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Bullwinkle
Boulder climber
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Please go back into the hole that you've crawled out of, yes racism is only in the minds of black people. What a load of, crap. . .
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EdwardT
Trad climber
Retired
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Power Crux
Sep 6, 2018 - 07:06pm PT
I get the $20 from my parents
This explains so much.
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Splater
climber
Grey Matter
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By far the biggest welfare programs in the USA are subsidies and tax breaks for the rich and corporations.
There are millions of them.
They add up to perhaps 1/2 of the federal budget.
That's right: if we cut all the give-aways to the rich, the budget could be balanced, just like it would have been under Clinton's plan, until bush junior and trumpy screwed it up.
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madbolter1
Big Wall climber
Denver, CO
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Kaepernick is like Al Bundy....
Once a football "great,"
Now just a shoe salesman.
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madbolter1
Big Wall climber
Denver, CO
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^^^ Okay, I died laughing.
Resurrected just long enough to say, "Well played, sir."
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Eddie
Trad climber
San Francisco
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This thread pains me. It was bad enough to find out how many people on here are sexist in the other thread, but now to find out that so many people on here are racist too?
After so many years on here, I suppose with really only having climbing in common, this truly scares me.
One liners, jokes, awful logic, and even ridiculous insults are part of the fun and style of this forum, but I'd hope for people to be more serious when something this serious is happening. Or maybe people are being serious, in which case I'm even more scared.
Nothing particularly insightful or inflammatory to add. Just very very sad.
(and work on your empathy, everyone!)
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madbolter1
Big Wall climber
Denver, CO
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so many people on here are racist too?
...and even ridiculous insults
Notice a juxtaposition here?
Does calling somebody a racist qualify as a "ridiculous insult"?
On these threads, the term has gotten entirely deflated, because it means all and only, "Boo-hoo... you don't agree with me."
I'd hope for people to be more serious when something this serious is happening.
Like Kap himself, it's likely that you have a problem defining that all-important vague pronoun.
And, depending upon how you'd define it, many of us would not consider "this" to be serious at all, particularly given all the other social issues clamoring for attention.
I guess that makes us "racists."
So now we're full-circle, back to your "ridiculous insults" line.
So, I guess what's really "sad" for you is that everybody can't just automatically agree with you.
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the Fet
climber
Tu-Tok-A-Nu-La
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Madbolter1, I appreciate your clarification. I read your statement at face value. I think it’s incumbent on the writer to be clear, not the reader to interpret the text. All the time I add: “often” “many” “some” when writing here, even though it’s just an Internet forum because I don’t want my words misconstrued, and I honestly believe most people are good and to lump everyone of a certain political persuasion together is wrong. I’m a centrist and all the time conservatives lump me in with the most left wing people because it’s an easy straw man to rail against instead of listening and examining what I say and their beliefs.
But you can't sustain the claim that poverty DETERMINES these outcomes. You can't sustain the claim that character and choice play no significant role. You can't sustain the claim that government has not screwed the pooch with its "social programs."
Yes, but poverty has a greater determination on these outcomes than race. Character and choice play a significant role but you have to be really careful when you state that because as I said if you don't you basically assign character and choice to race or other diverse population. Social programs help much more than they hurt. There were certain programs that were terrible. E.g. people getting more money for not having a job than having a job encouraged them to not work. But we’ve had several rounds of “welfare” reform. As mentioned largest programs are health care (by far), food stamps, Earned Income Tax Credit (this is a great way to encourage people to work by lowering their tax liability).
I don’t buy the whole if you help people out if makes them feel less capable B.S. they know they just don’t make much money and many things, especially health care are too much for them to afford. I had very little money when I was young and I now I know it’s very true that the more money you have the easier it is to get ahead. You have time for additional education, you can afford child care, healthy food, etc.
Jolly Roger,
In the black community specifically, since that is what this CK sh#t is about, i think the following would be productive.
Address the fatherless households
Create an avenue to create jobs in the neighborhoods.
maybe create programs that open access to loans for small businesses.
embolden family values
**I agree with the above
denounce reverse racism
**Reverse racism is such a minor consideration I don’t know why anyone cares about it. Philosophically I’m against affirmative action type programs, but practically they are trying to make up for many decades of discrimination and we still have a ways to go. And why would the black community care about that. They will focus on what matters to them, not what bothers some white people.
create leaders that will show it can be done
kill affirmative action
**Again why would they kill a program they think may help make up for decades of discrimination?
access to trade schools
create a work ethic mentality
whatever else....
deal with drug violations equitable
**I agree with the above.
Hispanics and Asians weren’t slaves in the US like the over 10 million African people stolen from their continent and brought over. They weren’t classified as 3/5 of a person. White people have been slaves too (Slavic people for one) but not in the US. Racism rears its ugly head against many types of peoples but African Americans have a uniquely terrible history in the US with it. I agree that some hip hop culture and gangs contribute to the problem of police encounters with black people but that’s just part of the story.
I agree that success and what life offers you is more the result of your efforts than anything, but in general it is harder for someone who faces discrimination. I know some of my minority friends have been really hurt by it, even when it happens infrequently or is just a snide comment. The feeling that some people in your country don’t think you’re good enough must be awful. That’s far more degrading and demeaning than receiving govt. assistance because you don’t make much money.
