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bookworm
Social climber
Falls Church, VA
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Apr 13, 2012 - 12:42pm PT
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it doesn't matter that someone was shot; what matters is the situation in which someone was shot; so dershowitz' explanation is not "lame" regardless of how much you want to criticize the law
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Gary
climber
"My god - it's full of stars!"
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Apr 13, 2012 - 12:50pm PT
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martin was 6'2 and 140 pounds. Almost 100lbs lighter than your hero.
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StahlBro
Trad climber
San Diego, CA
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Apr 13, 2012 - 12:53pm PT
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The affidavit by law enforcement paints a pretty sickening scenario. Z-man was told repeatedly to wait for the LEO. If he had, Martin would be alive today.
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bookworm
Social climber
Falls Church, VA
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Apr 13, 2012 - 01:16pm PT
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most of us here on this side are NOT claiming that it was "ok" for z to shoot or kill martin only that the LAW might exonerate him; we've been arguing, rather, that we must wait for all the evidence to come out rather than convicting a man (even if we believe he acted stupidly) of "murder" before a trial even begins and fomenting a situation that already includes a "bounty", innocent people being driven out of their home and into hiding, and threats to social order
yes, the evidence might show that z is guilty of a crime; even that scenario does not justify much of what has been said about z since nobody here knows anything about him other than what we have heard on the news/read on the internet
too bad for z that he isn't black; if he were, nobody would even know his name
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StahlBro
Trad climber
San Diego, CA
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Apr 13, 2012 - 04:29pm PT
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Bottom line is someone's life better be in danger before you bust that cap. If not, consequences are on you, and they last a lifetime.
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monolith
climber
albany,ca
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Apr 13, 2012 - 05:01pm PT
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It was about race cuz the shooter wasn't arrested after the initial investigation, but the black guy(Trevor Dooley) in a similar case in florida was charged soon after the initial investigation.
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zBrown
Ice climber
Chula Vista, CA
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Apr 13, 2012 - 06:59pm PT
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The beat goes on. Tampa Bay Times 4-2-2012 excerpts:
the controversial 2005 law was just one of dozens of pro-gun laws that have gotten their start in Florida — forging the state's "Gunshine" reputation — before spreading to other parts of the country.
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Florida has about 900,000 licensed concealed weapons carriers, far more than any other state and nearly twice as many as Texas.
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Zimmerman was licensed to have the gun despite a prior arrest on a charge of assault on a law enforcement officer, which was dropped and domestic battery complaints. Unlike states that allow police to deny license applications based on personal character and arrest history, in Florida almost anyone who hasn't been convicted of a violent crime can qualify for a weapons license.
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Even those who don't live in the state are benefiting from Florida's gun rights expansions. Florida is one of only two states that allow nonresidents to obtain mail-order gun licenses.
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Potential penalties for crossing gun owners also came into play in the Trayvon Martin case, where police opted not to arrest Zimmerman. A police department can be sued if it arrests someone who is later found to be innocent under the stand your ground law.
Sanford City Manager Norton Bonaparte Jr. said in a statement that Florida statutes prohibited police from making a lawful arrest on the night Martin was killed. Bonaparte pointed to the stand your ground law, mentioning that the city could have been "held liable" if Zimmerman was later found innocent.
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zBrown
Ice climber
Chula Vista, CA
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Apr 13, 2012 - 07:08pm PT
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hey FAT
We all know that you are in a league of your own. "Crying, there's no crying in law enforcement" (apologies to Tom Hanks).
Are you saying that the Sanford police should have arrested z-man the night of the killing? and not used the lame excuse of being afraid of being sued.
Superman never let a little kryptonite get in his way of doing the right thing.
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the Fet
climber
Tu-Tok-A-Nu-La
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Apr 13, 2012 - 07:19pm PT
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It was about race cuz the shooter wasn't arrested after the initial investigation
Exactly. And In a town/region with a history of racism. Its telling when people don't get that.
