Discussion Topic |
|
This thread has been locked |
gonamok
climber
dont make me come over there
|
|
|
Aug 29, 2015 - 03:11pm PT
|
I left the belay bolts after checking them. After removing the bolts i determined that unlike the 3 on the face, the sleeve had caught on the oversize hole edges and expanded in the hole, sticking tight. I replaced the bolts and hangers. Not the best case scenario, but they are safe. The excsss hardware had been removed from the anchors before i got there.
In an ironic twist, that good ol leeper hanger and 1/4" buttonhead is way safer than the new bolts. And yes, you know nothing dork, I would tr off that thing anytime. It was properly placed
|
|
gonamok
climber
dont make me come over there
|
|
|
Aug 29, 2015 - 05:48pm PT
|
One more thing on the bolts. These were cheap and lightweight, even if they had been placed in the correct size hole. Bolt strength is rated as ungraded, grade 3 (weak), grade 5 (medium), and grade 8 (strong). Grade 8 bolts should always be used, with grade 5 being the minimum. You can identify the strength by the number of hashmarks on the bolt head. 1 mark = grade 3, 3 marks = grade 5, 5 marks = grade 8 (i know it doesnt make sense but thats how it is).
These bolts are ungraded, probably from china. You can twist the head off of an ungraded 5/16" bolt without trying. Its always best to go with stainless steel as well
|
|
Johannsolo
climber
Soul Cal
|
|
|
Aug 29, 2015 - 07:03pm PT
|
Thank you Ron!
We all need take a part in protecting this incredible resource.
|
|
Johannsolo
climber
Soul Cal
|
|
|
Aug 29, 2015 - 07:14pm PT
|
Nothing wrong with a TR, can be scarier than a clip up sporter.
|
|
bvb
Social climber
flagstaff arizona
|
|
|
Aug 29, 2015 - 07:57pm PT
|
Oh fer christ's sake. The circus is in town, and the alpha clown has a drill. Worst case scenario. Anybody actually ever met or seen this gym rat?
|
|
Contractor
Boulder climber
CA
|
|
|
Aug 30, 2015 - 03:37am PT
|
Roger, when selecting a rock to crawl under, please make sure it's well off the road.
|
|
Johannsolo
climber
Soul Cal
|
|
|
Aug 30, 2015 - 10:17am PT
|
Scattergun may not be the actual bolter. The poster below is this short older guy that smokes a cigar, seen him a few times on the hill but don't know his name.
herethewholetime
Trad climber
Socal
Aug 17, 2015 - 10:21pm PT
I usually don`t post but thought I would throw a few things out there. First off Scattergun did not put the route up I did. He showed me the route and we thought it would be fun as a lead. Neither of us could find it online or in any guide books. In the past couple decades that friend of mine and I have climbed at Woodson and neither of us knew it was a line that went. It was put in ground up. A good friend of mine belayed me. I put the anchor bolt far back so others could use them for the crack and center of the face. The route has been up going onto 2 years. So far I have only heard good things about this route till John started crying about it. Claims he tried it off of the old rusted leaper hanger a few years ago. I would love to watch him do it, that thing probably could not support his body weight let alone his ego. As for John it seems whenever their is a problem his name comes up. He seems to like chopping other people's stuff, but it`s ok for him to bolt whatever he wants. Don`t worry I know where most of his bolt are ;) I recall a certain route at Suicide that got anchor bolts after all of these years for a certain someones convenience. Lets not forget he removed the pins from Etude, or the hanger from Sundance. Oh wait I didn`t do it but know who did (wink wink). I know of more should I go on? As far as his friends backing him they are just doing what friends do. A dark cloud always seems to follow where ever this climber goes.
As far as the bolts on the face by POA, GCS, or Yoav they are not mine. Although the one on Yoav is great for keeping the rope out of the crack, but hate to break the news to everyone it`s been there for a while. It has been there for just over a year before the route got posted on mountainproject.
Just wanted to get a few facts straight. Do whatever your going to do because your going to do it anyways. Just remember in the end the rock pays. Please don`t pm me or write posts to me. I normally don`t the forum this stuff because I think it can be toxic. I like to come on Supertopo from time to time to see what I love....climbing.
|
|
GDavis
Social climber
SOL CAL
|
|
|
Aug 30, 2015 - 10:44am PT
|
Hey everyone with an insta-matic gas driven bolt gun
drive around Ramona looking for boulders - if you find a cool one, walk up to the home and knock on their door. Obtain permission and go f***ing nuts on private property.
but go awayyyyyyyyy from Woodson.
