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mucci
Trad climber
The pitch of Bagalaar above you
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At least BLL controls the Scurvy in the desert.
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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wbw,
emotionally vested in a route that was pivotal both in my life and in desert wall climbing?
Guilty as charged. Nor am I proud of every interaction I've had at that location.
But I haven't glued any fake bolt hangers to the wall (as it were).
This is not a question of style, and I have no wish to be known as a person that puts up hard routes, so there is no envy.
I am actually amazed at how far I've gotten in climbing as my initial efforts were so dismal.
But when one's actions affect others it becomes a question of ethics.
Trying to cause a stranger's death just to feed one's ego is about as wrong as it gets.
edit
Too nice a day to be sitting here. Ammon, shouldn't you be plummeting off something?
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ElCapPirate
Big Wall climber
Reno, Nevada
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You're telling me these are hard men and I see a case of Bud Light?
OK, maybe it's breakfast.
Whoever brought the bud lite lime should be slandered.
don't be so judgemental.....it might have been on sale.
At least it wasn't Clamato-Bud
Don't look at me... I brought the Hop Rising and Jaminson, haha
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fluffy
Trad climber
Colorado
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Trying to cause a stranger's death just to feed one's ego is about as wrong as it gets.
Where is the proof? I'm not taking your word for it.
You like it if people claimed extremely slanderous and unsubstantiated shat about you here? About you trying to KILL other climbers?
JFC so sanctimonious and self-righteous yet so immature and irresponsible.
Get a grip you're just looking worse and worse with each post.
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blahblah
Gym climber
Boulder
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don't be so judgemental.....it might have been on sale.
At least it wasn't Clamato-Bud
Bud Chelada is good stuff, especially picante.
I prefer my home made mix (beer, tomato juice, and basically spicy bloody mary additives), but the premade stuff is an acceptable substitute.
As for Beyer, as an "armchair" desert aid climber (I don't do it), doesn't seem like we have enough info to draw a meaningful conclusion, but we can make some reasonable inferences.
For instance, the guy who said that Beyer doesn't care what other people do or think of him is almost certainly wrong.
Always seemed to me that climbing on decomposing towers of mud is probably not a good long term activity for those towers and for climbers generally in a world that seems to intensively scrutinize climbers' environmental impact (as minimal as that may be in the grand scheme), but what do I know.
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Just back from a fun scramble, perfect weather.
Fluffy,
no I don't have proof. Ask gumbyclimber if he recorded it. But to me it doesn't sound made up. It dovetails right into the rest of the evidence; blown out quarter inch holes with mud stuffed in them, blasted out seams, etc.
But the funny thing about the Fishers is that underneath the mud the core rock is quite hard.
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gumbyclimber
climber
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Jim told me. Period. Take it to court. It's not what somebody else told me Jim said. Jim said it to me.
Jealous and vindictive? No, sorry. Your time in Asia is going well but you haven't stayed too long yet. Jim is 1000 times the big wall climber I could have ever have prayed to be and it never crosses my mind, ever, because we aren't playing the same game.
Jim deserves to be called out for saying this kind of reprehensible garbage and I'm willing to stand up and do it. It's a community issue, not a me vs Jim issue. Jim's a big boy who should have to answer for his words and he's spread plenty of rubbish around. I think he's unfriendly, uncool, and worth calling the county sheriff about.
Sure there's a me vs Jim issue; I'm honest about that and would say it to his face. Here it is: "Hey Jim, nice to see you again. Now why don't you go sit back down there in the back of the bus, where second place is forever, and spend some time absorbing that feeling because it's not going to change. Although flattering, I was left unimpressed by your creepshow stalking act and I'm sick of you and your bully crap. I hope you've learned to be more careful before you start windmilling those haymakers because you caught me at the weakest moment in my life and I took it personally."
I know more than anyone I can think of about being blamed for people's deaths, faceless internet slander, vicious rumours etc. Hell, Cedar and I spent years playing on the fact that our names sounded the same and nobody knew who he was; Ben was actively impersonating me in Thailand while I was either reading books in the jungle or even off in Cambodia somewhere. Now there's all kinds of incredible stories about me out there that really seem to disappoint strangers. Ha!
Finally, when you filter the internet speculation and boil it down to facts there are two which were already staring us in the face and didn't need my input:
One, if Jim Beyer's words are worth anything then be careful around him and his routes. This is the only point I care too impress on the public and why I raised my voice.
Two, the three people who have anything to say about soloing Mt. Thor are allKOO KOO FOR F'N' COCOA PUFFS BOOGEDY BOOGEDTY BLAHALDKNDSNVSWTTTttt!!!. Anyway, one of them is dead and isn't known to have spoken English (which sure makes for interesting conversation); the other two will work it out like gentlemen or hyenas.
We all bow before Eric Kohl.
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drljefe
climber
El Presidio San Augustin del Tucson
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It was Jeremy for sure.
That dude'll drink anything.
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goatboy smellz
climber
लघिमा
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gumbyclimber
I believe Jim most certainly does care what people think because he told me, at least a dozen times, that he climbs to compete and to be considered the best. He also told me that he places booby trap gear on/near his routes because somebody dying on one of them is his "number one goal".
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The Larry
climber
Moab, UT
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Good point drljefe.
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klk
Trad climber
cali
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At least BLL controls the Scurvy in the desert.
not judging by this thread
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ms55401
Trad climber
minneapolis, mn
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not to detract from the, uh, dialogue, but has anyone done a Beyer route in the Teton Range?
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wbw
Trad climber
'cross the great divide
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Yo Ron, for the record, your efforts in Zion have always been inspiring to me. My first experience in Zion was nearly 30 years ago. We had driven into the park during darkness, crashed on the ground and when I woke up the next morning I thought I had found the most intensely beautiful place I could imagine. Actually, I'm not sure I could have ever imagined a place like Zion without actually being there. Once I got tuned into the climbing history there, and heard about this guy exploring those huge walls solo, that was another level of having my mind blown.
Touchstone is a beautiful route, and my experience on it 20 years ago is unforgettable. Hats off to you for the quality of routes you have chosen over the years, including Pervertical on the Diamond, and your voice in keeping the routes in Zion from becoming beat out pieces of crap.
MS: if I'm not mistaken, Caveat Emptor (or a least part of it) is a Beyer route in the Tetons, and I bet many people who participate in this forum have done it. I've alway considered it to be my favorite rock route in the range. I've heard (but haven't personally experienced) that the Beyer E. Face route on the Grand is very good.
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johnkelley
climber
Anchorage Alaska
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I've done several new routes with Beyer in Durango, the Tetons, and in the Saint Elias Range. I haven't seen any questionable ethics.
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Heyzeus
climber
Hollywood,Ca
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"Gumbyclimber"! So good to see you. When are you coming back to LA? How's the wife?
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OR
Trad climber
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So this thread took the turn to fugly. Not that I did not expect it. Not that its deserved but I remember controversy over JB as far back as the late 80's . Post on….
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The Larry
climber
Moab, UT
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Standard good bad ugly ST fair.
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Captain...or Skully
climber
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He chopped at random with abandon from "Martyrs brigade".....Eff that guy.
Maybe a truck will hit him.
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goatboy smellz
climber
लघिमा
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Never trust a carpenter or climber that works alone.
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Kalimon
Social climber
Ridgway, CO
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Never trust a carpenter or climber that works alone.
Bwaaahahahaah!
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