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sunshinedaydream
Trad climber
the big granite bubble
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Nov 13, 2009 - 11:54pm PT
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Yo Karl,
So I don't usually read the details of everyone's El Cap route's, but something keeps bringing me back here. I'm still recovering from an ankle injury at that same spot, from the same blown blue alien and inverted cam hook. Took the same ride, with everyone watching, saying "right on that was some awesome airtime". I've taken lead falls on the Captain and nothing has shaken me like this fall. However, something tonight in reading your report and seeing pictures of you and Jacob, who was recovering from the same ankle injury as mine, kicked my ass back into gear...
Onward!
Jess
P.S. I'm in a rahu dasa cycle and had the same prediction by an astrologer...
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Karl Baba
Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
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Topic Author's Reply - Nov 14, 2009 - 12:19am PT
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Jess wrote
"... I'm still recovering from an ankle injury at that same spot, from the same blown blue alien and inverted cam hook. Took the same ride....P.S. I'm in a rahu dasa cycle and had the same prediction by an astrologer..."
Well if I wasn't trippin' before, I am now!! Thanks for that post!
I'm used to more than meets the eye but I can relate when you say.." I've taken lead falls on the Captain and nothing has shaken me like this fall." I can't say I felt shaken but it did have the intuitive feeling of destiny taking place, shaping my life and future.
Peace
karl
I gotta tack a synopsis of some of this this JuJu talk on the comments of my "trip" report
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Karen
Trad climber
So Cal urban sprawl Hell
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Nov 14, 2009 - 12:19am PT
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Karl, I don't understand many unexlainable things that occur, random stuff without logic. But you're not ready to go, it isn't your time, because I want to meet you and chat with you, about whatever, good enough?
Karen
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Karl Baba
Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
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Topic Author's Reply - Nov 14, 2009 - 12:26am PT
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I don't think I'm going anywhere except the land of change.
Of course change is constant in our lives but mine's been relatively chill in an exciting way for over a decade. Feels like death of some of my old ways, even though I liked them.
Peace
Karl
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Karen
Trad climber
So Cal urban sprawl Hell
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Nov 14, 2009 - 12:44am PT
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Wow, Pate, a bird just about side swiped my face today in the backyard, he came withing inches, oh no....................!!!!
you know when climbing high up on a wall and you're hanging out on a belay and a bird dive bombs down, it makes that cool sound as it wooshes by, well, that is what happened today, 'cept was standing on flat ground, so weird....
My neighbor was chatting with me and it made him jump.
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MH2
climber
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Nov 14, 2009 - 12:58am PT
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Karl, you are wise. Good sense of humor, too, but this is more about the accidents that can take us permanently from the scene, physically, at least. It's good to be able to say that you would not have too much or at least intolerable regret if you weren't around tomorrow. I believe everyone has some understanding that this isn't forever. For most the premonition never gets more specific.
I hope you stay with us a lot longer.
Since you ask, here is a juju story I believe in. It didn't happen to me, but to a friend I made in South Africa. He is famous, to pip the dog at any rate, as the guy who, "once picked up a mamba." He spent time on radio and is a good storyteller and this story is pretty long, but I don't feel comfortable shortening it much.
*
Shortly after you left I flew into a mountain with a paraglider. Broken foot, torn hamstrings, injured back and the like. When looking at my feet, my first thought was that my Scarpa's wouldn't fit.
In February '97 I was involved in a head on collision, at the very robot (traffic light) in Potgietersrus were a policeman pulled us off on the way home from Cape Town. I caught a lift with the tow truck that was removing the Golf to the panel shop. He dropped me off on the outskirts of town, right in front of a Gypsy's caravan. I have seen this particular band often whilst growing up in Gauteng. They would be parked in the same spot each October, and would be at the Rand Easter Show (a big annual fair) and I also saw them a couple of times in Pretoria. There was always something preventing me from making use of their services, I either had a momentary moral objection, no money or no time (mostly the latter two). Standing next to the road with no lift in sight, I had all the time in the world and 32 Rand in my pocket.
An old man showed me into her room at the back of the caravan. I asked how much. She looked at me and said: "Yes, you have enough with you". A cheap trick I know but from that point onwards I had goose flesh. She hardly looked at my palms but started telling me about Oscar, and not in the vague-astrology-this-could-be-anybody kind of way, she was spouting specifics, which she had no right to know. The final question I asked concerned the possibility of a wife. The gist of the answer was that I will not pay heed to the often heard lament of many a married man, and will follow in their betrothed footsteps, she said that I will be happy in marriage. I got up to leave and on my way to the door she said: "You have already seen her once".
