The Gun debate sandbox

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michaeld

Sport climber

Sacramento

Jul 26, 2012 - 03:35pm PT

No. Law Abiding Citizens.

Pay attention.

Christ. You people.

Norton

Social climber

the Wastelands

Jul 26, 2012 - 03:42pm PT

Well, don't expect President Obama to speak out or encourage more gun control legislation.

This is a President who signed laws allowing people to carry on Amtrak Trains and in National Parks, providing of course they have a Concealed Carry License.

He has stated his support for the Constitution's Second Amendment.

And while he may not be in the NRA's back pocket, he actions speak clearly in support of American citizens legally arming themselves.

Mitt Romney now says he also would not support more gun control legislation.

Look for nothing to change on the Federal level.

Crimpergirl

Sport climber

Boulder, Colorado!

Jul 26, 2012 - 04:20pm PT

No. Law Abiding Citizens.

Pay attention.

Christ. You people.

Geez. I get a nasty response to a simple question trying to understand your position and you wonder why some people aren't listening to you? Thanks for the clarification. I was just curious.

Toker Villain

Big Wall climber

Toquerville, Utah

Jul 26, 2012 - 04:41pm PT

What is funny is how many people think full auto M-16s, even belt fed full on machine guns are totally illegal.

Wrong.

Same with suppressors.

And suddenly you have all these self-appointed personal defense experts saying that super hi-cap clips have no legitimate application.
Never been in a dust up, mind you. Never had an armed creep come around in the wee hours.

But they JUST KNOW that these tools are invalid for any civilian.

I guess it is too much to hope for that they have an experience that might have changed their minds.

michaeld

Sport climber

Sacramento

Jul 26, 2012 - 04:50pm PT

Picking up a g19 tomorrow.

Holler.

Crimpergirl

Sport climber

Boulder, Colorado!

Jul 26, 2012 - 04:52pm PT

Enjoy!

Toker Villain

Big Wall climber

Toquerville, Utah

Jul 26, 2012 - 04:52pm PT

Anybody who only has 6000 rds is not ready for the next election.

fear

Ice climber

hartford, ct

Jul 26, 2012 - 04:53pm PT

I think a lot of the anti-gunners are just scared quite frankly of what they don't know.

Kinda like everyone 'else' calling us climbers crazy.

I've "converted "a lot of previous gun-haters over to the darkside with a few trips to the range.

It's seriously fun as Hell shooting pumpkins full of water with a variety of firearms. There's just nothing like it! Or being able to accurately put a bullet through a Quarter at 250 yards. Or hitting 25 out of 25 clay pigeons handicapped with a short-barreled coach gun. Just awesome. I have never seen a man fire a machinegun for the first time and not have a HUGE smile after.

I get the feeling anti-gun folks just think we're all seething with some raging internal desire to kill something or someone when nothing could be further from the truth. Most of the people I shoot with competitions around here don't even hunt.

In reality it's a huge sport with a large amount of diversity. Pistol, rifle, shotgun, competitions of all different kinds and just good times. I have never, even once, felt threatened by anyone I've shot with.

The self-defense aspect of it is just a tiny part of it. Anyone I know who has ever been combat or shooting sports for more than a few years has a damn healthy respect for the firearms we use since we know the damage they can cause.

atchafalaya

Boulder climber

Jul 26, 2012 - 05:19pm PT

I own guns and used to hunt growing up. I am now "anti-gun", but understand that idiots like shooting them at targets, animals and people. I wouldn't think of advocating that people cannot own handguns, rifles or shotguns. Has a legitimate argument been made that people should be allowed to own assault weapons? I have not seen one yet in this thread...

michaeld

Sport climber

Sacramento

Jul 26, 2012 - 05:21pm PT

Because we can. It's a tool. It does the same job as any other gun, but better.

There, I said it. I'm an idiot.

stevep

Boulder climber

Salt Lake, UT

Jul 26, 2012 - 05:32pm PT

And suddenly you have all these self-appointed personal defense experts saying that super hi-cap clips have no legitimate application.
Never been in a dust up, mind you. Never had an armed creep come around in the wee hours.

But they JUST KNOW that these tools are invalid for any civilian.

Piton Ron,
I'm certainly no expert, but it is pretty hard for me to think of very many "dust-ups" where a hi-cap mag would be necessary. Maybe if you're a gang-banger or drug lord fighting off an equally well-armed foe. You're probably not going to carry a big mag to the movie, so even though it might help in a situation like the CO one, you probably won't have it. And in a home invasion/burglarly situation, I'd think a shotgun or handgun would be plenty in most cases.

What sort of examples do you have that are likely to occur to the average Joe in the real world?

michaeld

Sport climber

Sacramento

Jul 26, 2012 - 05:35pm PT

Because the aurora shooter had a 100rnd drum mag, a shotgun, and hand gun.

So what's a 30rnd hi-cap mag to that?

Norton

Social climber

the Wastelands

Jul 26, 2012 - 05:35pm PT

far from an idiot, Michael!

People are just frustrated and angry with the widespread prevalence and destruction caused by hand guns in this country.

And when they read posts here extolling how much fun guns are to own and shoot,
in addition to firmly rejecting ideas put forth to limit the ease of access, smaller clip sizes, etc, well then people react naturally, by posting angrily in response.

Chaz

Trad climber

greater Boss Angeles area

Jul 26, 2012 - 05:38pm PT

The high-capacity magazine is what caused his semi-auto rifle to jam and stop working.

The hi-cap magazine was a hell of a lot more effective at stopping the slaughter than the cops ended up being.

michaeld

Sport climber

Sacramento

Jul 26, 2012 - 05:39pm PT

It's hard to explain to them Norton. Kind of like it's hard for me to understand their point of view, they don't understand mine.

I likely shoot less then any of the other pro gun people here. But I'm a firm believer in owning guns, for protection, and recreation.

I understand what a gun can do to someone on the other end of the barrel. It's no joke. They should be taken seriously. Some crack head was waving a gun around and muzzle swept my face about 15-20 times in a matter of about 2 minutes. It didn't register to him when I asked him to stop doing that.

Some people just don't know.

michaeld

Sport climber

Sacramento

Jul 26, 2012 - 05:43pm PT

I'm with you on this DMT. That was a stupid post.

Don't thank the hi-cap for the failure.

He was most likely pumped by adrenaline and was popping them off too fast and the drum mag jammed. User error.

/facepalm

And White Zombie, the right to own is still there, if you pass the background. The right to carry has been tarnished, unless you have a permit to do so.

Toker Villain

Big Wall climber

Toquerville, Utah

Jul 26, 2012 - 05:45pm PT

Example?

Well, unless your plaid pajamas have custom clip grips that you don't mind wearing while you sleep (yeah, right!) when the wolves are beating down your door at 3:00am you grab your Glock 35 equipped with Surefire light and super-hi-cap mag so that you don't have to go running back into the bedroom screaming, "WHERE THE FUK ARE MY SPARE CLIPS!!!!"