|
|
gonamok
climber
dont make me come over there
|
|
|
Aug 30, 2015 - 12:11pm PT
|
Well wherethewholetime, you made a real nice booby trap, because your bolts were s hit, i pulled them out with my fingers. How in the world can you say you didnt know if the line had been climbed when there was a freaking tr bolt on it? This was never about John it was about preserving the rock, but now its about safety. You drilled 3/8" holes and put spindly 5/16" bolts in. As a result, the outer sleeve did not expand and grip the sides of the hole.. you can see from my pics that the sleeve was just expanded enough to make it feel tight when turned with a wrench. I only had to loosen the bokrs about a half turn to pull out bolt, sleeve and all. The sleeve is the holding componant, and if it comes out then there was nothing holding it in. For an incompetent d#@&%e you sure are smug
|
|
gonamok
climber
dont make me come over there
|
|
|
Aug 30, 2015 - 12:17pm PT
|
Wow they dont let you say d o u c h e on here
|
|
gonamok
climber
dont make me come over there
|
|
|
Aug 30, 2015 - 12:39pm PT
|
I guess i made my point, but ethics are one thing, bad bolts kill.
|
|
eeyonkee
Trad climber
Golden, CO
|
|
|
Aug 30, 2015 - 12:49pm PT
|
Are you sure about that number, Warbler? Seems a little, I don't know, high.
|
|
mtwoodsonguide
Trad climber
|
|
|
Aug 30, 2015 - 04:45pm PT
|
Looks like 3/8" x 3 1/2 or 4" Rawl 5pc to me.
Lets see close ups of the bolt heads and the writing on the sleeves.
Otherwise I say slander.
|
|
bvb
Social climber
flagstaff arizona
|
|
|
Aug 30, 2015 - 07:28pm PT
|
Whatever, the bolts are out and next time I get out there the bolts on Grand Central Station are gone as well.
One discussion that we need to have revolves around this question: why -- after decade after decade after decade after decade of routes like Hear My Train and The Widow Bereft being climbed using natural gear for anchors -- why are folks suddenly and intently driven to put in bolts TR anchors? Woodson is NOT a sport area and it is NOT a gym.
I'm not being hypothetical here. I'm genuinely curious. What would compel someone to start peppering bolts right next to the placements that served a natural anchors for generations of Woodson climbers? Do they even stop for one minute to think about what they are doing, and where they are doing it, and why they are doing it?
On another note, I recently noted a mighty fine looking Woodson crack I've never done. I don't think I've ever even seen it?! Christ almightly!
|
|
bvb
Social climber
flagstaff arizona
|
|
|
Aug 30, 2015 - 07:33pm PT
|
Looks like 3/8" x 3 1/2 or 4" Rawl 5pc to me. Lets see close ups of the bolt heads and the writing on the sleeves. Otherwise I say slander.
Yes, I agree. The photos have been manipulated and 40-year-Woodson veteran Ron Amick is making it all up. That much is obvious.
|
|
gonamok
climber
dont make me come over there
|
|
|
Aug 30, 2015 - 08:23pm PT
|
Being a factory certified large bore engine mechanic with 30 years experience in no way qualifies me to know anything about bolts, but the guy at the ace hardware store said that 5/16" bolts take a 1/2" wrench and 3/8" bolts take a 9/16" wrench and he is an expert. Another tip was that 5/16" bolts are 5/16" in diameter. How nice to be able to tell from a picture what size they arent, thank you Mt woodson guy for your considered opinion. Wait, 5 pc, as in 5 piece? What bolts have 5 pieces? These manky little things had two. And how is it that the sleeve came out with the bolt if they fit the hole mr armchair mechanic?
|
|
dmr
Social climber
Carlsbad, CA
|
|
|
Aug 30, 2015 - 08:53pm PT
|
http://www.powers.com/pdfs/mechanical/06914.pdf
The "3/8"" 5-piece bolts are 5/16" bolts plus the sleeve to fit a 3/8" hole. The cone and another sleeve part are probably still in the hole. I think with wedge type bolts 3/8" is 3/8"
The hardware store bolts on my previous photo are on the backside of 10a on the Outside.
|
|
gonamok
climber
dont make me come over there
|
|
|
Aug 30, 2015 - 08:55pm PT
|
top - 5/16" bolt i removed
next- 3/8" x 5" hilti expansion bolt
next- 3/8" x 4" hilti
bottom - 3/8" 3pc concrete anchor
head of the bolt i removed "bundu 8.8"... wheres bundu?
blurry pic of a grade 5, 3/8" bolt head
heres the weenie little sleeve, doesnt look like any rawl ive ever seen
finally, heres a 3/8" female expansion bolt (hilti) and the 5/16" imposter. Can you speak up mtwoodsonguy? i cant hear you when you talk out of your azz
|
|
gonamok
climber
dont make me come over there
|
|
|
Aug 30, 2015 - 09:02pm PT
|
all pseudo technobabble aside, i pulled these things out of their cubby holes with thumb and forefinger, dont care what size or how many pieces, bolts that do that aint safe fer fallin on, yo
|
|
dmr
Social climber
Carlsbad, CA
|
|
|
Aug 30, 2015 - 09:02pm PT
|
I think the 8.8 is a metric or euro bolt grade. It looks like it is roughly equivalent to Grade 5. Maybe these are metric bolts in slightly oversized SAE holes?
|
|
|
SuperTopo on the Web
|
Let us know!