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More Air
Big Wall climber
S.L.C.
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Nov 21, 2006 - 12:35am PT
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Jello:
Speaking of the S Direct in Little Cottonwood, I'd love to hear any details about your ascent: What kind of shoes were you wearing? Did you & George take any falls? Ted Wilson told me that he did the climb with Chuck Pratt a long time ago. He said that Chuck was way impressed, He loved LCC.
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Mimi
climber
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Nov 21, 2006 - 12:36am PT
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For shizzle, Werner. Jello, didn't you solo a new route on the Eiger? That must've been pretty interesting.
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Jello
Social climber
No Ut
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Nov 21, 2006 - 12:36am PT
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Werner- as you know, without fear, there's not much of an experience. I had fear on the climb, but used it to keep me safe.
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WBraun
climber
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Nov 21, 2006 - 12:40am PT
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Wow
I thought I was the only guy who was scared. And scared to be safe, I never thought of that angle, makes sense.
Edit; weschrist, are you sure?
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Jaybro
Social climber
The West
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Nov 21, 2006 - 12:45am PT
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cool stuff Jello, I want to read about that one.
"Of course, sport climbing didn't exist before power drills...but that's a different topic. Sort of."
Maybe, but I've put up dozens of sportclimbs groundup on hooks. Some of them might be before I heard of the Bosch, not sure, though.
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Jello
Social climber
No Ut
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Nov 21, 2006 - 12:52am PT
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OK, so my second Bloody Mary is kicking in, so forgive me, please...
Air- I was 16 at the time George and I did S-Direct. I wore an old pair of after-ski boots with holes in the soles (no bullshit). I had earlier repeated the Dorsal Fin in these, with George. I got the crux pitch on the Direct, and had my first experience of wandering from chickenhead to chickenhead, placing 1/4" bolts by hand. I loved it! There were no falls - we didn't fall back then, except very rarely.
Mimi- yes, I did a new route on the Eiger, and that will be in the book, but it was too big to capture in a sentence or two. The abreviated version will be posted pretty soon, though. Thanks for your continued interest in the experience - as in Jimi Hendricks.
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Jello
Social climber
No Ut
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Nov 21, 2006 - 01:00am PT
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Wes- you really do seem to be certain, but I don't think I'm stupid. Just my opinion, though. When I repeat a route, I feel like I'm having a communication with the pioneers - learning from their perspective, and growing. You seem to climb for different reasons. I doubt whether you're stupid, though.
Best,
-Jeff
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Jello
Social climber
No Ut
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Nov 21, 2006 - 01:14am PT
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Actually, wes, as long as protection can be placed, I see no problem with a roped party placing protection on a route that was first soloed.
You use the word "reasonable" a lot in these discussions. What is reasonable at all in taking risks climbing? A reasonable person avoids such "stupid" risks.
But, really, I know what you're driving at. It's just my opinion that climbing is an art, and the FA is an artwork.
Peace,
-Jeff
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Mimi
climber
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Nov 21, 2006 - 01:34am PT
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Isn't the character of a route directly related to the amount of risk one faces on said route? The TR is a great equalizer; all fun, less risk. But, alas, less prestige.
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Jaybro
Social climber
The West
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Nov 21, 2006 - 01:41am PT
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"When you're the world's most famous toproper you take your life in your own hands every day."
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Mimi
climber
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Nov 21, 2006 - 01:44am PT
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Especially if you're soloing with only one mini-Traxion. Sorry for the CT.
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WBraun
climber
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Nov 21, 2006 - 01:57am PT
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"The average American rarely thinks of death,...."
Are you sure?
Edit: and on "freestone" Geek towers Kauk ran it out on one pitch up there (face) some scary sequential moves. I asked him once why he didn't place a bolt to protect the thing.
He said "I was just climbing and never thought I needed one."
No chest beating, and that's just the way it goes on first ascents sometimes. Guys are just climbing ......
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Jello
Social climber
No Ut
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Nov 21, 2006 - 01:58am PT
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Wes- I'm headed to bed. But I should have specified "natural" protection. I didn't mean bolts. I do have to say, though, that you can do what you want, but if you modify an existing route with additionl bolts, I will just consider you disrespectful of those who climbed first. Not every climb needs to be for every climber. There are plenty of routes to choose from, whatever your abilities or style prefence.
You seem hostile and uncomfortable with the reality of different perspectives. But, then, we all have our triggers.
-Jello
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Mimi
climber
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Nov 21, 2006 - 02:01am PT
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Wes, it sounds like you're all about instant gratification. There's nothing more fun than working to get better in order to do a route on the list. That includes being solid enough as a 5.8 climber to not fall off runout 5.6. If you don't practice these skills, you'll never have them. Which makes a huge safety difference, especially in the mountains.
Edit: Spare the runout, spoil the climber.
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mtwoodsonguide
Big Wall climber
San Diego
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Nov 21, 2006 - 02:15am PT
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last weekend Tahquitz, me, your mom, and a Bosch Anihilator.
the text to be linked here
course you gotta tr it first at most crags because the finished product is what really matters
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MisterE
Trad climber
Bellingham, WA
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Nov 21, 2006 - 02:27am PT
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RULE #1: The first ascentionist's approach MUST BE RESPECTED!
RULE #2: If you feel this is no longer applicable, you MUST ASK THE FIRST ASCENTIONIST IF YOU MAY MAKE CHANGES.
RULE #3: If the response doesn't make any sense, see Rule #1
Erik
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mtwoodsonguide
Big Wall climber
San Diego
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Nov 21, 2006 - 02:34am PT
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Whoahwhoahwhoa misterE there can only be one Erik with a K from Washington here and you are not it little man.
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Todd Gordon
Trad climber
Joshua Tree, Cal
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Nov 21, 2006 - 02:45am PT
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It's all just a game;....and fun is one of the main reasons for climbing. I personally do F A's ground up;....it's fun for me. Others think differently;....have your fun the way you see fit. My granny can rap bolt....She can also put em' up on the lead;...more proud in my book....(You should see her on the lead hauling up the powerdrill with her false teeth...).
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bhilden
Trad climber
Mountain View, CA
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Nov 21, 2006 - 04:11am PT
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There are a zillion routes out there. Some have pro every 4-5 feet (or less), some have pro every 10+ feet, some don't have much protection. The bottom line is that there are enough routes for everyone's taste in climbing.
I would hate to see climbing protection become "lowest common denominator." Not every route has to be antiseptically safe. Some of us remember when the word "risk" was actually part of climbing termninology. Risk might not be for every climber, but please don't take it away from those for whom it is part of their experience.
Bruce
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Off White
climber
Tenino, WA
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Nov 21, 2006 - 12:19pm PT
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Werner and Jeff were off on a tangent about fear. I think of fear as my friend, it tells me to pay very close attention.
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