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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Nov 10, 2013 - 09:40am PT
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"Mr. Bear, would you be kind enough to move around me so that you are downwind before I deploy my can't fail spray can ?"
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mechrist
Gym climber
South of Heaven
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Nov 10, 2013 - 12:12pm PT
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Anyone going unarmed going into remote back country in the Rockies should be fully aware what the consequences could be. It is coming- the wolves and Griz populations have swelled to dangerous. Someone is going to be headlines soon. Don't let it be you. Believe the close call stories that you have heard.
Fear mongering poppycawk.
http://www.grizzlybay.org/LearnMore/AttackStats.htm
Anyone waking up in the morning and not crawling into a bullet proof bubble should be fully aware what the consequences could be.
Why is there no big political brouhaha around the right to conceal carry beer spray?
Yummy!
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manemachen
Sport climber
Pinedale, Wyoming
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Nov 10, 2013 - 12:54pm PT
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Burley Bob-
The form I filled out to purchase the .480 had those questions on the form- If I remember correctly, it was 1/2 of a page of questions and they struck me as ridiculous- I really remember that. Now, I will check to see if that was a state form, which I suspect it was.
Living as close to Grand Teton as I did for 13 years, I have heard of many close calls, griz and wolf. Myself, I have only seen bear scratches high up on trees- it is obvious when you come across them that it is not a brown or black bear.
I bought bear spray for my parents, my aunt and my friend in L.A. I carry a can too-I don't believe in firing a pistol unless you are sure of your shot and have no way out. Otherwise, live and let live and eat what you kill.
sorry, I won't shut up. The point IS discussion.
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mechrist
Gym climber
South of Heaven
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Nov 10, 2013 - 01:02pm PT
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I have heard of many close calls...
Stories are great entertainment. In all of North America, there have been 12 fatalities by brown bears and 12 by black bear in the last 7 years.
I don't question your need for a gun up there. I'd most likely carry if I was out and aboot up there... although I have spent plenty of time in MT and never carried a gun. But you have to admit, using bear attacks to justify opposition to increased firearm legislation is idiotic.
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Chaz
Trad climber
greater Boss Angeles area
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Nov 10, 2013 - 01:09pm PT
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Mr Vashtar writes:
"I read on some other web forums about how some people will only venture into the backcountry armed, what is everyone so afraid of they treat camping like combat? is it 'squatches? pot growers? two legged coyotes?"
Weschrist writes:
"Stories are great entertainment. In all of North America, there have been 12 fatalities by brown bears and 12 by black bear in the last 7 years."
You don't suppose one has anything to do with the other, do you, Professor?
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manemachen
Sport climber
Pinedale, Wyoming
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Nov 10, 2013 - 01:15pm PT
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MeChrist- F*#k that-"story" sh#t. I live around people that are outfitters and people that work in the park or forest, people that are passionate fishermen. It is a bad thing to think that you have to run and leave your dog as bait. The view from my deck is designated WILDERNESS. I am not sitting in suburbia thinking about these things. We do have a gun problem in the US and it is apparent to me that some restrictions could be a good thing- but, I also think that my 357 is necessary.
Rejection by some people is a complement.
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manemachen
Sport climber
Pinedale, Wyoming
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Nov 10, 2013 - 01:20pm PT
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FYI-I am not talking about California or the Sierra's. Or even the Cascades- I have never felt that a pistol in the back country in those places was necessary and I have spent a lot of time in those places.
I am awake now- good bye
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mechrist
Gym climber
South of Heaven
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Nov 10, 2013 - 01:27pm PT
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F*#k that-"story" sh#t.
you seem to have gotten all emotional and missed this part...
I don't question your need for a gun up there. I'd most likely carry if I was out and aboot up there... although I have spent plenty of time in MT and never carried a gun.
Not sure why discussions of guns seem to get gun owners so emotional and irrational... retaining only what they disagree with... jumping at the opportunity to react.
But out of curiosity, how many times have you, or anyone you were with, used a gun to deter a bear or wolf attack?
I also know plenty of Geologists who have done field work in Alaska... weeks of remote field mapping/hiking/camping... each and every one of them packing heat. Plenty of stories about seeing grizzly bears... not a single one ever used their gun. I suppose Chaz would argue the bears didn't attack because Alaska is open carry.
