Coordinated attacks ongoing in France

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The Chief

climber
Down the hill & across the Valley from......
Nov 16, 2015 - 07:17pm PT



there is a new nickname called “DAESH” gaining prominence in recent months… and the Muslim terrorist group hates it.

Just as Hornets hate being sprayed with water from a squirt gun.


Oh my bad, this NEW Obama Administrations strategy will end their plight/caliphate. Yup, that it'll surely do it. It's the new secret weapon.

Tell that to the French "Kids" that were slaughtered last Friday eve. Or all them Russians that got blown outta the sky over the Sinai Peninsula. Or them innocent Kids that were blown to shet in Beirut..or....
mtnyoung

Trad climber
Twain Harte, California
Nov 16, 2015 - 07:18pm PT


No other major worldwide religion makes subjugation or annihilation of the non believer a core principal like Islam.


I agree that, nowadays no other religions make such subjugation a core principle. And some Islam does do that. Yes, It's a problem.

I'm sure that you're familiar though with the history of Christianity up to a few hundred years ago. Don't act like this phase of Islam, now, is an anomaly in human history.




Time to quit being politically correct about this and call it what it is. Saying it's just like all of the other religions is what's simplistic.


Misquoting others is simplistic. Please point out to me where I said that "it's just like all of the other religions." I didn't say that. Not even close.

In all honesty I have no use at all of any organized religion. I try not to get abusive toward others because of these views (and I actually have a few Christian friends who I respect in their beliefs - because they actually live what they believe).

Parts of Islam have a problem. For example, as I implied above, we shouldn't have "allies" that encourage and allow such a hateful version of Islam to be hammered into people's heads.

But, back to the point, lumping all of Islam into one pot - and that's what you did above - is simplistic and dumb. Acting by rote, based on emotion, where facts matter and thing aren't black and white (pun intended) - and your predictable, knee jerk reactions are almost always just that - is simplistic and dumb.

The Rush Limbaugh "solution" isn't always right, TGT. Stop being his parrot. Think for yourself.



Brokedownclimber

Trad climber
Douglas, WY
Nov 16, 2015 - 07:19pm PT
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
zBrown--

Yeah, and the 8th Air Force along with the British Bomber Command reduced Germany to a pile of rubble. Is that the take home message contained in the above irrelevant post?
The Chief

climber
Down the hill & across the Valley from......
Nov 16, 2015 - 07:22pm PT
Mtnyoung telling TGT to ....

Stop being his parrot.



RFLMAO!


For example, as I implied above, we shouldn't have "allies" that encourage and allow such a hateful version of Islam to be hammered into people's heads.

We don't need to even go that far Mtnyoung, ISIS/ISIL/DEASH etc is doing a grand job of doing that on their own.

Brokedownclimber

Trad climber
Douglas, WY
Nov 16, 2015 - 07:27pm PT
Re: TGT's post about a religion that attempts to subjugate and convert by the sword: Islam has been that way since the 7th Century and it's inception. The phenomenon of the Crusades was a reaction against Islam and the occupation of the Jewish and Christian Holy places.
zBrown

Ice climber
Nov 16, 2015 - 07:29pm PT
BrokedoaSKwnclimber

Ask TGT

Mein Kampf, Lenin or Mao's tomes and the Koran and the Hadiths, you don't need to be an expert scholar on them, just have a passing familiarity to predict what's in store.

In case you haven't noticed, this entire thread is irrelevant.

TomCochrane

Trad climber
Santa Cruz Mountains and Monterey Bay
Nov 16, 2015 - 07:32pm PT
Washington Refines Its False Flag Operations

Paul Craig Roberts

Washington and its French vassal have refined how they conduct their false flag operations. With the Charlie Hebdo operation, they knew to immediately set the story in stone in order to avoid any questions from the print and TV media and in order to use the set story to take the place of an investigation.

The set story made it unnecessary to explain the mysterious “suicide” of one of the main police investigators while engaged in the investigation of the event. The set story also made it unnecessary to explain why it was necessary to kill rather than capture the alleged perpetrators, or to explain how the French authorities could be so wrong about the alleged get-away-driver but not about the two gunmen. There has been no explanation why the authorities believed there was a get-away-driver, and no such driver has been captured or killed. Indeed, there are many unanswered questions of no interest to any media except the alternative Internet media.

What the US and France learned from the Charlie Hebdo skepticism on the Internet is to keep the story flowing. Charlie Hebdo involved two scenes of violence, and the connection between the two acts of terrorism was vague. This time there were several scenes of violence, and they were better connected in the story.

More importantly, the story was followed quickly by more drama, such as the pursuit of a suspected perpetrator into Belgium, a French bombing attack on the Islamic State, a French aircraft carrier sent to the Middle East, a declaration of war by the French President against ISIL, and speculation that Hollande, pressured by Washington, will invoke NATO’s Article V, which will pull NATO into an invasion of the Islamic State. By superceding each event with a new one, the public’s attention is shifted away from the attack itself and the interests served by the attack. Already the attack itself is old news. The public’s attention has been led elsewhere. How soon will NATO have boots on the ground?

