What is "Mind?"

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jgill

Boulder climber

Colorado

Oct 13, 2014 - 08:23pm PT

Institute of Noetic Sciences

At the nexus of the meditative and scientific, where experiential meets discursive. Where Ward and Largo could work together for a better world. Fellowships available.

MikeL

Social climber

Seattle, WA

Oct 13, 2014 - 08:30pm PT

Jgill:

And you? What kind of institute would you establish?

jgill

Boulder climber

Colorado

Oct 13, 2014 - 10:18pm PT

^^^ Like GM once commented, one for which I would not qualify as a member.

;>)

Ward Trotter

Trad climber

Oct 13, 2014 - 10:27pm PT

Reminds me of the story about Groucho Marx applying for membership in an exclusive Men's club that kept turning him down over the course of several years---he thought due to his being a Jew .
Finally the day came when the club eventually okayed his application. Groucho immediately turned them down and offered this as his reason:
" I refuse to belong to an organization that would have me as a member"

Tvash

climber

Seattle

Oct 13, 2014 - 10:38pm PT

The whoosh of flaring wings. A Stellar's Jay lords over my apple core. He opens his beak and the screech of a red tail hawk echoes through the ponderosa. He stabs the core, leaps into the quiet morning, and both are gone.

From "Tails of the Ochoco", by T. Vash, 2014

Gnome Ofthe Diabase

climber

Out Of Bed

Oct 13, 2014 - 11:37pm PT

jgill has an established institution
of phenomenal Boulder problems,
established in a style that has
rarely if ever been matched.
His humble demeanor and grace
in his response proves his
reluctant place that is at the
head of the table looking down
from the summit at all of you
miles below still in base camp.
continue to climb and you may
come close but he is king of
the mountain and with superior
acuity He will successfully defend

MikeL

Social climber

Seattle, WA

Oct 14, 2014 - 08:01am PT

So many quips, so little substance. People are clever, but superficial. There's no "there" here. Any substance vanishes like smoke with the next post. Communal ADHD? (I think this is why Largo continues to bear down on the same issue.) As conversation, the practice of clever quips is boring; but behaviorally, it's curious.

How is it that the characteristics of such events are not seen in other things in the world? That is: the mere impermanent manifestation / apparition of everything? What is this apparitional, ever-changing, indescribable, unbounded reality? Is there anything that remains, always, everywhere, and no where? Yes? No?

People might as well be getting hit in the forehead with a 2X4. (Hello? Wake up!)

Direct apprehension is a mystery to me. I don't get how "getting it" (noesis) happens in me or other people. No one I've read claims to know either. Reason, emotion, myth, unconscious understanding, etc. In the last analysis, understanding in any form seems to be intrinsically unexplainable.

It is a mystery to me how folks don't see any real mystery at all.

Largo

Sport climber

The Big Wide Open Face

Topic Author's Reply - Oct 14, 2014 - 08:36am PT

TVASH. Gotta go to SLC and Petzl today and back tomorrow. We'll start planning your adventure soon as I get back. This should really be a fun one for us all.

JL

WBraun

climber

Oct 14, 2014 - 09:24am PT

The zen master will beat Tvash with bamboo rod and Tvash will come back here and scream terrorism and torture.

Zen master will verbally abuse Tvash and Tvash will run away. hehehe

Tvash will then make conclusion like all lazy westerners and say these guys are psychos.

The weak pussy westerners just want to go to yoga classes and play in their yoga pants.

The zen master in the real days threw everyone out and really made them test to see if they really were really sincere and wanted to learn.

If they failed the test he threw them out.

Not like the nutcase American schools where they sue the the school.

Marlow

Sport climber

OSLO

Oct 14, 2014 - 09:26am PT

What's an apple?

