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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Nov 11, 2014 - 12:21am PT
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who exactly is proposing giving legal status to everyone in this country illegally?
thanks in advance
Jerry Brown. "My" governor.
EDIT: and is it just me or are the people who want to slash taxes and shrink the government the same ones screaming that the government doesn't do enough for them, like protect the border?
Oh no ya don't! There are fundamental rules and roles of the Federal Gov't. One of the primary ones is to defend the borders and the population therein from attack and corruption.
ALLOWING illegal immigrants to knowingly linger in society is a FAILURE of the DUTIES of the Federal Gov't. One thing, the first thing, my f*#king tax dollars should be spent on is defense of this country. That includes shutting the borders and enforcing laws on the books.
The last thing my tax dollars should be spent on is giving illegal immigrants food-stamps, free education, and free healthcare.
Sorry if I seem insensitive. No, actually I'm not sorry....
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Nov 11, 2014 - 01:45am PT
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ALLOWING illegal immigrants to knowingly linger in society is a FAILURE of the DUTIES of the Federal Gov't.
So then, that would be every administration since the founding of our great nation.
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Gary
Social climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
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Nov 11, 2014 - 07:26am PT
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There are no illegal immigrants - only illegal employers.
Levy a $10k per illegal hire for the first three incidents and the next one is a criminal charge with $100k and three years in jail with no shelter for corporate officers.
Do that and you end 'illegal immigration' overnight. You'd also fine the hell out of and jail vast numbers of hypocritical republicans who are the ones profiting from 'illegal immigration'.
Exactly. Unfortunately, that would mean jailing rich white people rather than poor brown people. We can't have that now, can we?
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Wade Icey
Trad climber
www.alohashirtrescue.com
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Nov 11, 2014 - 07:36am PT
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There are fundamental rules and roles of the Federal Gov't. One of the primary ones is to defend the borders and the population therein from attack and corruption.
been attacked by a corrupt landscaper lately? flying a trillion dollar jet most likely.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Nov 11, 2014 - 09:04am PT
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I totally agree with the employer punishment approach, but you also need border enforcement and penalizing 'sanctuary' cities.
"Am I the only one around here who gives a sh#t about the rules"?
[Click to View YouTube Video]
We've entered a world of pain....man.
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Wade Icey
Trad climber
www.alohashirtrescue.com
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Nov 11, 2014 - 09:08am PT
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We've entered a world of pain....man.
did you just get here?
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Gary
Social climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
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Nov 11, 2014 - 10:54am PT
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bluering misses the point. The Mexicans come here for jobs. They come to work and make things better for the next generation, like everyone else.
If Ron wants to stop illegal immigration, he'll stop bashing the immigrants and start bashing the employers and their political stooges. But those stooges have been successful in convincing Ron and bluering that the fault lies with the people seeking work, not the "job creators".
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Degaine
climber
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Nov 12, 2014 - 12:31am PT
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Healyje wrote:
There are no illegal immigrants - only illegal employers.
Levy a $10k per illegal hire for the first three incidents and the next one is a criminal charge with $100k and three years in jail with no shelter for corporate officers.
Do that and you end 'illegal immigration' overnight. You'd also fine the hell out of and jail vast numbers of hypocritical republicans who are the ones profiting from 'illegal immigration'.
Exactly.
When ConAgra, Purdue, Tyson, et al., start feeling the heat things will change. Until then the ag industry will continue to lobby and spend campaign finance dollars to maintain the cheap illegal-immigrant labor status quo.
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Degaine
climber
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Nov 12, 2014 - 12:34am PT
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DMT wrote:
Hit the big companies where it hurts most... fine the investors heavily, make them pay for the cost of enforcement, including the 401ks, jail the executive class. Jail those doing the hiring, like the VP of HR and the VP of finance.
The border issue would diminish greatly.
Blame the workers, that's the rabble rouser approach.
Again, that's right.
Only a dumbass would blame the workers, and only a dumbass would be unaware that ConAgra, Purdue, Tyson, et al. actively recruit south of the border.
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johntp
Trad climber
socal
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Topic Author's Reply - Nov 12, 2014 - 07:07pm PT
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bluering misses the point. The Mexicans come here for jobs. They come to work and make things better for the next generation, like everyone else
Umm, are you not aware of the cartel and gang presence here from Mexico, Central America and South America due to our loose borders?
edit: Try to go to any other first world nation and get legal residence. The hoops are overwhelming. It's all great to get kumbaya but it seems there is a significant portion of the illegal population here to support the drug trade. Look at the volume of the prison population WE ARE FUNDING that are here illegally.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Nov 12, 2014 - 07:09pm PT
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Again, that's right.
Only a dumbass would blame the workers, and only a dumbass would be unaware that ConAgra, Purdue, Tyson, et al. actively recruit south of the border.
