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Ken M
Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
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May 16, 2006 - 05:52pm PT
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last time I will buy anything from their company.
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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May 16, 2006 - 06:10pm PT
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Dingus, you speak blasphemy, but at least its FUNNY blasphemy.
imelda lol
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Tarbuster
climber
right here, right now
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May 16, 2006 - 06:33pm PT
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Patagonia leverages sales off Dean's image and reported exploits.
I bet they are thinking "Oh Shite, this Ain't lookin' Rosy".
As far as our collective opinion goes of them per their stance, it's nearly a no win for them, but it ain't that bad either. They've got to be as neutral as they can, while leaving themselves an out and they have somewhat achieved this. Those of us who understand commerce will somewhat accept that medicine.
Per Dean's "the whole thing was vibrating with energy" (paraphrase) statement goes, I recall Piton Ron's characterization of Free Solo as pretty much mainlining adrenaline.
At first blush and that's all I have to go on, Dean seems like a nicely adjusted fellow with very genuine motives. I'd say per his career moves go, this was a tactical blunder. Either way, per his street cred as a do-er, the Dude is clearly phenomenal and is off the charts, free solo or otherwise.
I predict Dean and Patagonia will do some nifty hoop dancing and emerge more or less intact.
WOTF
(wag of the finger, i learned that here).
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James
Social climber
My Subconcious
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May 16, 2006 - 06:44pm PT
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I can't believe so many people are up in arms about some chossy free solo. Dean didn't make any impact on the route, only on people. Get over it, it's just a rock climb.
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phoolish
Boulder climber
Athens, Ga.
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May 16, 2006 - 07:52pm PT
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Dingus:
It's actually montes semper liberi, at least if you want to use good grammar.
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PDHMAN
Trad climber
Eastside N of Bishop just S of 395
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May 16, 2006 - 09:00pm PT
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LOOMIS:YC is Patagonia's cofounder. I personally don't think he cares.
Sorry big guy, YC is the Founder and there is no co-founder (Tom Frost was co-founder of "Chouinard Eq" TM) involved.
Per the "Patagonia" History:
"Yvon Chouinard, Patagonia's founder, got his start as a climber in 1953 as a 14-year-old member of the Southern California Falconry Club, which trained hawks and falcons for hunting. After one of the adult leaders, Don Prentice, taught the boys how to rappel down the cliffs to the falcon aeries, Yvon and his friends became so fond of the sport they started hopping freight trains to the west end of the San Fernando Valley, to the sandstone cliffs of Stony Point. There, eventually, they learned to climb up as well as rappel down the rock."
And I know for fact that "YC" cares as it is his rep at stake. Worked for the guy (76-77') back in the day @ "GPIW" and know that he is a throbbing ass and prides himself on integrity...HIS! A real Stand up guy but still a prick when it comes to quality and his name. Blame him?
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k-man
Gym climber
SCruz
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May 16, 2006 - 09:13pm PT
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"Patagonia stands squarely at the center of this event as much as Dean does.
Were it not for Patagonia’s sponsorship there is a good argument that Dean would not have made his ascent with the heavy-handed media entourage in tow. Yes, it appears that Dean had other fish to fry by this climb, but earning his pay from Patagonia has to be understood as a primary motivation."
I have no idea what Dean gets from his Patagonia sponsorship, but I can't believe this was just a media stunt to keep himself on the Patagonia payroll. If it was, he needs to consult a new marketing guru.
As for Patagonia being a "green" company, sure they advertise it but they also stand behind it. They stood to loose a lot of money by going to organic cotton, but they did it anyway. There are a many stories about the eco-friendly choices they make when they could easily go the other way. Sure their bottom line ain't bad, every business needs to make a profit. How about your business, is it green?
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Burt
climber
Sin City
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May 16, 2006 - 09:25pm PT
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"James its on the License plate of Nevada for God's sake!
It is a big deal."
So is all of Yosemite, You guys need f*#king day jobs, I think I smell a hint of jealousy, the guy gets to climb everyday, thats his job. So while you key smashing wankers are bitcing about it, he gets the last laugh... oh yeah and its Utah the plate is from... probably a troll and I caught
Kurt "Burt"
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Ain't no flatlander
climber
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May 16, 2006 - 09:38pm PT
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No jealousy, just disgust. Potter and Patagonia, pathetic.
