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Ward Trotter
Trad climber
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Here is a key excerpt from a speech given by Hillary Clinton early last month :
"This is what we call smart power," Clinton said to a small audience at Georgetown. "Using every possible tool and partner to advance peace and security. Leaving no one on the sidelines. Showing respect even for one's enemies. Trying to understand, in so far as psychologically possible, empathize with their perspective and point of view. Helping to define the problems, determine the solutions. That is what we believe in the 21st century will change -- change the prospects for peace."
Showing respect ...even for our enemies.
This is the sort of deranged,incompetent thinking in play within the French government and they share the same general unfortunate mentality and failed approach as Clinton and Obama.
The Socialists in France are eager to pack as many government-dependent poor Muslims into France as possible, as a means to shortsighted political dominance, much like our own open border situation. They are rapidly losing control of who or what is entering their nation as the numbers soar .
This situation has resulted in a Balkanization of Paris, and other large cities in Europe, into Muslim enclaves where even police and fire fighters will not go.
These types of on-going mass murders will continue as long as we in the West choose the wrong people to lead us. It is an open invitation to radical militant Islam---who view our current crop of political leaders as absolute fools.
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chacha
Mountain climber
Fontainebleau, FRANCE
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I'm French, I'm reading your posts from France and I would like to tell you that I'm very sad of what happened today.
Saying that there are more mosques to churches in France now, or that France is an islamic country, is not true.
Condolences to the families and friends of the 12 people who died.
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High Fructose Corn Spirit
Gym climber
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The Socialists in France are eager to pack as many government-dependent poor Muslims into France as possible...
I think they might be having a change of mind?
.....
Condolences to the families and friends of the 12 people who died.
For sure.
Chacha,
Ward wrote...
This situation has resulted in a Balkanization of Paris into enclaves where even police and fire fighters will not go.
Is this true?
......
http://www.theonion.com/articles/no-one-murdered-because-of-this-image,29553/
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Ward Trotter
Trad climber
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Chacha:
Like us in the US ,you need to get rid of the current crop of morons that are running your country ---or the events of today will only become commonplace.
HFCS: They're called "no go zones"
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High Fructose Corn Spirit
Gym climber
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Ward, btw, what is with your commas? what's the deal there?
EDIT: Well, it makes me worry about you. ;)
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Ward Trotter
Trad climber
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Lol....woo..I suddenly feel so marginalized.
I like this sudden shift to this being all about me.
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chacha
Mountain climber
Fontainebleau, FRANCE
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HFCS and WT, your argument is too tricky for my bad English... and I cannot explain what I'm thinking as I would like to.
There are poor people in some countries in France. Not only muslims. In those countries, the police and the firemen can go but it can be dangerous for them. I think that it is case in other places than France.
12 journalists / drawers were killed today by people who wanted to get rid of people of freely express their opinion.
Freedom is the real issue.
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Showing respect ...even for our enemies.
This is the sort of deranged,incompetent thinking in play within the French government and they share the same general unfortunate mentality and failed approach as Clinton and Obama.
That is F-d up Ward. Throughout thousands of years of history warriors have respected their enemies for their conviction, courage, strength and willingness to die for their cause.
You've never heard of this?
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Ward Trotter
Trad climber
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Survival:
Now you've got to be smart enough to know that the mutual respect held by warriors in battle is not what Clinton is talking about here. Far,far from it. She is outlining a specific public policy approach, rooted in the appeasement aspect of her political ideology,in dealing with people like ISIS ,or the Jihadists who murdered these innocent people today.
At the forefront of her approach would be having respect for them. In her own words.
And this from a former SofS.
If you are a supporter of this kind of thinking aren't you just a little bit embarrassed , at the very least?
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kev
climber
A pile of dirt.
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Showing respect ...even for our enemies.
This is the sort of deranged,incompetent thinking in play within the French government and they share the same general unfortunate mentality and failed approach as Clinton and Obama.
That is F-d up Ward. Throughout thousands of years of history warriors have respected their enemies for their conviction, courage, strength and willingness to die for their cause.
You've never heard of this?
Survival - it's one thing to learn, understand and respect them from a Sun Tzu perspective but that's not what Hillary was suggesting. Her statement appears more touchy feely - not strategic. I'm with Ward on this.
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kev
climber
A pile of dirt.
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Chacha,
We too have areas in large cities that the firemen and police aren't too safe in. And yes they're poorer neighborhoods.
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High Fructose Corn Spirit
Gym climber
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Truth is, Survival, you along with a couple others here, are out of your depth - plain as day - at least in relating to the criticism. Just as the media is out of its depth plain as day in various reports concerning the Dawn Wall attempt.
If you had a lifetime experience (1) in science and science edu and (2) growing up and having to compare the models that both science and Abrahamic religion promote comprised of truth-claims for how the world works, (3) in the study (not taken lightly) of how these models not only conflict often at great cost but also shape belief and conduct individually and socially or culturally ... together with interest or passion for said stuff... I submit you might have a different orientation or "take" re said religion (Abrahamic) or religions (partic, f Christianity or f Islam).
Historically, as a nation, we've been equally (a) scientifically inexperienced and (b) theologically inexperienced (due largely to our judeochristian monolithic and monotheistic country) and this has had its csqs. But in recent years, this has been changing rapidly. Hope lies in social media-driven international community awareness and young people.
"A scientific truth does not triumph by convincing its opponents and making them see the light, but rather because its opponents eventually die and a new generation grows up that is familiar with it." -Max Planck
http://www.theonion.com/articles/no-one-murdered-because-of-this-image,29553/
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Ward, I don't believe anyone said appease ISIS except you. If you don't respect their conviction or their ability to carry out acts you will get your ass kicked.
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WBraun
climber
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Hillary Clinton should shut her lying big hypocritical fat mouth.
She's criminal and you stoopid Americans want her as your POTUS.
She's been outed along with the other bitch Victoria Nuland as throwing the coup d’état in Ukraine killing many innocent people along with destroying that countries established govt.
You Americans and your fuked up stooopid media.
Brainwashed stooopid Americans
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LearningTrad
Trad climber
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This thread makes me miss Rong.
I think I'll shoot him another email of support.
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High Fructose Corn Spirit
Gym climber
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BREAKING...
Three suspects arrested. (Edit: Yes, Survival, or at least identified.)
(I'm sure they were just atheist fundamentalists again, shouting "Allahu Akbar" to slander the Religion of Peace.)
and speaking of Fareed Z, a tweet from him minutes ago...
"Can we please see the leaders of Egypt, Pakistan and Saudi Arabia condemn the acts of terror - on TV." Zakaria
We'll see.
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kev
climber
A pile of dirt.
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HFC - may be we need to have a good science book burning. They're using the writings of people like Cantor, Russel, and good old Sir Isaac to radicalize us.
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High Fructose Corn Spirit
Gym climber
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Well, kev, as a science zealot (ha!), I'm sure if they ever caricatured Newton or Einstein or Darwin or the g*ds forbid, Carl Sagan... well that would be the last straw - and I'd surely then go postal!
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Three suspects arrested.
Ummmmm......
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