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Nov 10, 2013 - 03:51pm PT
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not a brown or black bear
Hmmmm,....
I didn't know there were polar bears in the Tetons.
Or is it a feral sun bear? A sloth faced bear?
Bigfoot?
Quite the mystery.
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manemachen
Sport climber
Pinedale, Wyoming
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Nov 10, 2013 - 04:26pm PT
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1.You imply that I have an exaggerated cave man reaction to camping or hiking.That I'd prefer killing stuff than experiencing them in their environment. My husband and I don't even hunt- which is rare here- I'd rather buy a 1/2 a beef each year from a rancher.
2.You say that I am not truthful. I just wake up in the morning waiting to get on line and lie. WTF..
3.The other states like Washington, California, Montana(North Texas sheep f*#kers living in single wides, if you ask me- I can be insulting too- I have made a point not to- you set the tone.) Those states do not have an elk refuge with numbers as high as 20K that has caused the government to reintroduce wolves and grizzly's into the ecosystem. Yosemite-Moab- the hippies are the scary factor in those places.
4.These predators have done very well since being reintroduced.
5.I have fear that the liberals and the democrats will want to make legislation for all states regarding gun owner ship.
6.I have not encountered a wolf or a grizzly, but Monday I needed to put a horse down. It broke it's leg in a freak accident- what? I am supposed to ask the horse to wait for the vet-two hours for a ranch call?
You wonder why I am reacting to your posts? Because I am a republican gun owner (assumption) I could give a sh#t about politics unless something directly will affect me. So, NO way.. It is because you are insulting. That's why.
SO here- do me a favor- go to Yellowstone and Grand Teton- and then get back to me.
Toker Villian- You need to learn how to read- I said that the scratches were obviously griz and not brown or black - I was talking about scratches- I could have said it this way, "12 feet up a tree 6' long and 2" deep". Instead of critiquing me, why don't you write your own sh#t- your not funny. I have driven through Toquerville- pretty place at first but weird inbred vibes - creepy..
And Burley Bob- or whoever you are, try spell check-
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Nov 10, 2013 - 04:45pm PT
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Not as creepy or inbred as Pinedale.
At least people here know that griz = brown bear, dumbshlt.
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manemachen
Sport climber
Pinedale, Wyoming
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Nov 10, 2013 - 05:08pm PT
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like I said, you need to learn how to read- a Griz is a variety of the brown bear.
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Nov 10, 2013 - 06:28pm PT
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Which is why you said "griz not brown"?
Nice to see a fellow gun owner who doesn't believe in bigfoot,..
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Chewybacca
Trad climber
Montana, Whitefish
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Nov 10, 2013 - 08:03pm PT
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One of my favorite activities is tracking and watching bears. They are such interesting animals, especially sows with cubs. This last season was my best one yet with nearly two dozen grizzly bear encounters and about the same in black bear encounters.
For my personal protection I prefer bear spray. I'm not anti-gun but there is no doubt in my mind that, for the average person, spray is a more reliable deterrent. All the studies I've seen and my own experiences support this.
That said, the fear that many people have of bears is overblown. Just because a bear sees a person doesn't mean they will try to hurt that person. Here is a link to some of my bear photos from this season. As you can see I was pretty close to some of these animals yet none of them acted in an intimidating manner or aggressively towards me.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/65037107@N07/sets/72157635415704382/
Don't shoot me bro!
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xtrmecat
Big Wall climber
Kalispell, Montanagonia
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Nov 10, 2013 - 10:39pm PT
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Manemachen wrote,
Nov 10, 2013 - 09:54am PT
Burley Bob-
The form I filled out to purchase the .480 had those questions on the form- If I remember correctly, it was 1/2 of a page of questions and they struck me as ridiculous- I really remember that. Now, I will check to see if that was a state form, which I suspect it was.
You suspect wrong, and your recollection of the questions is also as wrong. Same federal form as the rest of us use. Filled out about ten of them this year so far, and the only changes the form has seen in years is the ones related to race and ethnicity. It is just over one page of questions and is mandatoryby the federal govt..