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zBrown
Ice climber
Chula Vista, CA
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Apr 13, 2012 - 07:23pm PT
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Using the past to help us go forward ("can't we all just get along"?):
While I cannot guarantee these with 100% certainty there is a pretty strong case that these postulates are all true.
if M had not gone to visit his father, z would not have shot M
if M had not gone to the 7-11, z would not have shot M
if z did not have any bullets, z would not have shot M
if z did not have his weapon with him, z would not have shot M
if z had remained in his truck as told, z would not have shot M
{fill in your own set, it's a long list}
What are we to conclude? Well obviously M should not have gone to visit his father.
So - stay away from your dad. Live strong. Don't take EPO.
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Crimpergirl
Sport climber
Boulder, Colorado!
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Apr 13, 2012 - 07:59pm PT
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His article is clear that what the public knows may differ from what evidence exists. Then he goes on to say the affidavit is 'irresponsible' yet he himself is not privy to any unreleased info, is he? If that is the case, it appears that D is grandstanding too.
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StahlBro
Trad climber
San Diego, CA
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Apr 13, 2012 - 08:43pm PT
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It is a freaking affidavit from law enforcement. It is not the national enquirer. D helped get OJ off. Irresponsible? What do you expect....
Martin was not committing any crime and was an invited guest of a resident. He was unarmed and shot to death for walking home from 7-11.
Z was repeatedly told not to follow him.
But let's wait for the facts.....
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michaeld
Sport climber
Sacramento
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Apr 13, 2012 - 08:58pm PT
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I hate when the race card is pulled...
And...
Z was repeatedly told not to follow him.
There is only a single report of the police saying "Okay, we don't need you to do that."
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FRUMY
Trad climber
SHERMAN OAKS,CA
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Apr 13, 2012 - 09:13pm PT
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I don't get what upsets people so much about the race card.
The facts will come out in the end.
If you aren't a racist it shouldn't bother you.
It's not like we don't have a history.
You can deny it. But it would be lie.
What you should be mad about is racism.
If there was no racism involved good.
There still is a dead kid.
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FRUMY
Trad climber
SHERMAN OAKS,CA
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Apr 13, 2012 - 09:15pm PT
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"michaeld; im with you. the black community should use all the energy they put into their million man marches to create jobs and get off welfare. more so when the race card is pulled with NO evidence."
Wow talk about the race card.
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Chaz
Trad climber
greater Boss Angeles area
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Apr 13, 2012 - 09:17pm PT
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Are have a legal obligation to do whatever a police dispatcher tells us to do?
What if that dispatcher had told the Wall Street Occupiers "we don't need you to do that" ? Would the occupiers then be legally obligated to fold up their tents and go home?
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Norton
Social climber
the Wastelands
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Apr 13, 2012 - 09:21pm PT
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There is only a single report of the police saying "Okay, we don't need you to do that."
how many reports are required nowadays to the police?
is a single report calling 911 somehow not sufficient, have to call multiple times now?
has the public been notified that a single call just won't cut it?
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michaeld
Sport climber
Sacramento
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Apr 13, 2012 - 09:22pm PT
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michaeld; im with you. the black community should use all the energy they put into their million man marches to create jobs and get off welfare. more so when the race card is pulled with NO evidence.
Yep.... The majority is just an angry group of people.
and...
There is only a single report of the police saying "Okay, we don't need you to do that."
how many reports are required nowadays to the police?
is a single report calling 911 somehow not sufficient, have to call multiple times now?
has the public been notified that a single call just won't cut it?
You obviously have no clue what the hell is going on in this conversation. . . I was correcting him. Get over yourself.
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monolith
climber
albany,ca
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Apr 13, 2012 - 09:40pm PT
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The non-emergency number is answered by 911 dispatchers there. He stopped calling 911 after about 8 straight calls, including one about a pothole. LOL!
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