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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
Arid-zona
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Apr 29, 2008 - 07:58pm PT
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If you are truly poor then getting a voucher isn't going to make the difference between going to private school or not.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, Ca.
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Apr 29, 2008 - 10:39pm PT
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OMG. wes. you've converted to decadant Wstern culture by using the dreaded "OMG". did you have your hands on your cheeks when you did that?
I'm disappointed, I thought you were above that crap.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, Ca.
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Apr 29, 2008 - 10:42pm PT
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Well, after reading your post again, I apologize.
No OMG's there. Sorry, I hate that...almost as much as hate racists.
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Karl Baba
Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
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Apr 29, 2008 - 11:46pm PT
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This crap, like the crap on both sides, really boils down to this.
We believe what we want to believe and look for reasons and excuses to justify who we want to vote for and against. Wright didn't hurt Obama. He just gave the folks who don't want Obama something to talk about.
If we had to be responsible for everything our preacher said, nobody could get elected. Even the most mainstream kind of preacher is likely to say Jews, Muslims, and Hindus are going to burn in Hell. Who are they going to vote for?
Peace
karl
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bookworm
Social climber
Falls Church, VA
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 30, 2008 - 07:19am PT
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"It would do a lot of good for the Black community to have a member elected President. It would go a long ways to fostering positive self-esteem and show that society is changing for the better on that count."
1. improving one's own or somebody else's self-esteem is not a good reason to elect anyone president
2. this assumes obama will be a good president...what happens to the self-esteem of the "black community" when this inexperienced, naive, ultra-liberal speech maker falls flat on his face when confronted with another 9/11? oh yeah, he'd call a big meeting with syria, iran, and north korea and talk it all out
3. what about all the other role models? a black man from a poor southern family on the supreme court...a black man who became chairman of the joint chiefs of staff and then secretary of state...a black WOMAN who was national security advisor and then secretary of state...oh, wait, they're republicans so they clearly don't represent the "black community" because they're sell-outs and incapable of thinking for themselves otherwise they'd hate america, too...maybe they should start attending "the black church"...by the way, where is that located?
the "black sommunity" would be better off with bill cosby as president (or shelby steele or thomas sowell or walter williams or...)
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dirtbag
climber
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Apr 30, 2008 - 09:50am PT
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"2. this assumes obama will be a good president...what happens to the self-esteem of the "black community" when this inexperienced, naive, ultra-liberal speech maker falls flat on his face when confronted with another 9/11? oh yeah, he'd call a big meeting with syria, iran, and north korea and talk it all out "
Funny, but the last ultra-liberal we had in office--Roosevelt --wasn't very hesitant about dealing with our enemies head-on.
The difference between him and this administration is that he actually knew who our enemies were.
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tradmanclimbs
Ice climber
Pomfert VT
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Apr 30, 2008 - 10:02am PT
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What happens if Obama is a great president and the black community writes it off as him not being black enough?? INMOP The Black community is at a point where they have to stop pointing fingers at White america, stop dwelling on the past and clean up their own house.
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tradmanclimbs
Ice climber
Pomfert VT
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Apr 30, 2008 - 12:56pm PT
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God helps those who help themselfs. Reading the history of the 101st airborne in WWll the guys commented on all the diferent towns they leveled and then occupyed and then moved on. Of all the cultures they encountered in their violent traveles accross Africa nd Europe they liked the Germans the most. In the German towns as soon as the shells barely stopped falling the men women and children were out in the street clearing rubble, making orderly stacks of the bricks, sorting material that could be recycled from that which needed to be disposed of and they started to rebuild.
In sharp contrast to that picture when I saw the one year anniversary special on katrina I see fat lazy people sitting on their doorstep drinking 40s complaneing that the streets are still full of debris from the storm and govt has not done anything about it?? WTF! Should the govt have done more? ABSOLUTLY! Do I have much sympathy for someone who sits on their doorstep drinking hooch for a year and then complains that no one cleaned up their street? Not much........