Manemachen wrote,
And Burley Bob- or whoever you are, try spell check
I did not realize the poor writing due to my Ipad mini's autocorrect offended. I apologize and even corrected some or most of the post real quick this afternoon. Ironic the tool trying to make the pad easier to use makes so many errors. On my pc now so you needn't worry.
I still wish you would quiet your posting. You make some of the rest of the backcountry folks appear kind of hickish when you drag us along on your rants. You are obvious to us who are the real deal. Before your rant about not knowing "your" country or setting, I would be willing to bet I have more hours and miles in your backyard than you, as I have had a lifetime to accomplish this, not the last thirteen years. Your stories are about other peoples encounters with wolves and bear. Mine are strickly first person.
Mechrist, I am one who has had to discharge my weapon in defense of critters in question. I can get other people to tell me of their first person accounts and type them in as they recite, but what would be the point? It is mostly a geographical anomolly I suspect. I occurs here more frequently than one would think. I won't bore readers with details, and I really do not wish to incriminate myself if I had in fact done something illegal, but you get the point. It does happen, more here than I would suspect even in Alaska. I would say that only because the browns in Alaska know they can and will be shot. Here they are more at ease as they are many generations removed from ever being hunted.
Ron, I also don't know of any bigfoot critter, and have logged in so many miles that I am truly convinced of his nonexistance, and that has been my whole motivation for the out of doors. Ps, to this, got my first Timney and it is the last component of my varmit tool. Opinion? It seems to be the only item that keeps it from tack driver status.
Pepper spray is a great tool, but only one tool in the quiver seems kind of foolish. I sometimes go headlong into places I know are ripe for sighting and getting close to these wonderful critters same as Chewybacca. The wife always enjoys closer than comfortable photography with them, and always pretends that she wishes she hadn't come along, and yet there she is. Hmm???
Burly Bob
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manemachen
Sport climber
Pinedale, Wyoming
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Nov 11, 2013 - 12:34am PT
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you get your wish Bob- This social media thing was and experiment, because I love writing. I have no reason to lie- I couldn't really give a f*#k what anyone thinks these days, I was relating what I have observed here. Tonight I had dinner with a old guy that spent most of his life teaching in the marine corp. I asked him if he ever filled out the form that I remember. Since he was a competition shooter much of his life also, I expected an honest answer. He remembers the same form as I do.
I think I have better places to expend my efforts- It has been interesting. It has reaffirmed my experiences.
I started in Yosemite at 18- about 3 yrs there. Yosemite is why I tripped over this web site, went to the Alps for 3 years to ski after the military, worked for the forest service 3 seasons at Randle Ranger district, between Mt St Helens and Mt Rainier and then came to Jackson Hole for 13+ years, now reside in Sublette County, up against the Wind River Range the past 6+ years - sorry that I lost the contest. I had to go to college and work a little bit. My friends are outdoor people, ranchers, farriers, outfitters, small business owners..
I don't walk on water, but I am a straight shooter. (That is why I can stay married 25 years) BTW, I ran this by him- he says don't argue with strangers- Goodbye..BOB..no insults intended this time.
Toker- you do have a good sense of humor-goodbye.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Nov 11, 2013 - 01:19am PT
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As an ex-Alaskan I too am down with bear spray but I also believe in, at the least, 44 cal backup.
A lightweight S&W 50 is better and a12ga is best.
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mechrist
Gym climber
South of Heaven
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Nov 11, 2013 - 01:23am PT
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damn, that chick (I assume) is twistin!
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manemachen
Sport climber
Pinedale, Wyoming
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Nov 11, 2013 - 05:03pm PT
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http://www.atf.gov/files/forms/download/atf-f-4473-1.pdf
The only form required in the state of Wyoming to purchase a firearm-issued by the ATF- and see if some of the questions don't strike you as ridiculous.
I personally approve of the gun laws in Wyoming- but I would consider a three day waiting period if it came to discussion. I think the form (as an affidavit) is not going to expose anyone willing to lie-
like a fugitive or a nut case- (or ME according to BOB).
example: Did you just got out of a mental hospital?
Do you use alcohol or marajuana to excess?..read it for yourself.
BTW- each state has it's own gun laws...even Moooontaaaannnnnaaaaa..
mechrist- at least you referred to me as a chick, which implies that I am young-(thanks)
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