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madbolter1
Big Wall climber
Denver, CO
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We tried out that Desert Eagle, and it does scream quality. But it is a heavy gun, even the 1911 version. I was hoping for one gun that would be good for both of us. But I'm seeing that even the .40 is a bit much for my wife. She's just too small-built to recover from the recoil and get back on target quickly. She handles it just fine, but the retargetting delay is unacceptable. So, a .45 would be the same issue.
Gotta go .380 or 9mm for her. Even the .380 has acceptable penetration, and within typical self-defense range it is accurate enough that shot placement is a go.
I hear, though, that all .380s jam quite a bit. The Walther is supposedly better on this score, but "better" isn't good if it's an actual problem!
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madbolter1
Big Wall climber
Denver, CO
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Thanks, Reilly. We actually tried various Glocks, and she hates the way they all feel in her hand.
I am also a big believer in an exposed hammer and external safety. That debate could rage endlessly of course, but I'm not an internal striker fan at all.
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madbolter1
Big Wall climber
Denver, CO
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Mmm... that Colt Mustang does look sweet!
I'm gonna have to check that out and then see if she likes it.
Thanks!
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madbolter1
Big Wall climber
Denver, CO
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Indeed!
Now, if she will only like the feel of the grip....
Fingers crossed.
Thanks for the suggestions! And this is a much more productive direction for this thread to go. ;-)
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frank wyman
Mountain climber
montana
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After trying various styles of handguns for the wife, she grabed my 38 special (wheel gun)It works for her as it is a point and shoot, and she does not have to work the slide. She always has some kind of lotion or goop on her hands and not alot of finger strengh. She also likes my taurus "Judge" with 410 shot shells as shes not that good of a aim either.But in case of a intruder she will a least scare them off with with plenty of shot pellets.
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madbolter1
Big Wall climber
Denver, CO
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Well, there's no "perfect gun." There's only the one that fits an individual best and enables him/her to place shots consistently, reliably, and comfortably.
Then it's train, train, train... until shot placement and tactical awareness are second nature. Then train some more.
It is great that there are SO many good options, though. One CAN find the "good" gun for about anybody.
A bit of reading, and I'm liking that Colt more and more. Great suggestion, Ron. Ahh... will she like the grip? Hehe
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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I'm surprised she doesn't even like the small Glock, the 28 is it with the interchangeable grips?
I can only get a couple of fingers around that handle.
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madbolter1
Big Wall climber
Denver, CO
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She also likes my taurus "Judge" with 410 shot shells as shes not that good of a aim either.But in case of a intruder she will a least scare them off with with plenty of shot pellets.
We've considered that option also, and it's certainly not off the table. In most cases, just pulling a gun makes the roaches scatter, which is all you really need to accomplish. And getting hit with a load of 410 up close and personal will make most anyone want to drag themselves off (if they can) to reconsider their life of crime!
Well, gotta go to the range. I'll check back later in the afternoon.
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TradEddie
Trad climber
Philadelphia, PA
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If you grant, as you appear to, that packing a gun can be a good thing in a "high crime area," then its goodness is sweeping, as you simply don't know what is "high crime" and what is just you getting mugged or accosted.
Not so at all. Owning a gun increases the chances of you or a family member being shot. Any increase in safety against muggers/burglars/mass murderers/bogeymen needs to offset the increased risk from intentional or accidental use of that gun, or from the poor decisions you make because you have that gun. For most people, this calculation should be simple.
The FBI reports about 200 "justifiable homicides" by civilians each year, compared to about 600 accidental deaths by firearm, and almost 2000 women murdered with a firearm by their husband or boyfriend. You'd have have to live in a really shitty area to counteract those odds.
TE
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madbolter1
Big Wall climber
Denver, CO
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You'd have have to live in a really shitty area to counteract those odds.
It all depends on how you interpret the "odds." This is a classic example of why Twain said, "There are lies, damned lies, and statistics."
Put your "odds" up against hundreds of millions of handguns owned and tens of millions carried, and I'd say that the "odds" are looking pretty good that you're gonna get hit by lightening many times before you're gonna shoot yourself or be shot by your own gun.
And the FBI statistics don't list how many incidents were outright averted just by the presence of a legally-carried handgun. Those are impossible to know. What we DO know is that in the US there is a clear correlation between increasingly restrictive handgun laws and increased incidents of homicides by handgun. Again, Chicago is a tough nut to crack for gun-control proponents, as is Washington DC.
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madbolter1
Big Wall climber
Denver, CO
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LOL... so I did a bit of a test today. I drank a lot of caffeinated soda until I was nice and jittery. Then at the range I fired at double my typical cadence. As expected, I had about half the accuracy as usual.
After thousands of rounds fired, it never ceases to amaze me what slight variations of "aim" produce a huge difference down range. The physics of trajectory make it downright amazing that we can ever hit anything at all. LOL
So, trying to approximate something of the physical jitters that would be likely in a real incident, it's clear that I need to stay with the caffeine and change up the cadence until I get that more dialed in. Today reminds me yet again: "Gun control is a steady hand."
The whole discipline of shooting well is extremely enjoyable.