Later the same month I was invited to dinner at friends of a friend. The moment I climbed over the balcony railing I was confronted by long black hair and the bluest pair of eyes. They belonged to the friend of the friend' s neighbor, Elaine. She taught fourth grade at one of the English Primary Schools. Throughout the evening we were involved in various friendly arguments, from religion to politics. I couldn't shake the feeling that I have seen her somewhere before. I visited her the next day and the day after and the day after and the day after an ill wind (later realized to be fortuitous) blew me into the mountain and buggered up my feet a bit. Elaine visited me in the hospital and tried not to grimace too much. Upon release from that evil smelling institution it became obvious that I would not be able to return to my previous abode just yet. The lack of a lift, made getting to the third floor in a wheelchair a pretty serious obstacle. Elaine offered me her spare bedroom (she would now probably claim it to have been during a momentary lapse of reason), also her apartment block was the only one with a wheelchair ramp in Pietersburg (still can't handle lifts). The initial idea was that I would stay there until I got onto crutches. Then the idea was that I would move back to my place when the cast was removed. Eventually it became: as soon as I can walk properly. Finally we came to the conclusion that I had less of my stuff in my apartment than hers, and if a move would be made it would be much easier just bringing the rest of my stuff over. In December that year we got engaged.
We visited her parents in White River, a small town in Mpumalanga, about 40 km. from Sabie. On the way back I mentioned that I knew people who lived in White River. A Dutch family called Izzeboud, and before she could answer I realized why Elaine had seemed so familiar when we first met.
My parents had gone off on a 2-month holiday to the Cape when I was in grade 11. During that time there were two long weekends. All my friends were off to various fun-filled locations and it seemed that I would have no option but to spend the weekends alone in the boarding school. Luckily I got an invitation from the Izzeboud's to visit them. The three Izzeboud girls went to a private/religious/American-style/self-motivation type school. That particular Friday was a normal school day for them; they invited me to join them. On the way back that afternoon I saw a girl sitting just ahead and on the other side of the bus from me. She didn't talk to anybody and just stared out the window. When she got up to leave, I saw that she had a pretty face that went with her long black hair, but mostly I noticed her very blue eyes.
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Fletcher
Trad climber
Pasadena, CA
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Nov 14, 2009 - 01:06am PT
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I am enjoying and appreciating all the interesting views and thoughts from the good folks here.
I appreciate the mystery (or maybe, better, mysteries). There's something about humans, especially in this day and age, that makes us think we are capable of explaining everything. Indeed, we can come to understand a lot, but it starts to get a bit arrogant when we think we can absolutely know it all in a rational and logical way.
I've always been a great admirer of Socrates, who didn't believe he was the wisest man in the world because he knew he knew nothing. But after he comes to see that he's the only one who understands that he knows nothing, only then does he realize he probably is the wisest man. The wise fool is a common character in literature and often the only one who can truly "see" the truth. The fool in King Lear comes to mind, as does Kurasawa's Japanese version of Lear, Ran.
I don't think these "Juju" experiences are for the special or unique. Rather, I think we're out of touch with the ways of connecting and recognizing them. There are many ways of "knowing" and logic and rationality is but one. The is emotional knowing and intuitive knowing, for example.
I know in my own life, that whenever I heeded my intuition, positive things tended to occur. And when I didn't, well, that's when I got some hard schoolin'!
My wife and I were at a wedding once (in Bali which is a land full of spirits with a people who are very much in touch with them). At the reception, she started choking on a piece of meat. I very clearly recall her speaking to me, "Eric, I'm choking, help!" But, of course, it was only much later that I realized that she couldn't have physically voiced this. But I very clearly heard her words. I did the Heimlich on her and wasn't performing it strongly enough. In the course of all this, a big,strapping Aussie pal told me, "mate, you gotta use all yer strength... lift her off the ground!" I did, literally yanking her whole body up into the air with my clenched fists. And that chunk of meat came right out. It was a very surreal experience.
Eric
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Jan
Mountain climber
Okinawa, Japan
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Nov 14, 2009 - 01:53am PT
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Eric-
I couldn't agree more and one of the reasons I love living in Asia is that most people here are still in touch with their intuition which has over the years helped me get in better touch with mine. After nine years of secular university education, I needed a lot of deprogramming!
Also, I think there are some spots on this earth that have a special energy which makes it possible to get in touch with other dimensions in this universe. Bali seems to be one, Nepal is one, and Okinawa where I have lived seems to be another. Part of it is the local belief system - the main festival here is to welcome back the ancestors for three days every year.
I believe part of it also, is something to do with the physical environment, a special electromagnetic property. Mountains and oceans seem to have these properties. We do know that all the great Taoist temples in China are built on hills with magnetic properties and Tibetan Buddhists meditate sometimes under copper hoods or magnets. So there is something there, and one of my great frustrations is that I can't find a scientist who can even countenance the possibility that there is a connection.