BLM wasn’t formed for addressing black on black violence. Although I agree it is a bigger problem it’s different. A single example of unjustified police force is different and troubling because it strikes at the heart of two of the core principles of America: equality and justice. A government doing something unjust to its citizens is far more troubling than from another citizen IMO. Like freedom of speech. Your employer can tell you that you can’t say something on the job, but the government cannot.
It would be great if there was a more visible organization to help communities with citizen on citizen violence like BLM, but that would be a different purpose.
TradMike,
I don't understand how someone can say we are better off with imbalanced trade when we are losing $500 billion per year due to the trade imbalance. Any household can tell you that it won't survive if you have more money going out than coming in. It simply does not work. At worst case it needs to be even.
You should read more about it. There are benefits to having a trade imbalance. Chief among them is it allows the US to have the world’s reserve currency (since we buy more than we sell people in other countries hold US dollars), which keeps the value of the dollar high, and it means other countries’ invest in safe, low interest (barely above inflation) short term US govt. bonds. This additional money can allow the US to invest that money in higher paying long term investments, infrastructure, education, etc. that makes us more competitive and gives us a higher quality of life. But the reps are using the additional borrowing for tax cuts skewed to the wealthy (short term economic boost at long term cost) and they brought us to the brink of a default which throws a wrench in this system (increasing interest rates and shaking confidence in the security of holding US bonds which should be the safest investment there is).
Oil is traded is US Dollars and that along with our being the reserve currency is a huge part of why the US dollar is high and we’re in a leadership position. It’s really scary to think about but China and other countries would love the mid east countries to use the yuan or the Euro for this and this would be extremely bad for our economy. I'm not an economist but I know that it’s complex and things could go very badly for the US if we aren’t smart.
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the Fet
climber
Tu-Tok-A-Nu-La
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I heard part of an interview with a guy who specializes in protests during the anthem. It's not just Kap. For example the guys who raised their fists during the 1968 Olympics. He made a good point that during the anthem which is showing pride in a country that's devoted to equality and justice is a perfect time to point out when there are problems with equality and justice. So some people may be very offended, but for the people protesting it's the opportunity to say let's live up to these ideals.
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madbolter1
Big Wall climber
Denver, CO
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Good points, Jolly Roger.
Fet, "Madbolter1, I appreciate your clarification. I read your statement at face value. I think it’s incumbent on the writer to be clear, not the reader to interpret the text."
Well, that seems a bit weak to me. "Being clear" in a hostile environment amounts to WoTs that people also don't tolerate. And if you had read even the last page of posts to "catch up," my intention was pretty dang clear.
Frankly, it's getting to be a flat-out joke how tritely the accusation of "racist" is bandied about these days. I mean, you make my point for me when you say that poverty is more causative than race. As I've been saying, this is about (sub) culture rather than race. So the endless accusations of "racist" are laughably misplaced.
Now if you want to take the next step in the argument, which is what you seem to say in your post, that blacks have more of a poverty problem than whites, so that is why they are having proportionately more "negative" police encounters, I would say that I don't buy it.
But that's an argument for another day.
In any case, as I said repeatedly upthread, Kap (and his ilk) are determined to "take a stand" on a vague pronoun. And until that pronoun is cleared up, it's mighty hard to see "this" as anything but self-service on the part of a failing QB who is then quick to climb into bed with a big corporation to which "this" could flatly and obviously be applied.
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Capt.
climber
some eastside hovel
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^^ Wow. Just wow.
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donini
Trad climber
Ouray, Colorado
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Certainly not all conservatives are racist while some progressives are, but, let’s be honest, a much higher percentage of conservatives are racist although they will protest mightily that they are not.
Score one for Nike...should be a wake up call for the clueless owners who don’t understand that the only thing that doesn’t change is the fact that there will be change....adapt or become irrelevant.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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meaningles non sequitors
meaningles non sequitors
meaningles non sequitors
meaningles non sequitors
meaningles non sequitors
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glspi
climber
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"I am racist because I disagree with the actions of a black." -Jody
How in the world can you type that out and not see your blatant racism? You do know we are all humans on this earth, right? You make a LOT of generalization's based on a race, and almost exclusively talk about a specific group of people as lesser than human.
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Bullwinkle
Boulder climber
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Wow, I'm truly sorry, all this time I just thought that you were, stupid, I was wrong. . .df
Edit, "a black" says it all, not a human or person, a black. . .
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10b4me
Social climber
Lida Junction
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I have never demonstrated racism. racism doesn't have to be overt. It can be implied, i.e. a perception.
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okay, whatever
climber
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With the sort of reactionary anger that Jody exhibits in essentially every one of his posts/responses here online, I wonder what kind of cop he was. The police that I know are very aware that they need to be very even-tempered, even given the confusing and angering and sometimes dangerous demands of the job. Jody does not seem to fit that mold, at least on-line, though perhaps he does in person... I've never met him. But he's retired now, evidently, and just a right-wing Supertopo ranter, for better or worse.
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okay, whatever
climber
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All right, I'll back off and not judge, since I don't know you personally at all. I just think that all of us are more likely to be heard, whatever our viewpoints, if we express ourselves calmly and intelligently, and consider the fact that others may think differently than we do, even as we express our opinions. And genuinely listen... not just to those who do think like you, but to others who do not, as well.
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