The Western media has avoided many interesting aspects of the Paris attacks. For example, what did the directors of the CIA and French intelligence discuss at their meeting a few days prior to the Paris attacks. Why were fake passports used to identify attackers? Why did the attacks occur on the same day as a multi-site simulation of a terrorist attack involving first responders, police, emergency services and medical personnel? Why has there been no media investigation of the report that French police were blinded by a sophisticated cyber attack on their mobile data tracking system? Does anyone really believe that ISIL has such capability?

The Western media serves merely as an amplifier of the government’s propaganda. Even the non-Western media follows this pattern because of the titillating effect. It is a good story for the media, and it requires no effort.

Initially even the Russian media served to trumpet the set story that rescues the Western political establishment from political defeat at home and Russian defeat in Syria. But it wasn’t too long before some of the Russian media remembered numerous false stories about a Russian invasion of Ukraine, about Assad’s use of chemical weapons, about US ABMs being placed on Russia’s borders to protect Europe from nonexistent Iranian nuclear ICBMs. And so on.

Russian media began asking questions and received some good answers from Gearoid O Colmain: https://m.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=215&ebc=ANyPxKqr8P2sln2JowUb7OtE9x-Uh73wTzgr_ROE6eJC640x6hFGrOs879tSr41gemYrY56XDSeGT0VlU_SSs6lWIcYel6SrWw&v=L7GAbVhjTSw

To understand the Paris attacks, it helps to begin with the question: “What is ISIL?” Apparently, ISIL is a creation of the CIA or some deep-state organization shielded by the CIA’s operations department. ISIL seems to have been used to overthrow Quadaffi in Libya and then sent to overthrow Assad in Syria. One would think that ISIL would be throughly infiltrated by the CIA, Mossad, British and French intelligence. Perhaps ISIL is discovering that it is an independent power and is substituting an agenda of its own for Washington’s, but ISIL still appears to be at least partially dependent on support, active or passive, from Washington.

ISIL is a new group that suddenly appeared. ISIL is portrayed as barbaric knife-wielding fanatics from medieval times. How did such a group so quickly acquire such extensive global capability as to blow a Russian airliner out of Egyptian skies, conduct bombings in Lebanon and Turkey, outwit French intelligence and conduct successful multi-prong attacks in Paris? How come ISIL never attacks Israel?

The next question is: “How does the Paris attack benefit ISIL?” Is it a benefit to ISIL to have Europe’s borders closed, thus halting ISIL’s ability to infiltrate Europe as refugees? Does it help ISIL to provoke French bombing of ISIL positions in the Middle East and to bring upon itself a NATO invasion?

Who does benefit? Clearly, the European and American political establishment in so many ways. Establishment political parties in France, Germany, and the UK are in trouble, because they enabled Washington’s Middle East wars that are bringing floods of refugees into Europe. Pegida is rising in Germany, Farage’s Independent Party in the UK, and Marine Le Pen’s National Front in France. Indeed, a recent poll showed Marine Le Pen in the lead as the next president of France.

The Paris attack takes the issue and the initiative away from these dissident political parties. Among the first words out of the mouth of the French president in response to the attack was his declaration that the borders of France are closed. Already Merkel’s political allies in Germany are pushing her government in that direction. “Paris changes everything,” they declare. It certainly saved the European political establishment from defeat and loss of power.

The same result occurred in the US. Outsiders Donald Trump and Bernie Sanders were slaughtering the establishment’s presidential candidates. Trump and Sanders had the momentum. But “Paris changes everything.” Trump and Sanders are now sidelined, out of the news. The momentum is lost. The story has changed. “Paris attacks become focus of 2016 race,” declares CNN: http://www.cnn.com/2015/11/16/politics/paris-attacks-isis-2016-reaction/index.html

Also among the early words from the French president, and without any evidence in support, was Hollande’s declaration that the Islamic State had attacked the French nation. Obviously, it is set for Hollande to invoke NATO’s Article V, which would send a NATO invasion force into Syria. This would be Washington’s way of countering the Russian initiative that has saved the Assad government from defeat by the Islamic State. The NATO invasion would overthrow Assad as part of the war against the Islamic State.

The Russian government did not immediately recognize this threat. The Russian government saw in the Paris attack the opportunity to gain Western cooperation in the fight against ISIL. The Russian line has been that we must all fight ISIL together.

The Russian presence, although highly effective, is small in Syria. What does the Russian government do when its policy in Syria is crowded by a NATO invasion?

The only benefactor of the Paris attack is the Western political establishment and Washington’s goal of unseating Assad in Syria. The Paris attack has removed the threat to the French, German, and British political establishments from the National Front, Pegida, and the UK Independence Party. The Paris attack has removed the threat to the US political establishment from Trump and Sanders. The Paris attack has advanced Washington’s goal of removing Assad from power.

The answer to the Roman question, “cui bono,” is clear.