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
Arid-zona
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Apr 30, 2008 - 01:57pm PT
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LEB we hardly "inadvertantly" killed civilians in WWII. It was very, very deliberate. I don't think you could call the dropping of 2 atom bombs on civilian cities and the firebombing of Dresden "whoops" incidents.
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tradmanclimbs
Ice climber
Pomfert VT
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Apr 30, 2008 - 03:06pm PT
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Leb, mabey you or your ancestors are responsible for slavery but I got news for you. I didn't do any of that sh#t. My ancestors were in europe dealing with thier own socio economic problems. As far as the Black comunity in this country, it really is time to STFU quit your effing whineing and pull yourselfs out of the endless cycle of drugs, alchohol and Violence. You could say the same thing about the poor whites in this country except the poor whites arn't makeing any appreciable noise about their situation. They seem to be content to sit in front of the TV watching JackASS and NASCAR getting morbidly obease on coors/bud lite weed and fake orange colored chips..... Additionaly despite being arguably better armed the poor whites don't seem to kill each other in large enough numbers to raise any appreciable blips on the radar screen...
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bookworm
Social climber
Falls Church, VA
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 30, 2008 - 03:32pm PT
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LEB
we, the country, didn't "capture" anybody in africa...we (meaning people long dead) bought africans from other africans who had been capturing and enslaving africans long before any africans even saw a white man (meaning left brain euros not right brain albinos)...and guess what, if you want a slave today, the easiest way to get one would be to go to africa and buy one from an african since africa is one of the few places in the world that still openly practices slavery (of africans, of course)
i'm not denying the horrors of slavery/racism--just finished teaching faulkner's absalom, absalom!, which portrays the horrors better than any other book american or african--but to claim that the challenges facing black americans today can be traced directly to the slave trade is absurd...and i'm not ignoring jim crow or the kkk or continued racism against blacks (and others), i'm simply saying that as long as black americans blame racism for their problems and ignore the progress we've made (see above list of notable black americans in very powerful positions) and expect the government to fix their problems (a job for which the government has proven profoundly incapable) then their problems will only increase and foster resentment not only from white people but also other minorities (especially those who come to this country with no money, no job, and no language skills but who embrace the countless opportunities offered by america and overcome their own obstacles)
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Caveman
climber
Cumberland Plateau
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Apr 30, 2008 - 03:51pm PT
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http://www.ralphmag.org/BU/slavery.html
The link above is for LEB and anyone else a bit foggy on the slavery issue. Not the whole story but a good snapshot and perhaps not even one cracker involved.
In the words of Champ Ferguson..."they shouldn't have come down here!" The previous sentence is for the yankees. Champ sure had their cure! caveman
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tradmanclimbs
Ice climber
Pomfert VT
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Apr 30, 2008 - 05:00pm PT
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LEB; Additionaly I am a Damn Yankee from the half of the country that said NO to slavery and fought and bled to end it... Don't EVER even fckin think about blameing Me for your problems. I got my own damn problems......
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, Ca.
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Apr 30, 2008 - 05:05pm PT
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Who is the nastier person, the drug user or the drug dealer?
Maybe Caveman's point is that we've recognized that slavery is wrong and made it illegal, the Arab slave-traders are still at it.
Instead of reparations by the U.S. maybe we could get reparations from the Arab slave states in the form of oil. But that wouldn't fly because to them there's nothing wrong with slavery.
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bookworm
Social climber
Falls Church, VA
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 30, 2008 - 05:10pm PT
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if i may...
the point is that slavery never was a white thing or a european thing or, especially, an american thing but black americans like the good reverend continue to heap all their anger and bitterness on america...if you insist on claiming that modern problems within the black community are rooted in slavery, then you must include in your blame all those responsible for slavery
and consider this...pat buchanan wrote an article several years ago arguing that the descendants of slaves in america have much better lives than those who never left africa, which certainly explains why so many africans want to live in america and so few black americans want to live in africa
here's an interesting article on how the good reverend is helping the black community:
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB120952079425155103.html?mod=opinion_journal_federation
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