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Anastasia
Trad climber
Near a mountain, CA
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May 16, 2006 - 10:32pm PT
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jghedge,
You should try to follow Bachar when he is climbing in Bishop. He's not in his prime anymore, so it should be easy since it is "not a big deal."
Maybe then you will realize how stupid you sound. You also might learn to be respectful towards our climbing legends. Plus, there are still climbs that Bachar has done that remain unrepeated. I wonder why if they are so unremarkable?
As for your Reardon comment, I have watched him climb some really scary stuff in Josh. He is the real thing. I am sure that with time the truth will come out and will leave no doubt about his accomplishments. If I were you, I wouldn't be spreading such negative rumors. Your going to eventually look like liar.
I am sorry if this response bothers you. If it does, please come visit me at Stoney. I'll be happy to discuss it. Just email me on which Tuesday or Thursday you'll be visiting on. (Just be warned, I have no problem repeating this to your face.)
Anastasia
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MikeL
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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May 16, 2006 - 11:14pm PT
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You can’t have it both ways.
You can’t complain about companies’ environmentally damaging or disrespectful activities and then allow a company to go by unnoticed when it claims it is green, but doesn’t follow through.
Either you don’t really care about what companies do when it comes to the environment and their promises, or you do.
There are two issues here: Potter as an exemplar of the sport (is he everything he needs to be?), and a company started by a climber who promised to do things with environmental integrity.
It may not matter what position you want to take, as long as you are consistent at it.
MikeL
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yo
climber
I'm so over it
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May 16, 2006 - 11:22pm PT
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Are Imelda and Yvonne hot twins?
And per board/chairman last I heard there was this Navy SEAL dude running the joint. Trying to hook Patagucci up with military contracts and stuff which all seemed...weird.
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PDHMAN
Trad climber
Eastside N of Bishop just S of 395
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May 16, 2006 - 11:44pm PT
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These are "YC's" words from the "(C)Eq" 74' catalog... I really wonder if Dean's exploits on DA, correlate within these words of wisdom????
"A Word...
The 1960s marked an awakening in American climbing characterized by a vast increase in climbing activity closely paralleled by a corresponding improvement in technique and equipment. Significant climbing advances have resulted. On the other hand, this combination is producing a serious problem — deterioration of the climbing environment. The deterioration is two-fold, involving the physical aspect of the mountains and the moral integrity of the climbers.
No longer can we assume the Earth's resources are limitless; that there are ranges of unclimbed peaks extending endlessly beyond the horizon. Mountains are finite, and despite their massive appearance, they are fragile.
Although alpine tundra, meadows, trees, lakes and streams are all endangered, our primary concern here is with deterioration of the rock itself. Granite is delicate and soft — much softer than the alloy steel pitons being hammered into it. On popular routes in Yosemite and elsewhere, the cracks are degenerating into series of piton holes. Flakes and slabs are being pried loose and broken off as a result of repeated placement and removal of hard pitons.
We can offer a few immediate solutions. Stay off climbs you do not intend to finish. Don't climb up to Sickle Ledge unless you plan to do the entire Nose. Do not use artificial aid on free climbs. But most of all, start using chocks. Chocks and runners are not damaging to the rock and provide a pleasurable and practical alternative to pitons on most free, and many artificial climbs. Do not use pitons on established clean routes. Where a piton is necessary, a fixed piton should be considered and documented in local guidebooks. Routes of 5.7 difficulty were climbed 60 years ago in England. Today the footholds on these routes are well polished, but because pitons have not been used, the protection cracks are still in mint condition.
Equally serious is a moral deterioration. Armed with ever more advanced gadgetry and techniques, the style of technical climbing is gradually becoming so degraded that elements vital to the climbing experience — adventure and appreciation of the mountain environment itself — are being submerged. Siege tactics, bolt ladders, bat hooks, bash chocks, detailed topos and equipment lists, plus a guaranteed rescue, diminish rather than enhance a climb. Even now, existing techniques and technology are so powerful that almost any climb imaginable can be realized, and the fear of the unknown reduced to rote exercise.
