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A5scott
Trad climber
Chicago
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Aug 12, 2013 - 06:50pm PT
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really sorry to see this. i will look for ya in september!
all the best
scott
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ElCapPirate
Big Wall climber
Reno, Nevada
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Aug 12, 2013 - 08:59pm PT
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Yo Matt, it's been a long time. Hope to catch up with you again soon.
I really don't get this whole volunteer thing. It's a job and the "Ask a Climber" PAYS for the work of informing the tourists about climbing El Cap. Don't get me wrong, I think it's BS that the NPS is trying to commandeer Tom's work.
But, on the other hand, he is on the clock... maybe it's their way of saying it's a conflict of interest with the job he is supposed to be focusing on.
Nothing has really changed, lots of people fill in on the summer months while Tom's not around: Nanook, D. Turner, I even got a few weeks in, a few years ago.
Now Tom can continue like many years previous before the "Ask a Climber" program was around. At any rate, he has proven his talent, passion and generosity to the climbing community.
Yeah Norwegian, I vote him "Major Tom", from here on out.
Cheers!
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'Pass the Pitons' Pete
Big Wall climber
like Ontario, Canada, eh?
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Aug 12, 2013 - 09:04pm PT
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Ron - Erik Sloan / Nanook is like, hardly the "new guy", eh? (Wink)
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Elcapinyoazz
Social climber
Joshua Tree
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Aug 12, 2013 - 09:09pm PT
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You guys do remember what happened to Maj Tom, right?
Hey Tom, stay off them space capsules, it's a one way ride! Tom? Tom? Can you hear me Maj Tom?
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Chaz
Trad climber
greater Boss Angeles area
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Aug 12, 2013 - 09:10pm PT
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When Capt. Evans was hired, did the NPS not know what he was doing at the bridge? Did they expect him to case the camera while he was "on the clock", or what?
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ElCapPirate
Big Wall climber
Reno, Nevada
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Aug 12, 2013 - 09:14pm PT
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Haa haa, good one "inyoazz".
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Srbphoto
climber
Kennewick wa
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Aug 12, 2013 - 11:21pm PT
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Can I pay someone not to take my photograph?
Yes and I do accept Paypal.
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Michelle Gill
climber
Redding, CA
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Aug 13, 2013 - 11:48am PT
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This is ground control to major Tom, you've really made the grade
And the papers want to know whose shirts you wear
Now it's time to leave the capsule if you dare
This really brought tears to my eyes. Love your work Tom.
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feralfae
Boulder climber
Montana
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Aug 13, 2013 - 12:00pm PT
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Major Tom,
You will find creative and highly amusing ways to avoid and work around the impositions of the park nazis.
Keep on living your own life your own way. Avoid confrontations if you can. Live free, have fun, enjoy life. For those stuck in the ruts of desperation and despair, let them work out their own karma: you are here to enjoy life and live free.
Doug would have pages to write about this. ALl I can say is, follow your heart, and never give up.
Thank you for all you do for climbing!
Best of everything to you,
feralfae
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Aug 13, 2013 - 12:03pm PT
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Stick-It-To-Da-Man!!!
Keep up the good work in whatever way you can Tom!!
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FrankZappa
Trad climber
Hankster's crew
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Aug 13, 2013 - 12:22pm PT
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Gawd, I can already picture the TOOL approaching Tom at the bridge this fall, "Soooo where are you camping tonight? How long will you be camping there? Mind if I look around in your van?"
If anyone can keep this from going bad, it's Tom, but the TOOL is showing their bad side here, and I hate to see that bad go worse...
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CF
climber
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Aug 13, 2013 - 12:38pm PT
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"The National Park Service, (NPS) now says that as a volunteer, all my photos, writings, blogs, artistic renderings, etc. that were done using information gathered while volunteering at the Bridge, are now exclusively the property of the NPS and I have no rights to any of my own work."
So this means that all the volunteer photographers, painters, indian basket weavers etc have to give all their photos, paintings, baskets to NPS?
Not sure if Julia Parker is a volunteer but if she is, she will not be very happy with this decision.
