Discussion Topic |
|
This thread has been locked |
John M
climber
|
|
|
Apr 14, 2014 - 07:44pm PT
|
Brokedown wrote,
The facts just now coming to light about the Solar Green energy development is the REASON, even though Tortoises and Grazing Fees are simply the EXCUSE for this whole exercise in futility.
I disagree with you as Solar energy was not a viable platform 20 plus years ago when this started. Plus they do not need that entire area for a large solar installation. I believe that It was about creating habitat for the desert tortoise from the beginning, however misguided that was. Is Reid's son involved in Solar energy? Yes.. they are trying to get a place near Laughlin Nevada. But that is a recent development and was not viable 20 plus years ago, when this started.
Was that a good idea? I don't know. Is it sad that this man was losing his way of life? certainly. I do believe that the BLM handled this poorly, in how they went about taking this mans cattle. Some of those officers made huge mistakes. I also feel for someone having to deal with a large bureaucracy. I live surrounded by one. It can be no fun. But that also doesn't immediately mean that they are wrong.
This man has floated so many crazy ideas. Who here accepts his belief that the federal government has no say on land that they own? He says its not federal land. Does anyone here believe that?
|
|
philo
Trad climber
Is that light the end of the tunnel or a train?
|
|
|
Apr 14, 2014 - 07:47pm PT
|
He reneged on the peace agreement when he decided the Feds should disarm and give him and his mob all thhe guns. That didn't happen. Did he think it would?
|
|
philo
Trad climber
Is that light the end of the tunnel or a train?
|
|
|
Apr 14, 2014 - 07:52pm PT
|
I don'[t believe in speed limits and traffic laws. Therefore from now on I'm traveling with an armed vigilante mob.
That way I can speed where ever and when ever I want and if the Man stops me and tries to impose Fed Tyranny on me my gang-o-patriots will make em stand down. In fact everybody should travel with their own armed for armegedon batshitcrazy militia mob so we can all do what we want when ever and where ever we want. What could go wrong?
|
|
crankster
Trad climber
South Lake Tahoe, CA
|
|
|
Apr 14, 2014 - 07:53pm PT
|
Run the extremist freeloader's bank account dry. His domestic terrorists friends, aka armed ranchers and other lunatic fringe, have had their fun.
|
|
tooth
Trad climber
B.C.
|
|
|
Apr 14, 2014 - 07:53pm PT
|
These ranchers don't care about the turtles do they??
Nope. After grazing cattle there for 100 years it would be hard to convince him that he is the reason the turtles are now suddenly in trouble. And me.
|
|
philo
Trad climber
Is that light the end of the tunnel or a train?
|
|
|
Apr 14, 2014 - 08:06pm PT
|
Apr 14, 2014 - 04:57pm PT
Neither does Senator Harry Reid aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand all his mobster buddy"s. Half or more of which are in State or Federal pens.
Got Link?
|
|
Bob D'A
Trad climber
Taos, NM
|
|
|
Apr 14, 2014 - 08:08pm PT
|
Chief...is breaking Bundy breaking the law? Yes or no.
|
|
tradmanclimbs
Ice climber
Pomfert VT
|
|
|
Apr 14, 2014 - 08:20pm PT
|
I know nothing of the real details of this situation. What if any credance there is to the land being under state and not fedral control? I do however find it interesting that most if not all of the rednecks that fight the fedral govt over taxes take full advantage of whatever govt money they can get their hands on. I would be very supprised if this guy has not recieved substantual fedral farm subsidies. The real funny thing is they go out and vote repuglican not even realizeing that the repugs are the ones who are cutting their subsidies.
|
|
HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
|
|
|
Apr 14, 2014 - 08:21pm PT
|
Solar energy? Yes.. they are trying to get a place near Laughlin Nevada. Exactly.
The proposed solar development is many miles south of Bunkerville and across the Colorado River and Lake Mead.
Can Bundy's cattle swim the Colorado? Why would they want to?
Solar farm?
Another red herring
this guy has not recieved substantual fedral farm subsidies He's certainly been subsidized by the US taxpayer to the tune of $300K. His free ride since 1993.
|
|
Bob D'A
Trad climber
Taos, NM
|
|
|
Apr 14, 2014 - 08:23pm PT
|
HighT wrote: Solar farm?