Mad bolters are among the worst offenders of the alpine environment. Young climbers must learn that bolting is done as a substitute for climbing. Guides, climbing schools and established climbers have a heavy responsibility here.
We believe the only way to ensure the climbing experience for ourselves and future generations is to preserve (1) the vertical wilderness, and (2) the adventure inherent in the experience. Really, the only insurance to guarantee this adventure and the safest insurance to maintain it is exercise of moral restraint and individual responsibility.
Thus, it is the style of the climb, not the attainment of the summit, which is the measure of personal success. Traditionally stated, each of us must consider whether the end is more important than the means. Given the vital importance of style, we suggest that the keynote is simplicity. The fewer gadgets between the climber and the climb, the greater the chance to attain the desired communication with oneself — and nature.
As we enter this new era of mountaineering, re-examine your motives for climbing. Employ restraint and good judgment. Remember the rock, the other climbers — climb clean."
Yvon Chouinard 74'
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yo
climber
I'm so over it
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May 16, 2006 - 11:47pm PT
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Oh, hey, and my one Dean/Patagonia story.
Friend of mine used to be pretty high up in the company before things came to a head and he was escorted from the building by security. But that's not this story. This friend about 5 years back invited me to tag along with the Patagonia rep shindig in the Creek. Went out cragging and we'd all thrash around on the 10- handcracks while Dean chased ravens and then some Patagonia honcho would ring a little bell (not really) and Dean would solo up some 11+ and rig a top rope (really) and instead of rapping he would frigging DOWN SOLO (really!) and some hapless TRing would commence amongst the mortals. No one could get up anything but everybody really vibrated with energy. Good fun. And when the fun was through the bell would ring and the trained monkey would retrieve the lines.
Dinner was some catered job like smoked scallop pitas or something. Your usual fare.
Digestive festivities highlighted by a slideshow of one Dean Potter, mostly, if'n I can recall, his Half Dome solo, which was all the buzz at the time. All the fat corporate types in their Crazy Creeks watching these slides of Dean on this horror show, and Dean ropeless on this other horror show. Dean ropeless in the Zigzags (that one airy shot of him with the rope on his back that makes you throw up) and so on. And Dean, who appeared to be new at this corporate thing, trying gamely to somehow connect being off in kooky-lala-solo-deathzone-land (which is what he knew, and basically all he knew) with the basic capitalism of pushing capilene briefs (which was the whole point of having everybody out there.) Don't know if it improved the yearly gross but it was a good slide show.
(I got Polygrip that trip--on TR. bwahahah)
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Jaybro
Social climber
The West
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May 16, 2006 - 11:59pm PT
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Man this stuff gets weird. When I mentioned the pinnacle thing I meant that I didn't think DP's main thing was free solo. Then I listed some people who were at various times more into it as viewed by my feeble outsider's perception.
Not asking if Jesus could beat superman.
MikeL, you may want to rethink what you postulate as black and white.
I don't think mr p did anything wrong (except maybe the press) though he skated through on technicalities. I do think it's good that Patagucci stood behind him, more or less, and high five them for that.
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yo
climber
I'm so over it
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May 17, 2006 - 01:47am PT
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Brother Jaybro,
Bachar, Croft and Potter are the Holy Trinity of soloing. They are Three but also One. And shall be counted as Three--not as Four, nor Two, unless continuing on to Three. Or One.
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Jaybro
Social climber
The West
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May 17, 2006 - 01:48am PT
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Five is right out?
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yo
climber
I'm so over it
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May 17, 2006 - 01:49am PT
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HAHAHAHAHHA!!
Five could be Werner maybe. And there was much rejoicing.
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MikeL
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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May 17, 2006 - 11:29am PT
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Yo, Jaybro:
I think one of our problems is that we all pick and choose values as we feel at the moment. “Well today I’ll be for the snail darter, but tomorrow, I’ll put in 5 bolts next to a hand crack. I will be my judge, jury, and final arbiter of everything. Don’t demand of me to be consistent about it.”
Well, good.
There are names for this kind of state, names which many climbers relish: anarchy, chaos, extreme relativism, nihilism, etc.
Don’t complain. I’m just doing the same thing.
MikeL
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