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Nick
climber
portland, Oregon
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Feb 13, 2012 - 09:45pm PT
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An excellent resource and good read is Neil Shubin's book "Your Inner Fish" Here is a link to some educational resources to use the book in your classroom http://tiktaalik.uchicago.edu/book-tools.html
I just remind students that science is evidence based and faith does not need to be.
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Tricouni
Mountain climber
Vancouver
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Feb 13, 2012 - 10:21pm PT
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To directly answer the question posed by the o.p., I'd suggest going to the National Center for Science Education http://ncse.com/ and see what they have. Eugenie Scott at NCSE has more experience with this subject than anyone.
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WBraun
climber
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Feb 13, 2012 - 10:56pm PT
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Are you gonna tell them you were a ape at one time?
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StahlBro
Trad climber
San Diego, CA
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Feb 13, 2012 - 11:04pm PT
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Apes are cousins twice removed.
The mechanics of evolution are a fact. Why some species survive and some don't is still up for debate. Mass extinctions can change the whole game.
Fascinating stuff for the kids to ponder....
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Roughster
Sport climber
Vacaville, CA
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Feb 13, 2012 - 11:14pm PT
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Predator eats prey and reproduces. His offspring also can catch/eat prey well and they have many chances to reproduce. The prey has something "negative" in their gene pool and as they die the gene pool is reduced related to that gene thus decreasing the chances of it being passed on. Opposite is true if prey gets away, predator dies because his gene pool doesn't have the right genes to survive. Sure this is oversimplified but it natural selection and evolution really are pretty simple.
Both predators and prey are evolving over time causing gradual but continual change in the genes that are successful versus those that are "weak" and cause death.
Evolution is simple observation and common sense. If you die, you can't reproduce.
I used the predator / prey model, but the same logic applies to environmental factors, and other pressures on populations.
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High Fructose Corn Spirit
Gym climber
-A race of corn eaters
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Feb 13, 2012 - 11:50pm PT
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This from a critic of Arno Ilgner's book, The Rock Warrior's Way:
"if you are challenging yourself at the edge of your abilities, you will still have to make your move and shove off into the unknown. That's the beauty of climbing."
With something of that in mind,
I have found that evolutionary theory together with all its implications challenges me when it comes to (a) a better understanding of how the world works, and (b) to my "practice" of living taking account of it; in contrast, Abrahamic religion in whatever its form does not.
"To make your move and to shove off into the unknown." That's the beauty of living, too, for some of us, as well as climbing.
You could give your students a sense of this, also.
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WBraun
climber
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Feb 13, 2012 - 11:58pm PT
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"The evolution of the eye ultimately hinges on one particular property of certain types of protoplasm—photosensitivity.
. . . Once one admits that the possession of such photosensitivity
may have selective value, all else follows by necessity."22 Mayr does
not, and indeed cannot, specify the particular steps leading from a photo-,
sensitive speck to a fully developed eye.
His account of the evolution of the eye is typical of theoretical evolutionary explanations,
for it relies on an abiding faith in the power of natural selection and mutation to effect transformations
in organic form that evolutionists themselves cannot even" imagine, much less observe.
Mmmmmm science is based on faith?
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Ed Hartouni
Trad climber
Livermore, CA
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Feb 14, 2012 - 12:03am PT
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I don't think that was written by a scientist, Werner...
you might have given us the source... http://www.nccg.org/iat/evolution.html
you should be more careful with cut&paste arguements
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Jan
Mountain climber
Okinawa, Japan
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Feb 14, 2012 - 12:05am PT
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I teach biological anthropology to 18 -25 year olds, many of whom come from the Bible Belt. My method is to speak about the white elephant in the room the first night of class, usually the first few minutes. I start by telling them that all you need is a little bit open mind to have room for both science and religion. In fact they specialize in entirely different areas of human life. Both are good at what they do; they just don't mix well, at least in our culture.
