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rick sumner
Trad climber
reno, nevada/ wasilla alaska
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Pretty obvious Derek. Communism, or more precisely an aritocratic semi dictatorship under the cloak of communism. First the politicians try to peacefully have the citizens give up their freedoms, one by one, in the interest of safety, security, equal opportunity, or in this modern era enviromental conscience. This only works so far before the citizenry wake up and revolt, then with new ruling ideology spread throughout the bureacracy, government, armed forces, the final transition is accomplished at the point of a gun. The vast majority of the believers, who lend the scheme its crucial initial legitamacy, then find themselves living a miserable life of impoverished servitude. This system has been established and failed many times in the 20th century.In the end result it is never good for the people or the planets enviroment.
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climbski2
Mountain climber
Anchorage AK, Reno NV
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Hmm I'd say that is the type of system we currently live in. You know my thoughts on our supposed democracy. The Wealthy elite does not have perfect control but they gain more every year it seems. What I find most interesting is that these very orgoanizations are currently the ones who spend the millions against research and developement regarding Global warming. They are the ones funding the PR backlash against science. Perhaps we are both correct as undoubtedly there is more than one strategy of the power hungry at play. However science is a tough horse to rein in due to it's adherance to one basic principle. Evidence. Also the free disemmination of gathered information. Dangerous thing for the power hungry and one of the reasons it has always been one of the first target of dictators .. religious or otherwise.
Perhaps later I'll document the the pathway of the flow of money later.
I suspect you and I have similar concerns but different view as to the source of the tyranny.
Anyway I gotta go do a quick job and then kayaking. Catch ya later.
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rick sumner
Trad climber
reno, nevada/ wasilla alaska
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Yeah Derek, we are pretty far down the road already.
Just in time Ron, a little localized global cooling.
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rick sumner
Trad climber
reno, nevada/ wasilla alaska
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You are a good to excellent writer Ed. Most always clear and concise. What you have to say is understandable-above all else you seek to defend the scientific community. This is understandable, but i think you would be much for the better to try to convince your brethren in "the community" to switch from studies seeking scientific understanding of an impossibly chaotic system to studies for scientific applications to benefit all. It is time to roll out product, not to just endlessly consume the product of the peoples labor.
I've read an article recently that claims their has been a distinct increase in the greening of our planet, as per satellite imagery, especially in areas previously to arid to support much plant life without increased CO2 levels. I'll try to dig it up later.
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rick sumner
Trad climber
reno, nevada/ wasilla alaska
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That is a good start, good quality regional predictions are crucial for economies and the peoples welfare. Now what about that Fusion that is always 30 years out, or convincing the public about the near fail safe nature of the new generations of nuclear fission reactors, or storage systems for solar and wind energy to allow continuous generation,or space travel with colonization, etc. etc. Their is a whole universe of practical science to pursue that could render our present irrational fears as a funny memory of mass hysteria from the past. You guys need to get to work.
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Norton
Social climber
the Wastelands
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Yeah
My 9.9 baud modem dial up takes an hour!
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raymond phule
climber
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His (GISS) models are the worst and most deceptive.
No, you have already posted the worst and most deceptive predictions, for example Lindzen's prediction from the eighties.
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raymond phule
climber
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Wrong. Lindzen did not utilize Millions of of the US Tax Payers dollars to come up with his "prediction".
So what? He was completely wrong and your side of the argument like to link to his works because you like his conclusions. I am neither sure who have sponsored his tenure at MIT but I believe that the US tax payers have also paid him some money.
Hansen and his NASA GISS did. For well over 30 years. Thus his are indeed the worst and most deceptive of all models.
The model made a prediction 25 years ago about the future climate. So they obviously didn't do anything with that prediction for 30 or 25 years. Today's models are also much better.
He thieved the money. Made the models that are completely bogus. Then ran off with the plunder. Retired with nothing to show of it. Nothing.
What did you do? Treated and maybe killed some foreigners and run away with a pension?
Just for curiosity is the weather models that is used to predict the weather also completely bogus? Those models have never predicted the weather correctly with fifteen decimals even 1 hour in advance but they usually give good information at least a couple of days in advance.