Only a f*#king dumbass would assume an "illegal" immigrant is innocent. Sure the employer is at fault, but you fail to have culpability for the person who broke the law?
Why is that? Why do you fail to blame the people who break our laws?
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Nov 12, 2014 - 07:32pm PT
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Only a f*#king dumbass would assume an "illegal" immigrant is innocent. Sure the employer is at fault, but you fail to have culpability for the person who broke the law?
Why is that? Why do you fail to blame the people who break our laws? Do we blame you for the same? They're just looking for a better life. The criminals, and the ones generating all the harm you imagine and a bunch you appear incapable of recognizing, are the illegal employers.
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johntp
Trad climber
socal
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Topic Author's Reply - Nov 12, 2014 - 07:39pm PT
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^^
No. We don't enforce our borders or immigration policy.
I live in SoCal and most illegals are good people. But theyare still here in violation of our laws.
On the other hand I have a friend from India that has spent more than 5 years to get his wife here thru legal channels.
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johntp
Trad climber
socal
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Topic Author's Reply - Nov 12, 2014 - 07:55pm PT
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The criminals, and the ones generating all the harm you imagine and a bunch you appear incapable of recognizing, are the illegal employers.
Employers need to be held accountable. The harm we are seeing is the drug trade and the US inability to enforce our existing immigration law. We don't need to "fix" the system. We need to enforce the existing laws. We are so weak.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Nov 12, 2014 - 07:57pm PT
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Do we blame you for the same? They're just looking for a better life. The criminals, and the ones generating all the harm you imagine and a bunch you appear incapable of recognizing, are the illegal employers.
You're a disingenuous ass..
You claim the "criminals" are the employers that hire people who willingly broke our Federal Laws. Do you feel stupid? You should.
This is typical liberal bullsh#t.
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Gary
Social climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
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Nov 12, 2014 - 08:22pm PT
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You claim the "criminals" are the employers that hire people who willingly broke our Federal Laws.
That's right, that's what we are claiming. Those that broke federal law are those that hire illegal aliens. These are the corporations that recruit in Mexico. Oh, what's the matter, your Republican congressman never mentions that? They don't talk about that on Fox News? Really.
And the drug cartels are a different matter. Legalize drugs, as recommended by Consumer Reports in Licit and Illicit Drugs back in the '70s will be the end of the cartels.
Get your head out of Fox News' ass and you might learn something.
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couchmaster
climber
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Nov 12, 2014 - 09:19pm PT
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So I see the brain trust here, idiots like Gary and their ilk, are claiming that it's the employers who are breaking the law by hiring illegal aliens. Suppose 2 things occur AS IS USUALLY THE CASE. A Mexican looking dude comes up, hands you BOTH a drivers license and a Social Security card. They have a local address and speak english. Otherwise, they have a spanish surname. You, the employer, rather than be a RACIST hire them based strictly on their work history and your need to fill the position and duly report the SS# and name to the Feds as you withhold and send the money to the State, Federal for each pay period as the law indicates. Half of the social security comes out of Mexicans paycheck and you the employer pay the other half. No one from the Fed ever clues you in that the SS is fake. There is in fact no way to determine it that I'm aware of.
Yet the dude is a Mexican. He dummied up the SS card off the net with help of a sympathetic person like Gary and printed it on a color printer. That's what is happening in many cases. And if you do get caught with an illegal on your payroll by the feds, the fine can be in excess of $40,000.
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Nov 12, 2014 - 10:27pm PT
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It ain't rocket science. You want to stop illegal employment? We have more than the means to check identities and citizenship/immigration status of potential hires if there was any real interest in actually solving the problem. Simply require every employer do a check, get a clean hire cert for each employee which can be held in case of an INS audit, and you end 'illegal immigration' overnight. OVER-F*#KING-NIGHT.
But that's not going to happen and it's not going to happen because republicans are never going to let it happen. Why? Because they and the companies and corporations they control are the ones profiting from low wage labor and shifting their healthcare costs onto taxpayers.
So, there you go - and it's not a reality or set of facts that's really open to debate - unless of course, you're a complete ...
And only weak, narrow-minded dumbasses would believe 'protecting the border' in a physical sense is anything but a minor component of effectively dealing with immigration issues. The border that really counts is your city limits and the only way to protect that is to deal with the draw. Republicans not dealing with the draw tells you everything you need to know about their real intent and motivations.
The fact is its the very same folks using this issue to incite guys like you to vote for them are the very same people doing the illegal hires. It would be ironic if it weren't just so damn pathetically sad. Total suckers, but then the old razzle-dazzle that gets redstaters to vote against their economic interests can still work like a charm if you can keep the [social] hysteria on high for long enough.
And blue - smoking weed is breaking the law too. Did you turn yourself into the sheriff when you were talking to him? No? And ever smoke any mexican weed? Well, then you own some of that drug and gang violence.
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