I mention that one of the sticking points has to do with the issue of time. People think they know what 7 days and 7 nights means and until recently they did. Now, being children of the space age we know that different planets rotate at different rates, and whole galaxies rotate. The size of the universe and the number of stars we can count increases all the time, so isn't a little presumptious to think that whatever force created this vast universe had to do it in 24 hour earth spins? And don't forget that every religious tradition in the world says that man's greatest fault is his pride.
Science tells us how things work, religion and philosophy discuss why. Religions doesn't belong in a science course and realistically, when you're dying, Charles Darwin isn't who you're going to be thinking about. This always gets a laugh since many of my students are combat veterans and once everyone's relaxed and realizes I'm not trying to contradict religion or force anything on them, they get down to learning the topic at hand.
And I would agree with Gene, a few illustrations of ontogeny recapitulates phylogeny is often more convincing than the fossils themselves. I have a big anatomy book with large scale photos of human embryos with gill slits and tails and flippers at various stages of development that they love to look at. I also have a chart showing many different animal embryos side by side to show the similarity of development. Young people are ecology minded and they also really like the idea of all animal life sharing the same amino acids. And of course they are fascinated by the same amino acids found on meteors, the big bang theory etc.
This approach has really worked for me. In 35 years of teaching evolution to students from religious backgrounds, I've never had a problem or a complaint.
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WBraun
climber
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Feb 14, 2012 - 12:11am PT
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Ed
Mental speculation again.
And didn't come from your link.
Search harder
Ph.D. in mathematics from Cornell University wrote that quote in my prvious post above .....
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WBraun
climber
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Feb 14, 2012 - 12:27am PT
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You have the wrong guy again Ed.
Search harder ....
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Ghost
climber
A long way from where I started
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Feb 14, 2012 - 12:29am PT
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The size of the universe and the number of stars we can count increases all the time, so isn't a little presumptious to think that whatever force created this vast universe had to do it in 24 hour earth spins? And don't forget that every religious tradition in the world says that man's greatest fault is his pride.
It's an interesting thought Jan, but there's a problem with it. It may well be true that a god created the earth in 7 periods that were not the days we think of. Maybe they were million-year days. Or billion-year days. I wasn't there, then, and can't say. But what I do feel pretty sure about is that the people that wrote the "God created the earth in seven days" story 3,000 years ago didn't have any conception of galaxies rotating. The only "day" they knew was the sunup to sundown kind. If they wrote "seven days" how could they have meant anything but seven sunrise-to-sunset periods?
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Klimmer
Mountain climber
San Diego
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Feb 14, 2012 - 12:32am PT
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It's a science course. In science we deal with empirical data and physical evidence only. That is all science can work with, The Scientific Method dictates this. So, teach the science. Teach evolution.
BBBbuuuuuuuuutttt . . .
Know that Science is about "Cosmic Order" and answers What? and How? questions. Whereas, Religion, Philosophy, Logic are about "Cosmic Purpose" and answer Who? and Why? questions. Both answer different questions, and both are compatible human endeavors seeking for truth, and are valuable for their own different approaches. (Hats off to Mr. Paul Hewitt)
"You consider me the young apprentice
Caught between the scylla and charybidis
Hypnotized by you if I should linger
Staring at the ring around your finger
I have only come here seeking knowledge
Things they wouldn't teach me of in college
I can see the destiny you sold
Turned into a shining band of gold"
--The Police, Sting, "Wrapped Around Your Finger"
However, you know we don't know it all, and sometimes we pretend too, so for your own education and edification, on your own time (you can't teach this in class and no one is asking you too), because you have a curious mind and you want to know the full truth of the matter, "The Forbidden Secret Knowledge," then check it out for yourself.
Hey, most of the founding fathers of modern science were men of science and also men of faith. This is known beyond a shadow of a doubt. Many would like to poo-poo this today, but they can't. In many ways they seem to be more enlightened than modern man today. To them both were very important endeavours, Science and Faith.
Watch the DVD: "NOVA - Newton's Dark Secret"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sdmhPfGo3fE
The Big Bang, Evolution, modern science are indeed compatible with The Bible. Read PhD Gerald Schroeder's book:
"The Science of GOD"
http://www.amazon.com/Science-God-Convergence-Scientific-Biblical/dp/1439129584/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1329197760&sr=1-1
See also, "Theistic Evolution":
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theistic_evolution
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Jan
Mountain climber
Okinawa, Japan
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Feb 14, 2012 - 12:32am PT
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Ghost-
The point is, which the students get, is that we all work with the understanding we have at a given time.
