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WoodySt
Trad climber
Riverside
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Aug 29, 2008 - 12:03am PT
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I don't think Norton got any last night.
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Jeremy Handren
climber
NV
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Aug 29, 2008 - 12:07am PT
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Obama is such a far superior candidate to McCain that the rest of the world will stand back aghast and wonder what the hell is wrong with us if McCain wins.
But I have a bad feeling about this election.
I continue to be amazed at the shear volume of raw racism that I encounter; at work, buying coffee in the morning,from casual acquaintances, just all over the place. I think even in 2008 there are a large number of Americans who would not vote for a black man for president under any circumstance.
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Gene
climber
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Aug 29, 2008 - 12:13am PT
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Jeremy,
As the father of mixed-race kids, I suggest we prove them wrong. And pity them if we can't convert them. Hybrids rule.
I think our prodigal-brother, Fattrad, has a non-white kid. Right Jeff? Racism is so pre-21st Century.
GM
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philo
Trad climber
boulder, co.
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Aug 29, 2008 - 12:18am PT
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Well Dafty head to the golden arches and supersize yourself. Who is this "WE" you refer to? You got a little buddy in your pocket? You must be running scared.
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Gene
climber
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Aug 29, 2008 - 12:37am PT
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Fattrad,
We're all family. We won't tell. Be a bro and let us know who McCain has picked for the second place on the ticket.
GM
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Mighty Hiker
Social climber
Vancouver, B.C.
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Aug 29, 2008 - 12:37am PT
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Ummm, Fatty, that's "We want Mic! We want Mic!" It's spelt McCain, not MacCain.
Yes, it will be an interesting and challenging two months. Might as well discount the 15% who say they'd never vote for a black - they're likely almost all hard Republicans. The 10 - 20% who won't say it, but would have trouble voting for a black, are more of a concern. A few of them might normally vote Democrat.
The Democrats will likely strongly push voter registration, which for practical purposes meaning getting those who are younger, who have lower incomes or more transient lifestyles, who are immigrants, or who have black or brown skins, registered. And getting them out to vote. Which will be opposed by the Republicans by all legal and illegal means available.
The Democrats can also count on winning over many traditional conservative Republicans, who are disgusted with what their party has come to be.
I'd guess that Obama can make mincemeat of McCain in a one on one debate, and convey more vigorous and positive leadership. He is younger - can't get around that - but that has pluses and minuses. He does have to convey gravitas as he can.
Thinking Republicans, if there are any left, may want to lose the election. Bush is leaving a huge mess for whoever follows - it's similar to 1932.
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Lost Arrow
Trad climber
The North Ridge of the San Fernando
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Aug 29, 2008 - 12:38am PT
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Drink your Obama Cool-aid.
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philo
Trad climber
boulder, co.
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Aug 29, 2008 - 12:41am PT
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Well it is much tastier than McCain Drano.
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Gene
climber
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Aug 29, 2008 - 12:42am PT
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Serious question.
Everyone's throwing around percentages of American voters who won't vote for Obama under any circumstances because he is an African American. Is his parentage a real issue? Aren't we beyond that, or am I seriously deluded?
GM
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bob d'antonio
Trad climber
Taos, NM
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Aug 29, 2008 - 12:47am PT
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Proud to be an American again...I remember growing up in Philly and going to mostly all black school and seeing the despair in my friends eyes when MLK was killed. This is the American I thought would happen 40 years ago. What a great night in American history.
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Jeremy Handren
climber
NV
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Aug 29, 2008 - 12:51am PT
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Hate to say it Gene, but you are seriously deluded on that one.
But I should say that my comments are based on personal experience rather than statistics, hopefully I'm just being unlucky in my experiences.
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Mighty Hiker
Social climber
Vancouver, B.C.
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Aug 29, 2008 - 01:05am PT
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Hmmm, 54 posts and not a peep out of LEB. Very mysterious. Was she mesmerized, won over by Obama?
This is worrisome.
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Gene
climber
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Aug 29, 2008 - 01:07am PT
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Jeremy,
I hope so too. My kids, who are half Asian, have never been subjected to any meaningful degree of racism. Maybe it would be different is they were half black, although, based on the experiences of their friends, I doubt it. My younger daughter's school buddies include a veritable Noah's Ark of races and combinations thereof. The only argument they have that is race based is about who has the most psycho mother. It's hilarious. So far, the Asians and part Asians are winning that battle, but not by much.
They are all in a very intensive academic program and have made bonds shaped by their shared commitment and accomplishments.
I’m rather fond of my delusion. I hope it’s contagious.
GM
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Curt
Boulder climber
Gilbert, AZ
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Aug 29, 2008 - 01:07am PT
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"...I hope we have some debates so I can take a careful measure of both their debating skills and get some specifics on the issues..."
Be careful what you ask for.
Curt
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k-man
Gym climber
SCruz
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Aug 29, 2008 - 01:34am PT
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I'm with you Warbler. All the way. If McCain can win this, then I'm seriously thinking of moving.
Love it or fix it.
Perhaps Obama can't fix it all, but I know for sure that McSame will not fix a thing.
ION, the Rebugs will cut down Obama's use of the stadium, you watch.
I know why, it'd because McSame couldn't fill a stadium if he owned the hall of mirrors.
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jstan
climber
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Aug 29, 2008 - 01:37am PT
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In the election of 1860 there were four candidates, Lincoln, Douglas, Bell, and Breckinridge. If the two splinter candidates had not run and their votes in each state were apportioned to Lincoln and Douglas as per the votes those two candidates received directly, Douglas would have won the election with 52.7% of the popular vote.
Lincoln is shown as having no recorded votes in 9 of the 32 states.
Now if a Federal suit had been pressed positing that the states had illegally interferred with the conduct of a national election, it would have appeared before a supreme court led by Justice Taney. I will leave discovery of that gentleman's voting history as an exercise for the student.
Suffice it to say America has in the past decided immensely important issues, with very close votes.
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Gene
climber
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Aug 29, 2008 - 01:40am PT
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I will leave discovery of that gentleman's voting history as an exercise for the student.
I Dred that task, Professor.
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Mighty Hiker
Social climber
Vancouver, B.C.
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Aug 29, 2008 - 01:41am PT
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Gene wittily nails it - the U.S. Supreme Court has for long periods been reactionary or worse. Property and privilege sitting in judgment.
Taney had an impossible decision to make in Dred Scott, though. The court had then long ceded any real strength in the political sense, and could not have provided the leadership that the politicians failed to provide. The country was too divided.
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Binks
Social climber
i am of the universe and you know what it's worth.
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Aug 29, 2008 - 01:52am PT
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Just watched Barack's amazing speech. Truly a historic moment and he delivered. The best speech I've ever seen by a candidate. It's available in HD on the DNC website. Don't settle for 2nd hand reporting... Watch the real speech!
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