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JuanDeFuca
Big Wall climber
Stoney Point
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Topic Author's Reply - Jul 14, 2006 - 03:12pm PT
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Skotty,
That's cool your getting instruction.
Feel free to visit the Supertopo anytime.
This site has some of the most experienced climbers in the world and are happy to answer any question you have about climbing.
Juan
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Jerry Dodrill
climber
Bodega, CA
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Jul 14, 2006 - 03:36pm PT
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It was good info skotty. You've been beaten enough. We all get in over our heads. Hope this event didn't hurt your relationship, like such events often can. Like I said above, I'd rather read your rant than your obituary. Obviously some good lessons were learned.
Most of the good glacier courses are in areas where there are live glaciers. The sierra isn't known for much of that, but offers some fine snow gully/ice climbs. Shasta, Rainier, etc will be better training for real glaciers. But if you're just climbing in the sierra, crevasse rescue isn't as crucial. Just don't fall in any bergshrunds, and climb like you don't have a cell phone. In other words, be ready to self rescue.
Climb safe.
-Jerry
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skotty
climber
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Jul 14, 2006 - 04:19pm PT
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Thanks Jerry, good info. I'm planing on climbing outside of the Sierras as soon as I find the time, so it looks like I'll be heading north for training.
By the way: Relationship's stronger; though I may have lost my climbing partner.
Skotty
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PMS
climber
Woodland Park, CO
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Jul 14, 2006 - 04:34pm PT
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"This site has some of the most experienced climbers in the world and are happy to answer any question you have about climbing." Juan
OK, I'll bite.....
If one was to replace all of the fixed pins (w/pins) on the White Maidens Walkaway Direct, should one do it ground up on lead, solo, rope-solo or rap it ?
(only the most experienced, happiest, worldiest climbers need reply)
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JuanDeFuca
Big Wall climber
Stoney Point
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Topic Author's Reply - Jul 14, 2006 - 04:58pm PT
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I did that route a few times in the last few years and think you only have like two fixed pins left?
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dirtineye
Trad climber
the south
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Jul 14, 2006 - 09:31pm PT
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I hope that jennie gal is around to see that when somone comes in and takes the ribbing in a good way, peopel appreciate that and accept em.
And Dingus, the giggling we do is among peers. that's a little different than giving a less skilled climber a hard time during a climb.
There is no pleasure in giving someone a hard time, when they are new and in over their head, during the moment, BUT, if it is your best pal and partner, and he can't get a piece out or make a move you made, well then you just gotta do SOMETHING.
See the thread about screwing the second.
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Jennie
Trad climber
Salt Lake
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Jul 16, 2006 - 04:27am PT
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Even a "karmically challenged", "Mormon girl in her 'dirty phase" loves a happy ending. Skotty, you are a GREAT one! You accomplished a hundred times more by facing and confronting Arena Rats in their own locker room than I could have in ten years of ranting, And you did it with the clear voice of honesty (and very little contempt.)
Greetings, sensitive and clear headed gentlemen! I'm back from my own humble little Class 4 climb, safely. (Hope you weren't wishing otherwise) But yes, you're correct, my pack was well under 25 lbs. Though I felt kinda unwelcome, when I left your forum Thursday, I just wanted you to know I didn't sneak out the back door. It was great to get on the rock, and into the mountain wind one more time. I was thinking fondly of you all---but it was nice to get away from the spray of testosterone for a couple of days,and read the posts of God and nature.
I suppose it's good news that they chose to "accept you", Skotty! Though I wonder if you really want acceptance at the price of such an online caning. Yeah, maybe a little ribbing among friends is harmless and can, in fact, lead to collective solidarity.
But that stuff gets out of hand more than some of the ST homeboys would have you believe. Derision, like that aimed at you, should never be thrown at strangers unless they are openly belligerant or criminally evil. You hardly fit in either category.
Some of your accusers have left the building. We can't THROW SNOWBALLS at you, now, cause your straightforward argument, honest humility and declaration that you take no offense has MELTED ALL THE SNOW!
But then, you knew it was just little American boys being cute. God bless all the cute little American boys. So proud, so swift to accuse and ridicule, so wont to pick up sticks and stones, so sweet when they put them down and decide to be friends. (And so quick to forget the lesson) It amazes me that initiation rites, hazing, gang mentality and mob rule are so firmly entrenched in the mind of a nation with such high minded ideals about the dignity of man. And even more, that it has overlapped, to a significant degree, into the climbing community. Sorry boys, I can't buy that hazing bull*#%t, and never will. But it's great that you, some of you, could turn this p#*sing match around and extend a hand to this gentleman.
Dear Dirtineye, you came out of this looking pretty good. I don't agree with some of your ideas but your humanity definitely trancends your hard man talk. They say southern boys have a certain color or charm. Maybe that's part of it it. (The picture was a pleasant addition to the debate. Maybe it reminded us that it's about climbing and not dogfighting. I'll look forward to seeing another picture of you muscleing up that overhang with a twenty five pound pack, someday.)
Juan and Jerry, thanks for saying and doing the right thing. Finn, BrentA, GoClimb, appreciate you having courage to run against the grain. Dingus, you're a mean one, but I see the oceans of your mind are much, much deeper than I'd originally suspected. Happy climbing, Skotty!
OOOPS! Almost time to claim another ticket from the rant police! Time for this Jody Lover to get out of the locker room!