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Karl Baba
Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
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Topic Author's Reply - Nov 14, 2009 - 01:58am PT
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I’ve got a million trippy stories but here’s one that’s once again climbing accident related.
Way back in 1981 (give or take a year) a buddy and I decided to practice aid up the Stigma on the Cookie Cliff. Back then you could drive right to the base and anchor to your steering wheel or bumper!
It was rated A2 which seemed easy enough that we wouldn’t need pins. We ro sham bo’ed for the lead which I won.
The higher I got, the harder it got. Nearing the (then higher) anchor I had been using crack-in-ups, hooks, micro-stoppers and it kept getting worse. Something ripped and I was suddenly weightless. The rope caught my leg and flipped me upside down. I could feel more gear ripping giving me one weak shock after another as I rocketed in slow motion downwards. I could see the ground approaching fast. I had time to think “Am I going to actually deck? Is this ‘It’”
Booiiing! A piece finally caught me. I was upside down, and close enough to the ground that one more piece blowing might have sent me to the road.
My partner suddenly lost his appetite for leading. It was up to me to go back up and finish the pitch. This time I brought a hammer but, like a testosterone infected youth, only used it once or twice very lightly. I discovered two disturbing things.
One: The #1 wired Hex, placed sideways between two crack protrusions that held my fall, and that I used to Jumar back to my high point; For some reason I cleaned it when I reached the top of the rope. The rock shattered on both sides of it when I cleaned it. It could have easily failed.
Two: Somewhere above that was a #4 stopper still in the crack but with a broken wire. I cleaned it for a souvenir. Eerily, part of the #4 stamp had worn off so that only the shape of a crucifix was visible. At the time, it felt like an omen.
Anyway, I finally got the pitch but it was dark by the time it came for my second to clean. It was threatening to rain with heavy mist coming down. We didn’t have a headlamp so I tore the rear view mirror off my Volkswagen bug and turned on the headlights. I reflected the headlights up on the wall so my partner could see!
Years later I had a very powerful vivid dream harkening back to the accident. In the dream, I took the exact same fall from the exact same perspective but this time I hit the ground. I was stunned and managed to crawl into the passenger seat of my car before my world contracted around me and I knew I was going to die. The world faded around me and I turned within, but an amazing conscious divine light dawned within me. I merged with it and began to expand in all directions. I was expanding, merged with that light outside the boundaries of my body and beyond, beyond, beyond. It was total ecstasy. So much so, that self-consciousness of the experience arose and that brought me back to the waking state.
Not making any particular claims about the experience except that its bliss far surpassed anything that regular life seems to offer.
Peace
karl
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matty
Trad climber
los arbor
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Nov 14, 2009 - 04:21am PT
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Karl - What a wonderful way to honor those who passed. They were lucky to have counted you among their friends. Good job Baba
Matt
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TripL7
Trad climber
'dago'
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Nov 14, 2009 - 06:20am PT
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Karl!
Great story about the 'Stigma'! I also remember how people use to tie off their cars there. I remember once mid-70's walking buy and Hugh B. was kicking back in his front seat belaying someone leading the 'Stigma'.
Actually, I wanted to ask if you had more photo's to go along with the remembrances(Stigma), or anyone else for that matter it would be cool to see.
Thanks Again, Trip~
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Karl Baba
Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
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Topic Author's Reply - Nov 14, 2009 - 12:40pm PT
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I might have taken a picture of the rope hanging from the high point after the fall but it was never scanned, don't know where it is exactly and I'm not at home. I vaguely remember a grainy shot of the splitter crack and a rope. Not too enlightening.
Peace
Karl
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Ray Olson
Trad climber
Imperial Beach, California
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Nov 14, 2009 - 07:37pm PT
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about a month ago, I was reclining on the couch in
my living room with my front door open. my knees
were drawn up, with a blanket over me, dozing
taking a midday nap.
I awoke with the feeling of a soft hand on my knees,
smiled and looked up to see a bird, it had landed
there, perched on my knees.
I spoke to it, "hey birdie" it turned, looked at me
straight on for a brief moment, then took off,
flew outside, and perched on the roof of the
garage.
I would like to know if there is a singular resource
where I can research Greek bird omens.
thanks.
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MH2
climber
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Nov 15, 2009 - 04:42pm PT
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I would like to know if there is a singular resource
where I can research Greek bird omens.
I don't know of one but there is a bird encounter somewhat like the one you relate in Man's Search for Meaning by Viktor Frankl. Part of that book is an account of his time in several German concentration camps during WWII.
"Another time we were at work in a trench. The dawn was gray around us; gray was the sky above; gray the snow in the pale light of dawn; gray the rags in which my fellow prisoners were clad, and gray their faces. I was again conversing silently with my wife...more and more I felt that she was present, that she was with me; I had the feeling that I was able to touch her, able to stretch out my hand and grasp hers. The feeling was very strong: she was there. Then, at that very moment, a bird flew down silently and perched just in front of me, on the heap of soil which I had dug up from the ditch, and looked steadily at me."
