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Trashman
Trad climber
SLC
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Nov 17, 2010 - 09:24am PT
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Ya really want to get on the sticky "edge of the fence"
show of hands, how many of the people voicing righteous indignation here flipped out the other way when Wharton and Smith discussed chopping the original superfluous bolts?
oh, but those were justified bolts b/c they've been there a while, right?
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Delhi Dog
climber
Good Question...
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Nov 17, 2010 - 09:41am PT
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Nobody here really gives a rats arse what I think...
butt for the record, thank you Rolo for the effort of going up there, removing the bolts, and letting us know what is happening.
A big appreciation to to the folks that hauled all that sh*te out of there.
I believe Red Bull ought to take a pretty close look at the situation and realize some things just go beyond the $$.
This is part of their public identity.
Cheers,
DD
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Roxy
Trad climber
CA Central Coast
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Nov 17, 2010 - 10:24am PT
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bump for bolt removal, good work Rolo
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Brian in SLC
Social climber
Salt Lake City, UT
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Nov 17, 2010 - 10:26am PT
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oh, but those were justified bolts b/c they've been there a while, right?
Respect the first ascensionist?
Its all a slippery slope...
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Bullwinkle
Boulder climber
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Nov 17, 2010 - 11:35am PT
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So many Haters from people that have never been to Patagonia or met David Lama, wow. . .
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Prezwoodz
climber
Anchorage
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Nov 17, 2010 - 11:49am PT
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Good job rolo! Sounds like really tuff work!
I am not trying to say anything against it, this is an honest question...but would it not be better to have two rap bolts vs a bunch of slings or gear left in the rock? I am speaking in reference to the anchor you talked about where natural anchor protection is available. I can see the argument for both such as the slings can always come down as could the gear and the damage would be null or non existent vs the bolts which will probably always have a piece of them there. Although the bolts could probably be patched and in a few years gone to the eyes. It just seems like there ends up being a lot of tat out there as I have run across plenty here in Alaska myself.
Once again this is a question and I would love to hear your point of view I am not speaking against you at all and I really appreciate everything you do. I learn by asking questions and listing to the answers of those I respect.
Kelsey
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survival
Big Wall climber
A Token of My Extreme
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Nov 17, 2010 - 11:50am PT
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Nice how the first big link on his blog is Lama "Carves" His Name In History.
BWA HA HA Hahhahaaa!!!
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donini
Trad climber
Ouray, Colorado
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Nov 17, 2010 - 12:05pm PT
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Prezwood, in recent years climbers, mostly europeans, have been using power drills to place bolts at belays in Patagonia. It has been my experience, having climbed 150 plus pitches of new terrain there, that bolts for belays are never needed.
Power drill climbing pretty much precludes alpine ascents. A natural extension would be for the "Army Corps of Engineers" to start constructing escalators.
Style does matter especially given the fact that climbing has no intrinsic value to anyone but the climber.
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curt wohlgemuth
Social climber
Bay Area, California
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Nov 17, 2010 - 01:02pm PT
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Peter Haan wrote:
We all know that some of us have to make a living at it---have to eat and have a future---but it does not have to be that alpinism and the Wild both have to go into slavery for them.
I for one don't know that *anyone* has to make a living via alpinism. I know a number of people do so, but that doesn't mean they *have to*.
I still think the notion of "professional climbers" is ridiculous...
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donini
Trad climber
Ouray, Colorado
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Nov 17, 2010 - 01:08pm PT
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No profession is any more ridiculous than another. Making a real living from climbing is another matter.
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Big Joe
Trad climber
Denver, CO
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Nov 17, 2010 - 01:42pm PT
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Rolo,
Thanks for your hard work. Sounds like a major grunt job to say the least. Sad that new bolts were placed to existing natural anchors and adjacent to natural options mid pitch.
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jfailing
Trad climber
A trailer park in the Sierras
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Nov 17, 2010 - 01:43pm PT
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I just spent the past two hours reading up on this whole fiasco - good to see that the bolts are finally being taken care of - props, Rolo!
A somewhat unrelated question: Is Maestri's compressor actually still on the route? Reading this article made it seem like it was: http://www.alpinist.com/doc/ALP11/climbing-note-grmovsek
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Prezwoodz
climber
Anchorage
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Nov 17, 2010 - 01:51pm PT
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Thank you donini for the response. I feel I am still a beginner when it comes to climbing and to be honest I learned to climb in a gym before i ever went outside. When I began to climb outside it was with partners of my own level I never really got a lesson in ethics or style so I continue to learn as I go and try to make the best decisions possible. The input from others is greatly appreciated.
If the folks who were drilling those bolts with a power drill doing so with a hand drill would it change the perception? When you talk about not needing bolts for belays what do you use to come back down with? Is it gear being left in the rock? Is it better? These are questions I ask myself. What are your thoughts?
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philo
Trad climber
Somewhere halfway over the rainbow
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Nov 17, 2010 - 01:55pm PT
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Having someone with the impeccable credibility of Rolando presenting the real conditions is important for climbing community to know. Understanding their offense and the widespread disdain
of their actions by the climbing community is important for Red Blah, Lama and other climbers and sponsors to come to grips with.
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ol' downbroken climber
climber
Germany
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Nov 17, 2010 - 02:31pm PT
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Great, I will do all my very best to post this in German Mags. Well done, Rolo, the one and only answer to this "breed"
andreas
editor of "bergsteiger"
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Beagle
Trad climber
CO
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Nov 17, 2010 - 02:37pm PT
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Yawn. I'd be more interested in hearing this story if Patagonia was a vast wilderness– but contrary to popular belief, the climbing area described here is littered with fixed ropes, fixed anchors and gear caches. It's not called "Tat-agonia" for nothing. Most well know Patagonia climbers also have multiple gear stashes in the hills to facilitate lighter packs on the walk in. So, while I don't agree with the Lama bolting - maybe we should clean up our own trash before we start preaching!
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mike m
Trad climber
black hills
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Nov 17, 2010 - 03:03pm PT
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Prez, if they were putting them in with a hand drill they would not have put so many in, esspecially not right next to good natural protection.
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Jaybro
Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
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Nov 17, 2010 - 04:22pm PT
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I think there should be cables, like half dome.
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213
climber
Where the Froude number often >> 1
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Nov 17, 2010 - 04:30pm PT
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Thanks, Rolo!!! Keep the shining light of true style and achievement illuminating the real world and casting those who MURDER THE IMPOSSIBLE forever into the shadows of shame and silence!
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