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reddirt
climber
Elevation 285 ft
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Ron Anderson:
Given your logic, why aren't you also fixated on the fact that the Ft Hood shooter was an undergrad at Va Tech (32 dead in 2007 shooting, psychiatric-case shooter...... oh yea, there was a decapitation there too).
Hasan was an American Soldier with potentially extreme beliefs... just like Timothy McVeigh (167 killed).
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John Moosie
climber
Beautiful California
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True Muslims do not believe in such actions, just as true Christians don't, yet both religions have people who "act" like terrorist. Christians have their abortion doctor murders, and muslims have this guy. Don't blame the faith, blame the radical extremist on either side. Blame those who think war is the first answer and who wouldn't give this guy a compassionate discharge, though he asked for one and was willing to pay back the military for the cost of his schooling.
Then see that how it is possible that this guy just cracked under the pressure. It is sad how the military handles its people. They often don't help them, until they crack, then hope that they don't crack in a big way. Just look at psychiatrist who treat those with PTSD. They are at risk for what is called secondary trauma, meaning that the stress of listening to patients own trauma can lead to their own trauma.
Yet how does the military handle this? They have the psychiatrist fill out a form in which they rate their own stress level. That is like asking a surgeon to perform surgery on himself. It just isn't possible and doctors are constantly warned not to treat themselves, yet that is exactly what the military does.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/time/08599193640700
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JEleazarian
Trad climber
Fresno CA
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I've been tempted to comment on this since it happened, but I still think don't know enough to do anything except jump to conclusions. I want to know at least the following two things:
1. Should we have known this man was likely to attack his fellow soldiers? Before you say "sure," the real thrust of my question is to probe what discernable actions the shooter undertook that differed from ordinary M.D.'s in the military; and
2. If we should have known, why didn't we do something about him?
We can make religious and ethnic comments all we want (and, for the record, I think there are large segments of the Muslim community that have not renounced violence, and who see the American presence in the Middle East as an affront to Islam), but until we know how this man was able to perpetrate this attack, the rest of our speculation won't help us. We've already suffered two internal attacks on our military. Let's make sure there aren't any more, and let's shoot with a rifle, not a shotgun. I feel for the many good people who fear what may come here because they are Muslims.
John
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John Moosie
climber
Beautiful California
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1. Should we have known this man was likely to attack his fellow soldiers?
That might be impossible to know, but we could do better then having a doctor rate his own stress level.
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Mighty Hiker
climber
Vancouver, B.C. Small wall climber.
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There is also the broader matter of violence within the armed forces, not just those of the US. That is, suicide, murder, rape, and assaults, both during and after service. There are several hundred suicides among those serving in the US army each year - although whether that's disproportionate in comparison with a comparable non-military cohort (age, health, socio-economic and psychological status) may be interesting. I couldn't quickly find statistics re US military-military murders, but got the impression that violence against women in the military is a bad problem. And then there are veterans, how they're treated and what they sometimes do.
(We have similar problems in the Canadian forces, including several cases of soldiers in Afghanistan committing suicide, or killing other soldiers.)
Certainly the military is in a dirty business - that's their job. How much self-inflicted violence of whatever sort is acceptable in that context?
http://www.cnn.com/2009/US/05/27/kentucky.army.suicide/index.html#cnnSTCOther1
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Mighty Hiker
climber
Vancouver, B.C. Small wall climber.
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Merely trying to add some relevant context - a commodity you could do with more of. And trying to avoid jumping to conclusions, however tempting and easy it may be to do so.
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TripL7
Trad climber
'dago'
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Mighty Hiker!
That is a sad development (suicide rate has doubled since 2004) among our soldiers. It seemed to go down during the couple years of initial 'success' and then shoot up.
It does sadly parallel Viet Nam in many ways.
So sad.
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TGT
Social climber
So Cal
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Nov 10, 2009 - 03:12pm PT
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He reacted "that way" because he's an acolyte of the "Cult of the Child Molesting Warlord"
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4damages
climber
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Nov 10, 2009 - 03:33pm PT
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I'm wondering,
1. if he was housed inside where this occurred or with his servers and
2. if so were any of his servers discovered breached at night?
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4damages
climber
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Nov 10, 2009 - 09:43pm PT
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"A criminal with a toothache?"
bluering,
http://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution/constitution.billofrights.html#amendmenti
Just proceeding the ten commandments it's
noted that a person whom takes the life of another
after the another breaks into the persons home, that
person has then not committed murder? Have you ever
read USC that could be interpreted as assassins code? This
is why I'm asking what I did just proceeding what appears to
be account compromise.
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mdavid
Big Wall climber
CA, CO, TX
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Nov 10, 2009 - 09:58pm PT
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clearly the military has become so politically guided that when an officer spouts ridiculous crap folks are afraid to act...Hasan should have been filtered out long ago.
It's too bad he'll be killed relatively quickly. They should be allowed to torture in cases like this.
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TGT
Social climber
So Cal
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Nov 11, 2009 - 11:00pm PT
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He's not likely to be executed:
Not with this CINC.
A life at hard labor with a diet of Spam may be a more fitting end for a would be martyr.
Make him wait to see the doe eyed houris untill he's to old to get it up.
Then bury him in a pig skin.
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TGT
Social climber
So Cal
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Nov 11, 2009 - 11:08pm PT
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Are you drunk again?
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tradmanclimbs
Ice climber
Pomfert VT
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Nov 11, 2009 - 11:24pm PT
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It is not cojecture that his religion was a motovating factor. He was screaming God is great in arabic while shooting. That certainly does not mean that he was not mentaly ill. It does however make those who deny the religious angle look pretty darn silly.
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S.Leeper
Sport climber
Austin, Texas
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Topic Author's Reply - Nov 20, 2009 - 10:50pm PT
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Should he spend the rest of his life in a wheel chair, or get the death penalty?
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, Ca.
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Nov 20, 2009 - 11:16pm PT
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Wes, why are you so obsessed with this story, of Abu Gharaib?
Didn't they get condemned and punished?
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