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CF
climber
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Aug 13, 2013 - 01:10pm PT
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ElCrap, halfdumm and the falls are all copywrited by the government of the park. They OWN the publishing rights of any image they have not authorized to be published. They could stop anybody from making recordings of any kind for commercial purposes.
i do not think nps has the copyright on public features if they are used for non commercial purposes. any person can paint, take photos, video etc as long as they are not used for commercial endeavors
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wstmrnclmr
Trad climber
Bolinas, CA
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Aug 13, 2013 - 01:17pm PT
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I like what ElCapPirate said. It is a shame to lose such valuable assets (Roger and Tom) but Yosemite Valley in particular is run more bureaucratically then most parks because of it's status in the NPS system. Nuebacher did some good things in his time at Point Reyes as I was a volunteer there and likewise there are some really good people working in the GGNRA who are great examples of what a government employee can be and what can be accomplished. I've been working with Roger and Clint in TM and have been thinking of ways to get Roger a way to be able to stay in the park. One of the ways was to approach the ASCA or other official non-profit to approach Nuebacher with proposals that work within the context of the bureaucracy. In talking with Roger, he just didn't want to deal with it but isn't against having someone try to help with the red tape.
Roger doesn't get paid anything and puts his own money in (Gas, camping etc.) Times change as more and more rules and BS come down the line but It may be worth a try to get something established otherwise there is no counterpoint.
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Don Paul
Big Wall climber
Colombia, South America
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Aug 13, 2013 - 01:23pm PT
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I saw this too late for the original post, but it doesnt sound right. One of the basic principles of contract law is consideration. Did you get something in exchange for the rights to your pictures? Second question: do you have a written contract with the NPS? What does it say about intellectual property? Third question, as someone mentioned, is do you charge money for your photos? If not then its not commercial use and may be protected by the first amendment. I'd be glad to help but I am not licensed in CA so you need a CA attorney, also one who knows about copyright law. Find a small time lawyer with some experience in this, have him research it and write you an opinion letter, maybe pay a thousand dollars, maybe two. If you are right, then you write the NPS a letter saying they're your photos. A second question is, can they keep you out of the park or stop you from taking photos, because of this dispute? That would be retaliatory and probably illegal and grounds for a lawsuit.
This all goes to prove the same argument I make over and over here, we should all encourage our congress to cut the NPS budget as much as possible, and let the forest service or blm manage them.
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John Mac
Trad climber
Littleton, CO
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Aug 13, 2013 - 01:26pm PT
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I must be missing something here ...
All that Tom said is that he can't "work" for the NPS or Yosemite Conservatory and take pictures at the same time. That doesn't seem out of line to me. If I was "employing" Tom to talk to visitors then I wouldn't want him spending time taking photos.
Even if it is a position that he is receiving no paycheck, he might be getting other benefits, such as accommodation, otherwise he would be running into the one or two week limitation.
I suspect that Tom will be back there in a few weeks taking photos and all of this will be no big deal.
I really appreciate your work Tom!
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Don Paul
Big Wall climber
Colombia, South America
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Aug 13, 2013 - 01:28pm PT
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When Capt. Evans was hired, did the NPS not know what he was doing at the bridge?
That is another legal argument in contract law, called 'course of performance'. If something isnt written in a contract, but both parties seem to agree to it based on their conduct, then it can become part of a contract. ie, you have a contract that doesn't say who owns the pictures, but you've been publishing them for years and the publishing seems to be the whole point of it, then it can become an implied term in the contract.
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ElCapPirate
Big Wall climber
Reno, Nevada
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Aug 13, 2013 - 01:30pm PT
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Third question, as someone mentioned, is do you charge money for your photos?
Don, as far as I know Tom has never asked for a single penny for his photos. He gives them away for free, a VERY generous offer being his photos are unique and without his equipment, impossible to get... without a helicopter.
If you want to donate to his cause, then that is a gift back to him for continuing support to the climbing community.
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Don Paul
Big Wall climber
Colombia, South America
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Aug 13, 2013 - 01:37pm PT
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I dont know if that counts as commercial or not, still there is money involved. What started all this anyway? Is it about closing El Cap Meadows? Or maybe someone wasnt allowed to have their own commericial concession and asked them why Tom was allowed to take pictures? Did this just come out of the blue?
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rlf
Trad climber
Josh, CA
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Aug 13, 2013 - 02:39pm PT
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Well, as much as this sucks, years ago, Tom used sell photos to tourons at the parking area for Zodiac. The NPS shut it down. Since then, I have not heard of him making money for profit off this.
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