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Chaz
Trad climber
greater Boss Angeles area
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Dec 13, 2013 - 08:50pm PT
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Can't do nukes here.
Jane Fonda doesn't like nukes, and besides the issue was settled for good thirty-five years ago when she made China Syndrome.
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Dec 13, 2013 - 08:51pm PT
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Yeah, Madbolter, its Pandora's box, I don't like nukes that much, but we need the power.
TBC, you pm me, I'll consider it.
EDIT Chaz
Jane Fonda now has a fake knee, and has apologized for manning the AA gun.
Michael Douglas has cancer from eating pussy.
Half the people in the world were born too late to see China Syndrome.
And we have survived 2 meltdowns.
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madbolter1
Big Wall climber
Denver, CO
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Dec 13, 2013 - 08:53pm PT
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But, if I lived in the area where I have to buy a gun out of fear, I would rather move away. There is a very small chance that you would be able to use this gun in self defence.
Now I see what you were saying with the joke. Thanks.
I understand why you say what you do in this quote. However, I have had repeated personal experience with not being in a position to move away and with having my gun (and my friend's) very effectively used for self-defense and as having deterrent effect.
In general "moving away" (i.e., running) is almost always the smartest option when confronted with violence. Totally agreed! However, it is often not possible. Hence our self-defense laws. And, in principle, if everybody runs all the time, the point comes sooner than later that there remains nowhere to run.
Well, I'm done for the evening.
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madbolter1
Big Wall climber
Denver, CO
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Dec 13, 2013 - 08:55pm PT
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Jane Fonda doesn't like nukes....
Okay, cross-post.
That was AWESOME! Touche!
Now, I'm outta here.
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GDavis
Social climber
SOL CAL
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Dec 13, 2013 - 08:57pm PT
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I have the same philosophy with self defense, which is why I spar 2-3 times a week so that anyone that attacks me would get wrecked. I assume the open carry people do as well, yes?
Better hope Travyon doesn't get underhooks son.
:)
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i'm gumby dammit
Sport climber
da ow
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Topic Author's Reply - Dec 13, 2013 - 08:58pm PT
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Yup, and schools are gun-free zones by LAW. Hmmm... doesn't seem to help much. Those laws and all.
I'd love to see somebody produce credible evidence to the effect that ONE whack job EVER said to himself: "That's it! I'm gonna go shoot x number of people (or however many I can) at such and such a school (or mall). Oh, wait. I can't do that. Bringing a gun onto school (or mall) property is illegal," such that a school (or mall) being a gun-free zone kept even ONE whack job from doing the deed.
Can anybody produce even a single case where the gun-free-zone law kept a shooter in check? I would seriously like to know if such a case exists. Even one. Lots of folks are presenting valid reasons to have guns. Your arguments are convincing me there should be no guns anywhere.
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Chaz
Trad climber
greater Boss Angeles area
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Dec 13, 2013 - 09:05pm PT
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"I spar 2-3 times a week"
You're teaching yourself bad habits.
The rules you practice to keep you from killing your sparring partner won't do you any good in an actual bar fight.
If you want to get ready for a street fight, start practicing assault with a deadly weapon and attempted murder, because that's what works best in real fights.
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GDavis
Social climber
SOL CAL
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Dec 13, 2013 - 09:12pm PT
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I'm assuming this is based off of the number of times you've done this yes?
WE DON'T NEED GUNS
WE NEED BAS
[Click to View YouTube Video]
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Chaz
Trad climber
greater Boss Angeles area
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Dec 13, 2013 - 09:15pm PT
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I tended bar for over nineteen years.
ADW and attempted murder is just something you have to do sometimes in that line of work.
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GDavis
Social climber
SOL CAL
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Dec 13, 2013 - 09:18pm PT
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Right on - so you trained at the lake?
How come I never saw you there???
[Click to View YouTube Video]
Road House.
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Lynne Leichtfuss
Sport climber
moving thru
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Dec 13, 2013 - 09:19pm PT
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Only read the first couple pages, but my friend reminded me that CA has perhaps had equal or more school shootings than CO. Jess sayin', lynnie.
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TGT
Social climber
So Cal
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Dec 13, 2013 - 09:23pm PT
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How many in an open carry state
????
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paganmonkeyboy
climber
mars...it's near nevada...
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Dec 13, 2013 - 09:27pm PT
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A kid in Texas kills 4 while driving drunk - should we ban cars too ? Ban booze ?
Oh WAIT - we *neeeed* those...and desperately it would seem, on both...
The mental gymnastics are astounding.
How many people own guns and DON'T walk into a school and start shooting ?
