certainly don't argue their value, they are obviously a crucial tool, but my questions are completely unrelated to wooden wedges and their validity.
cheers
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