Discussion Topic |
|
This thread has been locked |
JuanDeFuca
Big Wall climber
Stoney Point
|
|
|
Dec 14, 2006 - 01:30pm PT
|
I am praying for the guys. But it looks very very grim.
JDF
|
|
Off White
climber
Tenino, WA
|
|
|
Dec 14, 2006 - 02:53pm PT
|
Portland is full of qualified folks, and the assorted rescue outfits involved are both excellent and very experienced with that mountain. They are not calling for additional volunteer searchers right now, but suggesting that people consider volunteering and getting trained so that the next time this comes up they will be in a position to help. That's a great idea for folks to consider wherever you call home.
|
|
Lambone
Ice climber
Ashland, Or
|
|
|
Dec 14, 2006 - 03:22pm PT
|
Jodys evil Twin, this was posted on cascadeclimbers by "sobo:"
This message is from the WA State SAR Coordinator at the Emergency Management Division in Olympia. It's as high as it gets.
"Due to the ongoing SAR incident on Mt. Hood I thought I'd remind everyone of the policy on resource requests from Oregon.
There is no interstate mutual aid agreement in effect with Oregon. Therefore, we can not issue a Washington State mission number in support of such requests and any volunteers responding will not be covered under the Emergency Worker Program.
If we do receive a request for resources from Oregon (usually from an Oregon based LE agency or state emergency management) we always make this clear to them and ask for a point of contact. We will then advise those Washington State jurisdictions with the appropriate type units of the request from Oregon and emphasize that no Washington State mission number will be issued and that any volunteers interested in responding may contact the Oregon jurisdiction conducting the operation to determine what coverage, if any, there is.
Of course, the same policy is in effect if the request comes directly to the your agencies or volunteer units from Oregon counterparts."
Also posted by searcher sean_beanntan
"In the field were Portland Mountain Rescue, Eugene Mountain Rescue, Corvallis Mountain Rescue, Crag Rats, 304th Pararescue, NorthWest Search and Rescue, Mountainwave, Forest Service Personnel, Clackamas County Personnel. I apologize if i have forgotten anyone. Most teams well capable of keeping searchers in the field every day.
|
|
Brew Monkey
Big Wall climber
Bend Oregon
|
|
|
Dec 14, 2006 - 03:41pm PT
|
As of this morning the climbers still had not been found, but there is still hope. From the local news this morning they stated that a cell phone was turned on tuesday night around 10:30pm, but no call was made. The FBI is now involved and is trying to locate the position of the cell phone. We are expecting more storms through the weekend with high winds. The search is still on, although the weather is pinning down the search above 7500ft.
|
|
healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
|
|
|
Dec 14, 2006 - 03:57pm PT
|
It's grizzly enough in downtown PDX and it's howling at the coast and getting worse tonight. The conditions on Hood are completely desperate and beyond miserable for the moment and likely to stay that way for at least one more day.
Hood River, Bend, and PDX are collectively stacked with top notch climbers and alpinists, and many of the folks in Hood River grew up on the mountain. Perceptions to the contrary are quite misplaced.
|
|
Wheatus
Social climber
CA
|
|
|
Dec 14, 2006 - 04:23pm PT
|
About twenty years ago I heard a story first hand about two climbers who were climbing a new route on Mt Shuksan in the North Casades during winter. A huge storm moved in for about five days. They both knew the risk of winter climbing and were prepared for an extended stay. They built a snow cave high up the route and waited out the storm. When the storm finished they waited another day for the avalanche danger to diminish. They descend to their car and drove home.
When they reached home they found out that a huge search and rescue operation was still ongoing. They notified the authorities and were forced to pay all resque costs. They fought it out in court and had the fines reduced substantially based on there preparation and ability to self rescue.
I hope the outcome for the stranded climbers on Mt Hood results in their safe return.
Winter climbing is unpredictable. If they were ill prepared and therefore negligent they should pay the rescue costs. If they were prepared for the unpredictable weather then the rescue costs should not be on their backs. Climbers should be self sufficient as possible. Rescue personal die fairly regularly trying to help stranded climbers.
