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chappy
Social climber
ventura
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Sep 25, 2006 - 11:23pm PT
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Ron, did I strike a nerve? Sorry if I did. Actually, I hate those labels--Sport climber, Trad climber. To me there is just climbing. To have to define ones self in such terms seems to invoke a sense of stylistic bigotry into a sport which I feel should trancend such a schism. The climbers I grew up with were simply climbers and enjoyed all the various disciplines of the sport. They could climb walls, wide cracks, thin cracks, bolted face routes, mountains and ice. Steep bolted face routes are just one more unique facet to an all around wonderful game. How does one define a Lynn Hill? Or an Alex Huber? Tommy Caldwell?? They are simply climbers. Very very good climbers. In part because they could transcend definition and stylistic bigotry in our sport.
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Sep 26, 2006 - 12:10am PT
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Sport climbing is a misnomer. The real sport is in trad.
I really have no idea what sport crack climbing is.
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Standing Strong
Mountain climber
the trail
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Sep 26, 2006 - 01:11am PT
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I just read this a second time. Thanks again.
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Bruce Morris
Social climber
Belmont, California
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Sep 26, 2006 - 03:27am PT
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Yes, Peter, your surmise about the state of Bev, Barry and Jim is very much correct: Bates described how they were laughing and giggling as they ripped up huge mats of munge off the ledge and hurled them down on the top of the Cookie. Sounds like there was quite a pile of the stuff up there orginally.
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426
Sport climber
Buzzard Point, TN
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Sep 26, 2006 - 07:53am PT
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Thanks Mr. Haan, always appreciated.
Does this story end the long standing notion that the Bird was "the consumate trad"?
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Sep 26, 2006 - 07:56am PT
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Where has this notion been standing so long?
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426
Sport climber
Buzzard Point, TN
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Sep 26, 2006 - 08:08am PT
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I dunno, PR, everyone I talk to tends to forget (or not know) about the jizzlin on WW and "other nefarious activities" done via hook or crook (i.e. rap lines).
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Tarbuster
climber
right here, right now
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Sep 26, 2006 - 01:23pm PT
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While this could lead to another lengthy descent onto an ethical dogpile, I recommend we don't go there and say we did; not to skirt the matter, but it is what it is (was).
Although perhaps not well known by a younger generation, these are not secrets.
Sure, while that enhancement/rapping stuff can be run down, (given the inscrutable ethics of some of the protagonists of various era) and I wouldn't support those chiseling/pinning activities per se, Bridwell likewise dispensed an inestimable legacy of achievement, mentorship, and vision to the evolution of our activity.
Jim's constitution embodies a lot of characteristics:
Adventurer, athlete, innovator, aid climber, free climber, alpinist, irreverent instigator.
He ain't and wasn't pure as the driven snow.
Let's continue to foster and enjoy the free flow of historical reportage,
(and perhaps move the collateral discourse up to another thread).
Cheers,
Roy.
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chappy
Social climber
ventura
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Sep 26, 2006 - 03:32pm PT
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I agree whole heartedly Roy. Largo and I used to refer to Jim as the Saint because he certainly wasn't a purest but the term was used in a light hearted manner and not meant as any type of slur. Jim was an innovator, an outside the box sort of the thinker, and as such pushed the envelope of what techniques would or wouldn't be accepted by future generations. The thing was we didn't always know what was "right" or "wrong" we made it up as we went along. As such the sport developed and found its own way. It was a fun journey and the history of that journey is what we should be enjoying. Jim was a great mentor to myself, Largo, Kevin--indeed our whole generation. He turned us on to so many great routes, shared in so many unforgettable experiences. Bravo Jim!
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Largo
Sport climber
Venice, Ca
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Sep 26, 2006 - 04:29pm PT
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Jim was very aware of the "Top Dog" standing of Americans in the world rock clmbing arena of the early 70s. Excepting a few Brits and a Frenchie and two Germans, most all the other climbers of every nation would come to Yosemite and flail like crazy, or be so specialized that they climbed within very narrow margins. The Bird was the leading dude on making sure the Americans continued marching point in this regard--and he made sure he dragged along whoever was willing. We all were young enough that he seemed to know everything--an attitude we slowly grew out of but by that time we'd adopted his approach to go after the biggest, baddest thing out there every time, so far as we could.
The rest of the world quickly caught us but while it lasted it sure was an experience to ride the cutting edge and to be so young in the process. There were a lot of epics and even more friendships forged from the adventures of that era and many of us came to know each other through The Bird, who was a sort of Mr. Chips of Camp Four back in the day . . .