Personally I see no reason not to allow chance to account for what seem to us eerie coincidences. The world is vast and every moment holds the opportunity for coincidences, most of which probably go unnoticed. Why, just last night I made it another few pages through my current reading project and came across:
"Now after an injury, physical, spiritual, whatever, one always believes had one followed a premonition (there is usually in such instance an imagined premonition) nothing would have happened; still, had I absolute foreknowledge, I should have gone right ahead, for in every lifetime there occur situations when one is no more than a thread in a design willfully woven by ... who should I say? God?"
Other Voices, Other Rooms
copyright 1948 by Truman Capote
published as a Signet book by arrangement with Random House
Tenth printing
pp. 81,82
I took a fall on the Stigma, too, in the 70s, trying to aid it on small stoppers. One of several lessons, or messages if you prefer, that aid climbing isn't for me.
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Ricky D
Trad climber
Sierra Westside
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Nov 15, 2009 - 05:35pm PT
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Should we start calling you Karl Jung?
Or would that invoke too much synchronicity?
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Ray Olson
Trad climber
Imperial Beach, California
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Nov 15, 2009 - 05:58pm PT
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yes, MH2, I saw a coincidence of sorts.
let me complete the story, cause there
is a trippy juju element :-)
when the bird took off it first lit
on the roof of my car, within view
of the couch.
I got up, walked to the door, and the
bird moved up, onto the roof of the
detached garage.
as I stood looking at it, the thought entered my
head, "the bird wants me to get out" as in,
excersise I assumed.
then the brid took off.
this was temp lodging for me while house hunting
for real. turns out the propane furnace had a clogged
vent, and was probably emitting carbon monoxide,
along with other issues...I no longer dwell there.
it is a coincidence - but kinda trippy.
"the bird wants me to get out."
thanks for your reply :-)
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Karl Baba
Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
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Topic Author's Reply - Nov 15, 2009 - 06:31pm PT
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In my trippy experience, the best way to process our poetic experience of omens and events is intuitively. How does it strike you within? Sometimes you just have to sit with not knowing.
Seems like Ray got the direction out of the house from within and looks like a good idea as well
Reading up on the symbolic meaning of omens and getting too mental about anything often leads us to making up stories.
Peace
Karl
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Ray Olson
Trad climber
Imperial Beach, California
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Nov 15, 2009 - 07:49pm PT
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Karl, what was interesting was how the thought
"felt" as it entered my head. I cannot decribe it,
but it feels different, if you will, than "stream of
conciousness". Just instinct I guess.
Karl, may I ask a question about Yosemite?
it has to do with the place behind the visitor
center, where the big tree and the benches are,
by the entrance to the auditoriums.
The question is, do you recall how many benches
there are, surrounding that big tree?
I had a trippy juju experience there, but cannot
remember how many benches there are?
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Karl Baba
Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
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Topic Author's Reply - Nov 15, 2009 - 08:06pm PT
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"Karl, what was interesting was how the thought
"felt" as it entered my head. I cannot decribe it,
but it feels different, if you will, than "stream of
conciousness". Just instinct I guess."
Yup, there is a kind of direct knowledge that feels like a compressed download that unpacks itself as sudden knowing in your head without having to be reasoned or imagined. Sort of like that?
Can't speak about the benches in the valley but Werner is very close to that spot often so he might be able to tell you
My mobility is limited these days for reasons noted higher in the thread
Peace
Karl
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Ray Olson
Trad climber
Imperial Beach, California
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Nov 15, 2009 - 08:42pm PT
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yes Karl, you are right about the way the
thought feels. It isn't a big deal, just sorta
like the "arrival of a letter".
The number of benches behind the visitor
center in the valley may be irrelevant.
Many of us know the spot.
The bench in question is the one on the east side
of that big tree. I worked there one summer, selling
tickets for the John Muir show and "proved my theory"
by sharing it with someone so they could watch too.
I had noticed when I walked into that area, and had
time to wait, that I "liked" a certain spot on that bench,
the one under and on the east side of the tree. I sat there
and looked down. A section of root protrudes from the
earth, right under ones feet.
The section of root isn't very big, but distinct.
I noticed, because I sat with my back to the auditorium
facing west, that others liked to sit at that spot too.
It was funny.
The spot is pretty much dead center on that bench,
the root right under your feet.
So, one night walking back to camp after the show
the root came up in my minds eye. I wasn't really
walking around dwelling on this, the image
of the root just showed up.
Then, for no good reason, the thought of why the
root protrudes showed up. Could it be a rock under
there? But the thought said, "no" there is something
under there making that root protrude.
Not a rock.
At this point, I began to weep.
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