The answer isn't banning guns. If it is we also have to ban cigarettes, cars, the list goes on and on otherwise we are outright hypocrites.
Personally, I like shooting guns. They are both a challenge and a valuable tool to understand and master imho. Perhaps we should ask WHY SOME KID WANTED TO SHOOT HIS TEACHER and look at the REASONS not the TOOLS USED...
This is an environment issue imho. We have something very deeply weird going on in this country, this is but one manifestation of an underlying issue or set of issues...
My 2 cents - Don't shoot me !
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GDavis
Social climber
SOL CAL
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Dec 13, 2013 - 09:29pm PT
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Right - and banning weed does nothing either!
Woo hoo! This is how we pass it guys!
Don't Ban Guns!
Don't Ban Greens!
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johnboy
Trad climber
Can't get here from there
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Dec 13, 2013 - 09:33pm PT
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A right doesn't have to be exercised in order to remain a right. Possessing a right does not imply its forcible exercise.
Your the one that suggested equal force, I merely taunted escalation to point out your casual assumption.
If you can't have effective violence control in PRISON, exactly HOW do you plan to have it at a school?
Red herring comparing children to hardened criminals forced to live in close quarters with each other.
What LAWS do you have in mind, and, again, exactly how would those laws have prevented this particular case?
Entrapment. You know laws don't prevent people from breaking them. You also are aware that trying to get federal funding to rigorously enforce current laws isn't going to happen with conservatives in charge of the purse strings. They are willing to spend billions on a wall between us and Mexico, even though there are plenty of laws against illegal immigration, but preventing nutjob's from owning guns isn't on their radar.
No matter how well thought out any new law that may prevent to some degree mass spraying of bullets at the innocent, people like you view it as a threat to and an infringement of your rights. Fear seems to be the driving force behind the right wing of our government, since they have nothing else.
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Chaz
Trad climber
greater Boss Angeles area
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Dec 13, 2013 - 09:43pm PT
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Perhaps if you would propose an effective law, it would be met with a more positive response.
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JonA
Trad climber
Flagstaff, AZ
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Dec 13, 2013 - 09:52pm PT
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In the home of the brave, we recognize that shutting down every (or even most of the) whack job(s) requires a level of rights-infringement that is unacceptable in a free society.
In the home of the brave, we hear the NSA saying that it MUST utterly and totally invade our privacy in order to keep us safe, and we respond: We don't even want the level of safety you are after! We'll take our chances, because we won't trade off rights for security.
Governments down through history cast freedom as opposed to security. In the land of the brave, we reject that dichotomy as false. We recognize that the news-making, frothy commentary by talking heads that get paid to magnify everything is just that: frothy commentary. We recognize that among 1/3 of a billion people, there are going to be a tiny percentage of whack jobs, and they WILL make the news. So, in the home of the brave, we take the froth with a giant lump of salt, recognizing that tragedy, as tragic as it IS, is indeed small-scale when compared with national policy. So, we don't let the froth spewed by talking heads infect our national judgment. We keep things in proper perspective.
In the land of the free, some (small number) of people are going to die as a result of the (small number of) whack jobs. But because we are the home of the brave, we don't let the whack jobs (and the tragedies they produce) drive national policy. Because we are the home of the brave, we don't even expect "perfect security" or even really, really good security. We take our chances in the name of freedom, because we are the land of the free AND the home of the brave.
Present gun control laws are more than adequate, properly and consistently enforced; and they WILL NOT stop or even significantly reduce the incidence of whack jobs that are simply ignoring them.
The NSA has overreached (and lied and lied and lied about it) at a level beyond what has ever been comprehended in human history. And, clamoring for the chimera of "security," most Americans consider it a "necessary evil."
I'm pretty neutral on the whole gun control issue but this is the most compelling argument from either side that I regularly see. Everything comes at a price. More legislation means less freedom. Pretty soon we're all given implanted microchips at birth.
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thebravecowboy
Social climber
Colorado Plateau
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Dec 13, 2013 - 09:53pm PT
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"more legislation means less freedom"
disagree: CO amendment 64
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johnboy
Trad climber
Can't get here from there
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Dec 13, 2013 - 09:54pm PT
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I wish that were true.
But as it's been pointed out a thousand times on threads like these, laws are useless.
We can't even pass something as simple as restricting magazines and clips to seven rounds. The horror and inhumanity of such an intrusive law.
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Chaz
Trad climber
greater Boss Angeles area
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Dec 13, 2013 - 10:28pm PT
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"We can't even pass something as simple as restricting magazines and clips to seven rounds."
What good would that do? Propose an effective law, and it will pass itself.
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