The problem is when to rescue and when to wait. Unfortunately, there is no way the authorities can know if a rescue is needed. Either way the authorities have to err on the safe side.
Twenty five years ago in the Italian Alps I broke my ankle on the descent. I crawled for over two days to the road. We had paid for rescue insurance (cheap in Europe) and had a two-way radio with the rescue frequencies. I could have called them at no cost. I was very scared about the helicopter rescue/ride if we called for help. However, self rescue seemed the right thing even though two days of crawling through car sized talus was excruiating.
|
|
JuanDeFuca
Big Wall climber
Stoney Point
|
|
|
Dec 14, 2006 - 04:47pm PT
|
Seems to me that a type of Space Suit could be built for Mountaineering that could provide a warm enviroment using a RTG and withstand 100MPH Winds.
JDF
|
|
Majid_S
Mountain climber
Bay Area
|
|
|
Dec 14, 2006 - 05:56pm PT
|
FJCruiserBOB
"walk by dying climbers"
funny
|
|
Apocalypsenow
Trad climber
Cali
|
|
|
Dec 14, 2006 - 06:13pm PT
|
Seems to me looking at a weather report is a good idea. I have bagged a few peaks in winter (mostly Mt. Washington in NH), but we would back off if the weather looked bad.
Early in my ice/snow climbing...I was taught by my mentor about Herr getting "lost" on the mountain. He took a lot of "grief," mostly due to the fact that one of his rescuers died in an avalanche.
|
|
Lambone
Ice climber
Ashland, Or
|
|
|
Dec 14, 2006 - 07:23pm PT
|
"Most of those elite climbers around Seattle are selfish "walk by dying climbers" just to bag a peak.They may get up there but I doubt they have the balls to help someone."
wtf?
dude, you need to check yourself before you wreck yourself!
|
|
JuanDeFuca
Big Wall climber
Stoney Point
|
|
|
Dec 14, 2006 - 07:54pm PT
|
Nancy Grace makes me sick.
I would rather spend the evening with Greta.
JDF
|
|
Hangerlessbolt
Trad climber
Portland, OR
|
|
|
Dec 14, 2006 - 11:44pm PT
|
gnarly up here...wind howling...rain blowing sideways...power outages...it's ugly
tomorrow night...looks like it might ease off
just need to pull through the next 24-36 hours...
F*#k, I can't even imagine
|
|
WBraun
climber
|
|
|
Dec 15, 2006 - 12:16am PT
|
Reading healyje's and Hangerlessbolts posts makes me feel griped.
It would seem that those poor guys up on that mountain would be nothing short of a miracle to survive these horrendous conditions.
|
|
nvrws
climber
|
|
|
Dec 15, 2006 - 12:26am PT
|
I can't help but think of the epic tale of survival on the first winter ascent of Denali.. read the book -80 below. Ray Genet and others trapped in a cave for what? 5-7 days at altitude crazy winds.. most survived. Ya gotta believe these guys can too. My hope is the two that went to get help realized the conditions were unfavorable and beat feet back to the same cave and they're all together making one huge ass condocave.
|
|
sling512
Trad climber
Chicago
|
|
|
Dec 15, 2006 - 10:06am PT
|
I found this on the Portland Mountain Rescue site, (http://www.pmru.org);:
Portland Mountain Rescue (PMR) has been receiving many generous offers from the public to assist for the rescue of the 3 climbers on Mt. Hood, including from people with strong mountaineering and emergency medicine backgrounds.
PMR appreciates these offers of assistance, but our major hurdles in this rescue have been poor weather conditions and extremely high avalanche hazards. We are not in the position of requiring human resources from the general public. We have sixty field-deployable rescuers within our unit who are highly trained to affect rescues in these conditions and who have the ability to judge conditions and avoid overly hazardous situations. There are also numerous other mountain rescue teams in our area which we can call upon if resources are needed.
Additionally, mountain rescue is a hazardous endeavor which requires specific skills and training. Teams must be cohesive, trained on the same standards, and know each others abilities and limitations.