If you're looking for perfection, look elsewhere; if you want to see a died-in-the-wool adventurer, you need look no farther than The Bird.
JL
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Peter Haan
Trad climber
San Francisco, CA
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Topic Author's Reply - Sep 26, 2006 - 07:35pm PT
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At this point, I'd like to refer some of you to previous Bridwell stories I wrote here recently. Use the ST search function, you will find them. They are really fun. Largo,
Chappy, myself, and perhaps another hundred climbers, love this man. HIs leadership was incomparable. And what a relief from the prior "church ladies" we had in the sixties.
"Driving Miss Bridwell"
and
"A Brief Walk with Bridwell"
and here is a photo I took of him at an odd moment,
enjoy & best, P.
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Roger Breedlove
climber
Cleveland Heights, Ohio
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Sep 26, 2006 - 08:19pm PT
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Those are great stories, Peter. Thanks.
Here are a couple of my you-got-to-love-the guy-stories to add [url="http://www.supertopo.com/climbing/thread.html?topic_id=68084&msg=68126#msg68126"]Bridwell’s new shoes[/url]
And [url="http://www.supertopo.com/climbing/thread.html?topic_id=88565&msg=88565#msg88565"]The first ascent of ‘Hoodwink’ or Bridwell’s ‘recreation’ day[/url]
Best, Roger
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Mighty Hiker
Social climber
Vancouver, B.C.
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Sep 30, 2006 - 01:40am PT
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More wonderful stories - thanks, Peter and all.
I did Nabisco Wall in spring 1977 with Rick LeDuc. Quite the adventure. He led Wheat Thin, using opposed nuts as a directional, and I still remember being surprised at how delicate the lower layback was, and how relatively easy the flake was.
Have the bolts on Wheat Thin ever been replaced? The original bolts must have held a few long, but fairly low impact, falls.
As the thread has sometimes wavered (he he) toward Butterballs, here are some photos from Mountain of early ascents.
Does anyone know about the origins of white painter pants for climbing?
Anders
Mountain 31 - January 1974. From Jim Bridwell's article "Brave New World", about what was happening in the Valley. The caption in part says "The final link in the chain of pitches comprising the Nabisco Wall was added by Henry Barber in 1973. Belayed by George Myers, he is seen (right) starting the vicious finger-jamming crack called Butterballs that leads directly up from the Waverly Wafer to Butterfingers." (credit Jib Knight)
The article has lots of other classic photos, which might be scanned.
Mountain 36 - June 1974. This picture may be of Dale Bard. Caption "Butterballs on the Nabisco Wall in Yosemite Valley." (credit Gene Foley)
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Mighty Hiker
Social climber
Vancouver, B.C.
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Sep 30, 2006 - 02:56am PT
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I can scan and post the article, but am not sure if that is acceptable. Copyright and such. Mountain went out of business in 1991 (?), but those who wrote the articles and took the pictures may still care, and someone may still hold the rights to Mountain.
There's lots and lots of things that could be scanned and posted, if permissible. Comments, anyone?
Anders
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426
Sport climber
Buzzard Point, TN
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Sep 30, 2006 - 12:30pm PT
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continue to foster and enjoy the free flow of historical reportage
I agree wholeheartedly Tarby...I just can't bear to hear T-Warriors time and time again use the Bird as a giant trad strawman when the man himself was bleedin' out rap bolting...superalpinist and "viZionAreee" sport climber seem mutually exclusive to some but a few like Brid and Gullich seem to have crossed beyond "mere labels"
Can they handle "the truth" Tar?
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Sep 30, 2006 - 12:37pm PT
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Maybe they can't handle the truth but having the chutzpah to do it in the early 70s still shows that he pushed the envelope.
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426
Sport climber
Buzzard Point, TN
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Sep 30, 2006 - 12:41pm PT
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In more ways than one
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Sep 30, 2006 - 01:32pm PT
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Would you, perchance, be refering to candor?
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Bruce Morris
Social climber
Belmont, California
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Sep 30, 2006 - 05:57pm PT
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"Does anyone know about the origins of white painter pants for climbing?"
According to what I heard once, Royal Robbins used to paint houses in the off-season for his wife's father in Modesto. RR just kept the white painter's paints and hat on when he went back to the Big Ditch.
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Tarbuster
climber
right here, right now
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426 & Ron,
Man I'm good with all that.
'Nice painters pants history Bruce.
Hey whutabout Peter Haans upthread reference to "Church Ladies" as Bridwell's Predecessors!
Haan: "His leadership was incomparable. And what a relief from the prior "church ladies" we had in the sixties."
Bwahahaha.
I just love to laugh and that was way too funny...
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