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TradEddie
Trad climber
Philadelphia, PA
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Jul 12, 2014 - 04:57pm PT
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No gun shows have ever been victim of armed robbery that i know of as well. Yet another "gun rich environment".
How many people have been accidentally shot at gun shows over the past year, compared to say, knitting conventions held in the same venues?
Most gun shows around here prohibit loaded weapons inside, so does my local gun store. Do you allow open carry within your store, if so how will you be able to tell a robber from a customer before it's too late?
Oh,
http://www.philly.com/philly/news/Cops-Gunman-shoots-clerk-steals-6-firearms-in-Northeast-gun-shop-robbery.html
TE
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Ghost
climber
A long way from where I started
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Jul 12, 2014 - 05:28pm PT
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And feel free to point out any recent cases of LEOs just being targeted out of the blue due to a uniform or carrying a gun that werent in the act of a chase ,arrest or case working
Happened in Lakewood near Seattle not that long ago. Guy walked up to four officers in a coffee shop, opened fire, and killed them all. And not long after that the same thing happened to a Seattle PD officer -- sitting in his car when a guy walked up and shot him.
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TGT
Social climber
So Cal
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Jul 12, 2014 - 06:32pm PT
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Doughnuts kill more cops every year (by several orders of magnitude)than guns.
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Chaz
Trad climber
greater Boss Angeles area
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Jul 12, 2014 - 08:32pm PT
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Driving around is the most dangerous thing cops do. Car accidents are how most of them are killed.
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johnboy
Trad climber
Can't get here from there
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Jul 12, 2014 - 08:44pm PT
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Yes, lightening bolts and cars are the weapons of choice for killing children in schools.
They should outlaw those kind of weapons.
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fear
Ice climber
hartford, ct
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Jul 12, 2014 - 09:40pm PT
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And despite the fact my children are several orders of magnitude more likely to be killed by lightning + bears + snakes + disease than a mass school shooting, I still let them play outside all the time.
Just crazy I know.
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johnboy
Trad climber
Can't get here from there
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Jul 12, 2014 - 10:32pm PT
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Yes, I forgot to add climbing and all those things you said as more weapons for a person to use in short and quick mass murders.
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jonnyrig
climber
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Jul 13, 2014 - 10:51am PT
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Nice Ron. I just got back from metal detecting. Found three dollars in change, some junk, and a wireless speaker.
Found out I got a deer tag last week, so I'm going to have to get out and sight in myself, very soon. It pays to check that "alternate" box on your tag apps.
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Chaz
Trad climber
greater Boss Angeles area
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Jul 13, 2014 - 11:15am PT
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He doesn't have a job.
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TradEddie
Trad climber
Philadelphia, PA
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Jul 13, 2014 - 11:33am PT
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Then you should know the difference eh? There were NO "military" rifles there. The rifles that were there were NO DIFFERENT than any other SEMI auto deer rifle. A 308 rifle in a classic model is the very same as a 308 in an AR STYLE. They fire one shot with each squeeze eh.
Ron, the AK-47 is clearly a military rifle, while I'm not aware of any military using semi-automatic variants, it must be equally clear that being full-automatic doesn't define a military rifle, unless you consider the M1 or the L1A1 FN not to be military rifles either.
An AK-47 with open sights is both a piss-poor choice of hunting rifle, and a criminally negligent weapon for self-defense in a crowded grocery store. I fully understand the point of the Texas protests, my issue is not with their grievance about open carry of pistols, it is with the fact that legal open carry of loaded long guns (of any type) serves no benefit to anyone except to terrorists and murderers. If only the criminals have guns, then the cops will know who to shoot.
Hunters and target shooters can simply unload and/or case their weapons before leaving private property, sportsmen in every other country can manage this simple process. Carrying any loaded gun in a public place should be subject to at least the equivalent testing and eligibility process as driving a car. I can't open carry a fishing rod in PA unless I'm displaying my fishing license, yet unlicensed concealed carry of a firearm is only misdemeanor. That's F'd up.
TE
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Chaz
Trad climber
greater Boss Angeles area
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Jul 13, 2014 - 11:52am PT
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Safe to say, not one military on earth fields semi-auto AK's.