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ikellen
Trad climber
Mammoth Lakes, CA
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Jul 16, 2006 - 11:36am PT
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JuanDeFuca-
Out of total curiosity, how many Mountains have you climbed?
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Anastasia
Trad climber
Near a mountain, CA
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Jul 16, 2006 - 11:53am PT
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I know Juan so I'm sure he has lost count. The man is a climbing fanatic which means he knows his stuff and has been through enough to be humble about it.
Great guy to learn from and respect... As for his internet humor, he loves pulling everyones leg. If you take it seriously, you are being silly. He just wants to see a rise in people to know we still care about certain issues.
Fun guy, I think he is one of my favorites. I can't help it, he is one of Stoney's own.
Anastasia
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Jennie
Trad climber
Salt Lake
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Jul 16, 2006 - 04:31pm PT
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Uh-huh! That's what I expected---more hounds looking for the rabbit to tear apart. That taste for blood never goes away, does it boys?
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Jaybro
Social climber
The West
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Jul 16, 2006 - 05:48pm PT
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""Looks like meat's back on the menu, boys.""
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d-know
Trad climber
electric lady land
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Jul 17, 2006 - 07:23am PT
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it's called the pecking order. all animals do it and we are no exception.
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dirtineye
Trad climber
the south
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Jul 17, 2006 - 08:47am PT
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JEnnie, what "hard man tal;k " of main are you refering to?
FOR more info, you can check out some of the route names that got in the guide.
Supergumbiewannabe, Southern Soft Men, and then one that was too late for publication but I'll tell you anyway, Drama Queen.
Nobody I know whom you would consider a "hard man" thinks or talks about themself that way.
I think you should get off your touchy-feely politikally Korrekt hobby horse now, and start having fun.
And believe me, you'll climb MUCH better without that big old chip on your shoulder.
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Jennie
Trad climber
Salt Lake
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Jul 17, 2006 - 11:47am PT
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Maybe I am a Drama Queen, Dear Dirtineye, but it seems necessary to make a point to some of these gentlemen. When people talk plain and clear to them, they don't listen.
Like I said, I thought you came out pretty good in this little debacle and I, personally, am not feeling ill will toward you because you were forgiving and tried to mediate things, later in the argument.
Your accusation that I was "politically correct" was good for a laugh. If you knew me you wouldn't have included that.
If I seemed to be on a high horse, I apologize. It's hard to come across right to everybody, everytime. But don't you believe there was an important issue here? It's one thing to give constructive criticism and quite another for a bunch of guys to make late hits and pile on the running back. That's what was happening to Skotty, and it was WRONG.----Constructive criticism doesn't include mocking, name calling etc (I apologize for calling them Arena Rats---name calling and cynicism is catching)
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skotty
climber
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Jul 17, 2006 - 04:34pm PT
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Its been fun, but I think we're beating a dead horse here. I'm finding myself drawn to it like a bad soap opera, forgetting that I'm its genesis and ostensible topic. Maybe I should have just posted:
"Another reminder for newbies: beware of ice and/or technical rock climbing on Whitney MR. chute - July 06."
But that probably wouldn't have been as much fun, or more importantly stayed on the top of the list on a few boards for a few weeks, having the effect that I intended: to keep neophytes (no pun intended Jenie:) out of trouble.
In an attempt to close this up; thanks again all for your input, advice, and entertainment. For those of you that have backed me up, thanks, but I think the facts speak for themselves; I just jumped in to make sure my original point didn't get lost in the cacophony.
Happy climbing!
P.S. stzzo, I'll look into the WFA/WFR. Good tip. Thanks.
P.P.S. fattrad, I did tell my friends and family the details of my trip, though I don't even think they listened; my plethora of death-defying hobbies have become banal to them. And, I can't help it, but for the record, I wouldn't really call it a "rescue"; Rob did pull our packs up the last few feet, and stood by as an anchor just in case (for which we are eternally greatful), but as challanging as it was for us, we did climb every inch solo, with no assist other then being relieved of our packs (Thanks again Rob!). Regardless, we've learned our lesson and from now on will make sure we know exactly what we're getting into and that we're prepared for it, or else we'll turn back.
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dirtineye
Trad climber
the south
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Jul 17, 2006 - 05:05pm PT
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Dear Jennie, Drama Queen is a route I did that got named FOR me, by some 'friends', who felt I was overdoing the whining and moaning about a certain loose handhold among other things, like defending a little slip as not a real fall, since I caught myself on the rock and didn't weight the rope, which if I had would technically have made it someone else's lead, LOL.
Anyway, it was a bit strange to have THESE particular guys name the route, since one of them is THE master whiner, but what can you do?
When a name sticks, it's a done deal.
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JuanDeFuca
Big Wall climber
Stoney Point
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Topic Author's Reply - Jul 17, 2006 - 05:10pm PT
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I'm finding myself drawn to it like a bad soap opera
Scotty, has discovered the true nature of the Supertopo!
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dirtineye
Trad climber
the south
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Jul 17, 2006 - 05:18pm PT
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Juanito, LOL, good point!
Welcome to As the Hanger Spins! Stay tuned for One Nut to leave, followed by Peyton's Placement.
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Apocalypsenow
Trad climber
Cali
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Jul 17, 2006 - 05:19pm PT
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Jennie; love your writing style. Has that nice, "gonzo" Hunter S. style. Keep "firing back." Sitting on the sideline, you are winning this one by a longshot!
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dirtbag
climber
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Jul 17, 2006 - 05:36pm PT
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skotty = Jody
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