Another red herring
Over 200 miles away.
|
|
John M
climber
|
|
|
Apr 14, 2014 - 08:23pm PT
|
come on Tooth.. the man isn't the reason the tortoises are endangered. Its all the development all over the desert. What the government was trying to do was created a natural preserve. They chose the desert that this man leased for grazing.
Chief, it is appropriate to link your sources.
|
|
philo
Trad climber
Is that light the end of the tunnel or a train?
|
|
|
Apr 14, 2014 - 08:25pm PT
|
Do you know where this simmering, oozing, pustulating distrust off Government comes from?
Well it's not because of this guy. He's is just the latest recipient of the hate fest. .
No it wasn't Democrats or Liberals or Progressives that created this uneasy situation. They are just the recently branded.
Nope it was the disastrous policies of the double speaking Republicans and Neo-Conservative crack pots like this guy.
Funded by UnAmerican traitors like this...
And managed by soulless Machiavellian murderers like...
Hey The Chuff what was your opinion of the unarmed "Occupy" movement?
Would you have liked them more if they were heavily armed bearded men?
|
|
Norton
Social climber
the Wastelands
|
|
|
Apr 14, 2014 - 08:29pm PT
|
why is everyone so damn concerned about the turtles?
|
|
Brokedownclimber
Trad climber
Douglas, WY
|
|
|
Apr 14, 2014 - 08:33pm PT
|
Tortoises. ^^^^^^^^^^
Turtles are aquatic based. Tortoises are dry land.
|
|
Norton
Social climber
the Wastelands
|
|
|
Apr 14, 2014 - 08:36pm PT
|
ok, so Tortoises
so how and why did they get involved in this thread?
|
|
philo
Trad climber
Is that light the end of the tunnel or a train?
|
|
|
Apr 14, 2014 - 08:40pm PT
|
Chief, it is appropriate to link your sources.
Hey I found his source and contrary to what many of us believed he doesn't just pull them out of his ass.
He believes everything he hears from his source because it's just like Jesus talking.
|
|
HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
|
|
|
Apr 14, 2014 - 08:49pm PT
|
so how and why did they get involved in this thread? So the wackos could drag the Endangered Species Act into this tempest in a teapot. And then by extension, the solar project.
The tentacles of anti-democratic big government.
Did you miss the foaming at the mouth tirade against the Desert Tortoise Conservation Center a few pages back?
|
|
John M
climber
|
|
|
Apr 14, 2014 - 08:52pm PT
|
Norton,
Its simple.
in the early 90s, the desert Tortoise was put on the endangered species list. The feds were mandated to try and find a preserve for them. They chose this chunk of federal land that Bundy and 60 some odd other ranchers were leasing to graze cattle. They bought all the leases, which they were required to do by law, and closed the land to cattle grazing. Was this a good thing? I have no idea. To those affected it was obviously terrible. Bundy refused to accept the deal. But he didn't really have a choice as the land is not his. He claims it is and he claims that the feds have no jurisdiction in the sovereign state of Nevada , but the courts have said so it is federal land multiple times.
Its not much different from some business losing their lease and having to move. Lots of business are killed that way. One of my favorite restaurants went out of business because of that. The owners were old and they didn't want to have to deal with moving. This man likely has a lot invested in his ranch, so moving likely wasn't much of a good option either.
It is a good example of some of the consequences of trying to do good. Try to protect an endangered animal. Ruin someones business.
|
|
Norton
Social climber
the Wastelands
|
|
|
Apr 14, 2014 - 08:58pm PT
|
So the wackos could drag the Endangered Species Act into this tempest in a teapot. And then by extension, the solar project.
to divert attention away from paying grazing fees?
|
|
Jon Beck
Trad climber
Oceanside
|
|
|
Apr 14, 2014 - 08:59pm PT
|
Bundy refused to accept the deal. But he didn't really have a choice as the land is not his.
That is not Bundy's version of what is loosely referred to as "the facts". He claims he "fired" the BLM in 1993 because they were not improving "his land" to his satisfaction. Years later the grazing rights were purchased by a conservation group of some type. A wonderful free market solution that the Tea Tards should be delighted to see happen. For some reason they are pissed at the free market now.
|
|
|
SuperTopo on the Web
|
Let us know!