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jonnyrig
climber
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Jul 13, 2014 - 12:21pm PT
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Define what is carrying in public places? Downtown? The greater metropolitan areas? US Forest Service lands? BLM lands? Walmart?
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madbolter1
Big Wall climber
Denver, CO
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Jul 13, 2014 - 01:18pm PT
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If only the criminals have guns, then the cops will know who to shoot.
If only they WOULD, there would be a lot less debate on this subject. Again, if ALL you want to see is citizens proxying their right of self-defense, then that proxy had better be AWESOME, reliable, and very, very systematic in defense of that right!
But that proxy is NOT!
Two friends of mine went up near Idelwild to do some bouldering. When next seen, they had been shot dead on the remote road. Cops believed that it was gang-banger, execution style, so that those living sacks of dung could tattoo teardrops under their eyes.
IF cops would shoot on sight this trash with teardrops tatted under their eyes, then you'd get more sympathy from me about your above-quoted statement.
But we're FAR too "civilized" for that. So, instead I wish my friends had been armed to the teeth and could therefore have had at least a fighting chance instead of just being instant victims.
Armed, they would have had at least some chance, however small. Unarmed, they had exactly ZERO chance.
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TGT
Social climber
So Cal
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Jul 13, 2014 - 04:30pm PT
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The current models of the M4 and M16, standard issue for the US military, are not full automatic.
Yes they are!
The M-16 was modified to fire only 3 round bursts on the auto setting.
The M4-A1 will fire single, 3round burst or full auto
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TGT
Social climber
So Cal
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Jul 13, 2014 - 05:57pm PT
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Three round bursts ARE full auto!
Ask ATF.
And yes it's taught.
FM3-22.9
7-7. MODIFIED AUTOMATIC AND BURST FIRE POSITION
Maximum use of available artificial support is necessary during automatic or burst fire. The rifle should be gripped more firmly and pulled into the shoulder more securely than when firing in the semiautomatic mode. This support and increased grip help offset the progressive displacement of weapon-target alignment caused by recoil. To provide maximum stability, prone and supported positions are best when firing the M16-/M4-series weapon in the automatic or burst fire mode. (If the weapon is equipped with the RAS, the use of the vertical pistol grip can further increase the control the soldier has over the weapon.) Figure 7-9 demonstrates three variations that can be used when firing in automatic or burst fire. The first modification shown involves forming a 5-inch loop with the sling at the upper sling swivel, grasping this loop with the nonfiring hand, and pulling down and to the rear while firing. The second modification involves grasping the small of the stock with the nonfiring hand and applying pressure down and to the rear while firing. The third modification shown is the modified machinegun position when a bipod is not available. Sandbags may be used to support the rifle. The nonfiring hand may be positioned on the rifle wherever it provides the most stability and flexibility. The goal is to maintain weapon stability and minimize recoil.
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fear
Ice climber
hartford, ct
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Jul 13, 2014 - 06:47pm PT
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In a light infantry rifle, an X-round full auto burst makes a lot more sense than simply full auto.
Reason being when scared you'll dump that 30 rounder before you even know what you're aiming at. Your barrel will now be hotter than Hell, your gas tube glowing red, and the next mag won't be much better for the weapon from there.
Now do this for 10,15 or so mags in a row and you've done irreparable harm to the chamber throat/barrel that will cumulatively affect accuracy until that barrel can be changed out, which can't be done in the field.
Remember that actual training trigger time for the bulk of the normal ground forces is really low due to time and money.
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
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Jul 13, 2014 - 06:58pm PT
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madb0lter posted IF cops would shoot on sight this trash with teardrops tatted under their eyes, then you'd get more sympathy from me about your above-quoted statement.
But we're FAR too "civilized" for that. So, instead I wish my friends had been armed to the teeth and could therefore have had at least a fighting chance instead of just being instant victims.
Yes the problem with the American police system is that cops aren't literally Judge Dredd.
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jonnyrig
climber
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Jul 13, 2014 - 07:37pm PT
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I disagree with your evaluation of all lands not in private ownership (and some that are) as being public, sir.
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A5scott
Trad climber
Chicago
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Jul 13, 2014 - 09:46pm PT
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Ar-15, fun plinker with some metal targets or punching holes in paper. They can handle some heat. check this vid out haha.... I like 308 better though...
[Click to View YouTube Video]
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