But don’t expect to hear it from the Western media.

http://www.paulcraigroberts.org/2015/11/16/washington-refines-its-false-flag-operations-paul-craig-roberts/
mtnyoung

Trad climber
Twain Harte, California
Nov 16, 2015 - 07:32pm PT


The phenomenon of the Crusades was a reaction against Islam and the occupation of the Jewish and Christian Holy places.


Brokendownclimber, I'm not sure if you're excusing Christianity its various historic barbarisms by saying that they were only a reaction to Islamic conquest?

Don't you agree though that it was a lot more complex than that. Both religions (maybe all religions) have/have had enough evil people and actions to fill books (many books). Christianity had it's share of evil in the 600 years before the advent of islam.

The Chief

climber
Down the hill & across the Valley from......
Nov 16, 2015 - 07:37pm PT
How come ISIL never attacks Israel?


Gee, I wonder why?



Christianity had it's share of evil in the 600 years before the advent of islam.

NO where near the evil that the Roman Empire, basically spiritless presented onto the world prior them. Or....
mtnyoung

Trad climber
Twain Harte, California
Nov 16, 2015 - 07:37pm PT

We don't need to, ISIS/ISIL/DEASH etc is doing a grand job of doing that on their own.

The Chief. You too. Think for yourself.

Should we have allies like Saudi Arabia? They've brainwashed thousands (millions is more like it). Brainwashed them into being unthinking, hating, bigoted as#@&%es. In the name of religion. And (probably and primarily) all to stay in power.

If you are capable of it The Chief, could you give me a short answer please: should the U.S. consider itself "allied" with Saudi Arabia? (Obviously, I've got my doubts.)

The Chief

climber
Down the hill & across the Valley from......
Nov 16, 2015 - 07:43pm PT
Oh I see.. we should dump the Saudi's then shake hands and welcome the Iranians into our hearts.

Perfect.
mtnyoung

Trad climber
Twain Harte, California
Nov 16, 2015 - 07:45pm PT

NO where near the evil that the Roman Empire, basically spiritless presented onto the world prior them.

That's possibly true The Chief.

But how's it relevant to my comment to brokendownclimber?

And Goddammit, would you just start a new post if you've got something addtional to say please. Your constant post-editing makes it impossible to read the thread.

Brokedownclimber

Trad climber
Douglas, WY
Nov 16, 2015 - 07:45pm PT
The key point is extreme religious fundamentalism has severe unintended consequences. The Crusades were the unintended consequence of Islamic conversion by the sword; the Spanish Inquisition was in response to Marrano Judaism (secret Jews, pretending to be Christians) in Spain; Oliver Cromwell and his roundheads rebelling against the Church of England in extreme Puritanism... The list is long, but at least Christianity has moved on from barbaric practices that still prevail in Islam. Female genital mutilation is still widespread along with hatred of both Christianity and Judaism...
mtnyoung

Trad climber
Twain Harte, California
Nov 16, 2015 - 07:49pm PT

Oh I see.. we should dump the Saudi's then shake hands and welcome the Iranians into our hearts.

Perfect.


I didn't say that. But I am open minded to the idea that our natural allies in the area (if we can get past the habitual "death to America" bullshit) might be the Iranians. Other than oil, what do we have in common with the Saudis?

And, other than jumping to conclusions, you didn't answer my serious question. The Chief, should the U.S. be allied to Saudi Arabia. I'm honestly interested in your opinion.

And, second/related question - do you agree with me that Saudi whabism (which is misspelled, but I'm not going to look it up) is a major, major source of evil?
The Chief

climber
Down the hill & across the Valley from......
Nov 16, 2015 - 07:49pm PT
That's possibly true The Chief.

Possibly?

How about the Greeks and Persians and Egyptians and the... all prior to them.



This shet has been going on since Man first stood up, grabbed his first club and decided to take over some other dudes fire and dead rabbit.
WBraun

climber
Nov 16, 2015 - 07:49pm PT
You all have been 0wned.

Just look at your $1 bill and credit card and there's your terrorists .....
mtnyoung

Trad climber
Twain Harte, California
Nov 16, 2015 - 07:52pm PT
And, not that you asked The Chief, but my first choice is that we (the U.S.) have no real allies in the Middle East other than Israel (and strong support for them).

Make ourselves energy independent as a nation as quickly as we can and then leave the whole area to fend for itself. Out. Gone.

(Or let the Chinese police the area if they need the oil).
McHale's Navy

Trad climber
From Panorama City, CA
Nov 16, 2015 - 07:52pm PT
Time to start nuking those motherf*#kers
Seriously

Why didn't we nuke them (bomb them) when they first went into the munitions storehouses in Mosul when all of this first started? We could have at least easily destroyed those weapons.
rottingjohnny

Sport climber
Shetville , North of Los Angeles
Nov 16, 2015 - 07:54pm PT
My last dollar bill went to the organ grinder and i ended up doing the monkey's dance...
mtnyoung

Trad climber
Twain Harte, California
Nov 16, 2015 - 07:54pm PT
Sure, sure, The Chief, humankind has a vicious side. Always has and always will.

It's why we need warriors. Unfortunate but true.

But, please, answer my question about Saudi Arabia.
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