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rick sumner
Trad climber
reno, nevada/ wasilla alaska
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Excellent find Chief. I am still LMAO. Even the mindless zombies should be able to relate to these videos, although i think their botox treatments will not allow them to laugh.
Bruce, i said under the "cloak of communism", not real communism. Look behind the cloak and what do you find-some of the wealthiest people on earth, some of planets largest corporations, and plenty of megalomaniacs.I pity the poor "believers", once their role as foot soldiers of ignorance is complete the machine chews up and spits out their sorry asses.Watch Chiefs videos, look at the graphs. We have hope of reclaiming you from slippery walls of the abyss.
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rick sumner
Trad climber
reno, nevada/ wasilla alaska
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Hedge you're back. Did you get out on the road for an expedition or were you temporarily banned? Anyway i was beginning to miss your simple minded redundancy.
Bruce- read the last post again, i believe i answered you. You should pick up a paper or electronic copy of a book called Eco Fascists by a gal from your neck of the woods by the name of Elizabeth Nickson. I've experienced first hand many of the insanities she describes and Ron verified the forestry and water issues she talks of.
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rick sumner
Trad climber
reno, nevada/ wasilla alaska
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The ideal of the everyman getting a fair shake and entitlements enough to live in comfort is the pablum being fed to the masses as "socialism or communism". Many people in the western world of today have traded their very souls for mere "promise of trinkets", which when enough bait is swallowed by the masses will be replaced by the sad reality of fascism. It is a dangerous world out there.
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rick sumner
Trad climber
reno, nevada/ wasilla alaska
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First im not a chickenshit then im a coward. You are all over the board Bruce. Get a grip, both you and the Hedge must have missed your hormone shots. Oh well, you can lead a horse to water but you cannot make them drink.
Once again- Skeptical of what? Something that has not and will not happen? The graphic is cute, but it overshoots the observed increase by at least .2 c. We are now trending downward. Read the work of Livingston and Penn for a clue of where we are going.
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monolith
climber
SF bay area
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Funny how the Chief only wants to go back to mid-1997. How about going back to 1996?
Classic cherry picking.
His choice to start with mid-1997 was made because that gave him the result he wanted. That’s a practice called “cherry-picking.”
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rick sumner
Trad climber
reno, nevada/ wasilla alaska
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Let me answer Coz. First off nobody here takes much offense of predictable old Hedge and especially of stubborn old Bruce.
Second it is not "settled science" at all. The temps have plateaued or decreased slightly over the last decade despite a rapid increase in global atmospheric CO2 content. See the first link below about the temporal correlation between CO2 and temps in the ice core record. The second link blows the idea of climate change consensus out of the water and also has links to opposition papers. You should look at The Chiefs video posted just above for the sad comedy of the situation. Welcome to the neighborhood, it is anything but peaceful and "settled".
http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=ice-core-data-help-solve
http://www.petitionproject.org
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Dropline
Mountain climber
Somewhere Up There
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Would you characterize his behavior as cowardly?
The most cowardly behavior here is that of calling others names from behind a computer screen. People are going to disagree with you. So what? Having such a hissy fit about it just reveals that, in some way, you are unstable. Joe Hedge too.
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monolith
climber
SF bay area
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Chief, did you miss the massive CO2 spike at the end of your last graph? Do you think the earth's natural systems have fully adjusted to that disturbance?
Thanks for showing the correlation between CO2 and temp.
Has the ocean heat content leveled off?
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Dropline
Mountain climber
Somewhere Up There
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Bruce, you need not go knock on his door, just make your points civilly. As for Glenn Beck, he's a buffoon and I pay no attention to what he has to say one way or the other.
I'm going OUTISIDE. Have fun here in your virtual cubicle.
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rick sumner
Trad climber
reno, nevada/ wasilla alaska
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Well gentlemen the tone is decidedly more civil this morning, very good. DMT, the science is not at all settled, in fact it is mostly manufactured and yes many people on our realist side believe deeply of what i just said. Randisi we may be blowing hot air and not changing any of the more stubborn minds but this argument feeds our addiction.Anyway the sun has long since arisen here in alaska and below is a link to where its behavior is heading.Bruce you hit the nail squarely on the head with your statement that we all want to leave the place as, or better ,than we found it for our kids.Good morning my friends.
http://nextgrandminimum.wordpress.com
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