Portland Mountain Rescue has a rigorous application and training program to ensure that our rescuers are as safe as possible. Taking members of the general public or climbing community into the field without specific mountain rescue training creates a greater risk to all rescuers and the potential of more accidents on the mountain.
Those having strong mountaineering skills wishing to participate in mountain rescue on a long-term basis should follow our standard application process, posted on our website at: http://www.pmru.org/aboutpmr.html
Those wishing to help mountain rescue, but who do not have mountaineering skills, are encouraged to donate to their local mountain rescue teams.
Portland Mountain Rescue is a 501c3 entirely volunteer rescue organization with no paid employees. As with many other mountain rescue organizations, we exist solely to “save lives through rescue and mountain safety education.”
Any questions can be directed to us at: info@pmru.org
Lastly, Portland Mountain Rescue would like to thank the community and everyone who has offered their support on this difficult rescue.
Sincerely,
Steve Rollins
President
Portland Mountain Rescue
|
|
sling512
Trad climber
Chicago
|
|
|
Dec 15, 2006 - 12:27pm PT
|
Update from 12/14's Search Activities
Mt. Hood Search For 3 Climbers - Update December 14, 2006
During the day on Thursday, there were no PMR activities in the field on the South side of Mt. Hood. On the North side, two PMR Rescue-level members responded to a request from the Hood River County Sheriff for team leaders to lead other search volunteers into the field today. Both PMR members worked on the same team today and searched to 7400' on Cooper Spur. They searched the Cooper Spur shelter and found no evidence of the missing climbers. They reported that it rained heavily the entire day up to at least 8000' and that the top layers of the snow are completely saturated with rainwater, adding to the instability of the snowpack on steeper slopes. Both men will stay at Cloud Cap tonight and will search the North side again tomorrow, weather permitting. PMR's Rescue Committee will be meeting this evening to develop plans for resuming search activities once the weather breaks. There will also be a planning meeting this evening at the Hood River County Sheriff's office to plan future search activities on the North side. The Clackamas County Sheriff's office will have representatives there so that search plans for both sides of the mountain will be coordinated. PMR will have a representative in this meeting as well, to report on how PMR fits into those plans.
|
|
JuanDeFuca
Big Wall climber
Stoney Point
|
|
|
Dec 15, 2006 - 12:45pm PT
|
Did they have a stove and fuel?
How long can one go with say a liter of fuel and a MSR Stove in a snow cave?
JDF
|
|
Brian in SLC
Social climber
Salt Lake City, UT
|
|
|
Dec 15, 2006 - 01:34pm PT
|
Did they have a stove and fuel?
I'm not sure. I'd imagine so, given their route and game plan. You'd need a stove for water this time of year, anywhere on the mountain. Anyone know if they planned a high camp? I'd think so.
How long can one go with say a liter of fuel and a MSR Stove in a snow cave?
Typically around .2 to .25 liter of fuel per man day, is what some folks use for planning purposes.
I'm just wondering, if it were me, and I was on a one night bivy up high, if I'd have even a full liter. I'd probably have a .8 liter MSR Ti bottle and it might be partly (and most likely mostly) used from a night brew for dinner and a morning brew for breakfast on summit day.
I'd imagine any fuel they had with has been gone since probably Sunday or Monday. Be a hard thing to ration in the cold.
Could have been a canister type stove too. I wonder if they had more than one stove, though. If they apparently split up, that'd make it tougher. Light and fast can be a diminishing return if things don't go per plan.
They could still be hangin' in there. Time is not on their side, though. I can't imagine worse weather to try to either move in, or stick out.
Man, I hope they find them....
-Brian in SLC
|
|
Lambone
Ice climber
Ashland, Or
|
|
|
Dec 15, 2006 - 03:07pm PT
|
They brought a stove and some fuel I'm sure, maybe two. But they were only planning to be on the mountain two days, so I'm sure their fuel is long gone by now.
My hope is the two that went to get help realized the conditions were unfavorable and beat feet back to the same cave and they're all together making one huge ass condocave.
yeah mee too, because I can't even bear to think of that poor guy alone up top.
|
|
|
SuperTopo on the Web
|
Avalanche Warning 
Let us know!