Evolution is change over time and even religious understanding changes over time.
I don't state the religious part specifically; I let them draw their own conclusions
about that.
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Mighty Hiker
climber
Vancouver, B.C.
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Feb 14, 2012 - 12:50am PT
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If anyone has the temerity to ask why god isn't mentioned, you can refer to the great natural French philosopher Pierre-Simon Laplace, who wrote many great scientific works. He went to present one of them to the Emperor Napoleon. Someone had told Napoleon that the book contained no mention of god. Napoleon, who was fond of putting embarrassing questions, received it with the remark, 'M. Laplace, they tell me you have written this large book on the system of the universe, and have never even mentioned its Creator.' Laplace drew himself up and answered bluntly, Je n'avais pas besoin de cette hypothèse-là. ("I had no need of that hypothesis.")
And a discussion of the differences between theory, hypothesis and belief might help, too.
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WBraun
climber
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Feb 14, 2012 - 12:55am PT
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So you don't know ultimately.
It's all theory, hypothesis, belief and faith .....
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bookworm
Social climber
Falls Church, VA
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Feb 14, 2012 - 10:23am PT
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seriously?
you've been hired to teach bio; granted, it's not your expertise, but anyone with a college degree (in any subject) should expect the course to include a unit on evolution; if not, then, surely, the curriculum (school, district, or state) indicates the unit...and you're only preparing now?
ok. ok. i'll assume you're a recent/midyear hire and didn't have time to prepare...
you were a bio major and never thought about it? didn't follow the issue? applied to be and were hired to be a science teacher (and, yes, even in a chemistry class) never considered the issue or discussed it with colleagues/mentors? don't have enough of an understanding of a central tenet of your field to provide your students with a solid foundation while simultaneously avoiding serious controversy?
there are no other bio teachers, with more experience, in your school district? you didn't think to ask your department chair or principal?
no, you ask for advice on a climber's forum? and praise said advice without any apparent effort to discern your advisors' teaching credentials or personal biases?
there are dozens of sites on the web that deal with the issue--from multiple perspectives--and offer professional advice, even lesson/unit plans (hint: google 'teaching evolution')
seriously? i see our doom in my clueless 9th graders only to be reminded of the clueless who are teaching them
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cowpoke
climber
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Feb 14, 2012 - 12:03pm PT
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Don't be too discouraged, bookwork.
For good reason, questions about teacher quality are at the top of the national education agenda/debate among policy decision-makers, academics, and the general public.
With all of the discouraging news in mind, however, it is important to take note of the many good things that have been happening in science education (and educating science educators).
The NSF, for example, has for some time now been investing in Science, Technology, Engineering, and Mathematics teaching at the elementary and secondary levels with outstanding (proven and promising) results including, for example, laboratory-based approaches to teaching the teachers:
http://www.nsf.gov/news/news_summ.jsp?cntn_id=115775
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UpoundBUTTS
Gym climber
OK
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Feb 14, 2012 - 01:27pm PT
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wbraun
No, we have different words for things because they have different meanings. You can misuse the word faith to suit your purposes, but that doesn't mean that a scientific theory is based on faith. Do you have faith that if you drop a rock off a cliff that it will fall? No, you have observed thousands of instances of this happening, without one instance if it not happening, yet gravity is still just a theory (and others can confirm your claim that if you drop something it falls). We look at the fossil record and see a nested hierarchy; we can compare morphology and trace ancestry; we compare the DNA of different organisms and trace their ancestry; and most importantly of all, when we compare the picture that is painted by each of these, we see wonderful branching "trees" that independently confirm each other. There is not a more parsimonious, or even coherent, alternative theory that can explain what we see. You can still say that it still relies on faith, but try applying that standard to other things in your life and see how confident you can be in anything. I see many belay-loop-backups in your future.
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