Gnome Ofthe Diabase

climber

Out Of Bed

Oct 14, 2014 - 09:27am PT

MikeL,
As I wrote the shamefully lightweight post that was a blatant butts kiss I considered your acuity as well. The words and focus are intended to lighten the mood just a smidge. As I am completely out classed here, I try to refrain from posting. I do not want or intend to offend anyone, not you or the big Brahma. MikeL you are secure in your place and infact the race is very near even. What is the end game no consensus can ever be reached? If death is not the end do you or the OP believe that we reincarnate? (trolling for for the Rescue Saint Braun)
The answer leads to more questions about what the stopping of every thing, feeling and breath and What electrical brain output really means. (I liked the word 'sesation' but I could not spell it)
Spit balling by and from the likes of me is not worthy of a reply. I take no offense. I wish that I could still read and think as fast as some tell me I once did.

The shadows that wake me in the wee hours cause actual Physical pain in the form of ‘Charlie horse cramps’ from my knees to my toes, which seem to dislocate.((ouw ouw ouwy, This is the result of to little physical work I hope)). You all needed to know that? Well yes and no. If, as you are wont to, ignore me then really no. If by chance stepping back from the deep you can look at this thread as therapy for the mind, then the inclusion of the healing powers I summon to sate my pain, and over come, without drugs or climbing not even weed (both of those last two have been my crutches,) then I think it is an interesting point that mind over matter in big and small doses is Germaine to the ‘spit back reply.’

MH2

climber

Oct 14, 2014 - 10:05am PT

Somewhere in the dim past of Climbing, or R&I, or my imagination, Mark Twight relates going through the breakdown of his personality/sense-of-self and breaking free of his old limits. I think his teacher was martial arts. It definitely requires bravery to submit your self to the wrecking ball.

Largo

Sport climber

The Big Wide Open Face

Topic Author's Reply - Oct 14, 2014 - 11:05am PT

In my experience, what keeps us in the matrix is our yapper going 1,000,000 miles an hour 24/7, and if we appear quiet on the outside, we are loudly or subtly judging and evaluating and talking to ourselves on the inside. Once we are in a structured place and the silence starts to grow around us, this whole nexus of internal chin music starts to simmer down and the mud starts sloughing off our beer goggles. We start seeing beyond our mental constructs.

Wrecking ball indeed, and yes, that takes minerals.

JL

jgill

Boulder climber

Colorado

Oct 14, 2014 - 03:39pm PT

In my experience, what keeps us in the matrix is our yapper going 1,000,000 miles an hour 24-7(JL)

How are your sleep patterns? Sounds exhausting.

Tvash

climber

Seattle

Oct 14, 2014 - 04:22pm PT

Heavy lifting indeed

MikeL

Social climber

Seattle, WA

Oct 15, 2014 - 08:13am PT

Gnome OD:

Don’t mind me or my writing. Sometimes the writing is simply an expression of what’s going on in my being. I should blame a cause for my tone or attitude, or I should blame myself. Neither is the truth somehow.

Last week I got a bit rambunctious in the gym, and 48 hours later a lower back muscle seized up that made it difficult to do anything other than lay prostrate. After 24 hours of Advil, I could begin to move around, and I found pain clarifying and instructive—as I usually do with such things. The pain reminded me to pay very close attention to movement, and I tried to express every movement stylistically perfectly, with grace. That became a practice for mindfulness, and I felt grateful to for the pain because it woke me up. When I lost mindfulness, it was because my mind returned to discoursing about stuff other than what was immediately in front of me. I see / think / feel that style is a better measure (if one must) or standard than achievement. Means over ends: “doing” without regard to ends. Just doing; nothing other than doing; free play; fully engaged improvisation.

It’s perhaps weird to say this, but pain can be a gift if it brings one present. It clarifies far more than pleasure—at least it does for me. I learn nothing from pleasure; I learn more from pain.

Suffering is not pain; it’s another issue. Suffering is what the mind makes of pain, IMO.

BTW, did you plan for your avatar to spell out GOD as an acronym? (Kinda funny, really.)