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fear
Ice climber
hartford, ct
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Shooting under stress is key to real practice. Try out a few IDPA events or local club shoots... Even just the timer buzzing with people watching will get the blood pumping. And it will still be NOTHING compared to a real armed situation...
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TGT
Social climber
So Cal
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que es your recomandacion por un pistola to use for problem with ocupantes ilegales?
Pistola, no!
Mina Terrestre, Si!
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Norton
Social climber
the Wastelands
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Again, Chicago is a tough nut to crack for gun-control proponents, as is Washington DC.
yes
clearly the answer to Chicago's gun violence is more guns
if more people are armed then the bad guys will think twice before shooting
stupid efforts to curb shootings are futile and should be given up on
after all, these things are just the price to be paid to make our society stays Free
seems a small price to protect the 2nd Amendment
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madbolter1
Big Wall climber
Denver, CO
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Try pulling a gun on a lot of extremely violent ex-convicts, men who have lived with brutal violence from an early age, and I'd wager many of them won't flee in terror at all, just the opposite...they will just insert that gun up your keester
Actually, you yet again reveal that you have no clue what you are talking about.
For myself, I grew up in Riverside/San Bernardino and hung around these "types" almost my whole life. I spent years around the Diablos, and I think I can say something about criminal thinking and activity from very intimate association with it.
They won't "flee in terror" as you describe it, but they WILL take a pulled gun very, very seriously. They will look to deescalate the situation, even if they started escalating it in the first place. They respect strength and are not looking to get killed. Give them an out in the context of matched strength, and they will take it.
Furthermore, they do not train! Most of the guys I knew couldn't hit the broad side of a barn. Even with knives they were often completely incompetent. One story....
One of the Diablos I knew decided that some guy needed all of his tires slashed one night. I mean all of them, twelve tires, as a simple message.
First tire, my friend stabs into the tire and his hand slides on the grip. Cut to the bone across most of his palm.
Most easily concealable knives don't have a good grip, and his showed how useful it would typically be in a real fight. How much did this guy train with his knife? Not at all. Same with the two guns he carried. Same with all of the guys I knew.
They depend largely on the intimidation factor. I'm not saying that they can't get down for real, almost on a whim. But they are NOT trained nor tactically aware. And they DO respect strength for strength.
Those are your typical "gangland" elements. When you get to sad-off street thugs, well, their situation is even more pathetic!
You need to watch a few of the many YouTube videos showing gang-bangers and street thugs intent on harming citizens, and they scatter like roaches as soon as the first citizen pulls a gun and starts shooting.
There are always exceptions to the rule, but the rule IS that these elements do not expect to confront strength for strength, and they are VERY prepared to back away when the odds are not heavily in their favor. Give a clear out, be calm and serious, and you can deescalate virtually all such situations.
I can tell you from repeated personal experience that producing the gun in all seriousness has an amazing tendency to back the situation down rather than escalate it. But I do mean "in all seriousness." Gangland types can tell if you are not serious. The rule is absolutely true: Do not pull the gun unless you really are prepared to kill what you are aiming at.
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madbolter1
Big Wall climber
Denver, CO
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clearly the answer to Chicago's gun violence is more guns
Finally you are starting to see the light!
Would somebody please explain how ANY of the federally-proposed gun control laws will keep guns out of the hands of criminals? Causal chains, please?
I really want to understand this from your perspective. I mean that. I just don't get the causal theory that underlies these proposed laws.
Even our lib/dem governor, Hickenlooper has backed entirely away from his earlier stance that got Colorado its first significant slate of gun control laws. Quotes from a recent meeting with Sheriffs (virtually all of whom vehemently oppose the new laws)....
"I’ll tell you the funny story, and it is a weird... I think we screwed that up... we were performing legislation without basic facts, which I think is a bad idea in every case. It took almost a month to get the facts. By that time I had pissed you guys off... There was passed legislation that I had said I was going to sign."
"I apologize. I don’t think we did a good job on any of that stuff."
And regarding the Aurora shooting, Hickenlooper said that the whole slate of new laws would have had no effect, summarizing: "This person, if there were no assault weapons available, if there were no this or no that, this guy’s going to find something. Right? He’s going to know how to create a bomb. Who knows where his mind would have gone. Clearly a very intelligent individual however twisted. That’s the problem, this is a human issue in some profound way."
Hickenlooper is STARTING to get a clue about how badly down the road Bloomberg led him. But the political damage has already been done. Now, literally nobody in Colorado has a CLUE what the guy actually stands for!
But he is admitting the gun-control laws don't have an effect on the sorts of shootings they are designed to protect against. Again, STARTING to get a clue.
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
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madb0lter posted And the FBI statistics don't list how many incidents were outright averted just by the presence of a legally-carried handgun. Those are impossible to know.
Which means we can all take comfort in imagining it to be a super huge number!
madb0lter continued
What we DO know is that in the US there is a clear correlation between increasingly restrictive handgun laws and increased incidents of homicides by handgun.
We also know how to abuse statistics.
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StahlBro
Trad climber
San Diego, CA
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How many people have lived because no one had a gun when things got out of hand? I bet it is 10X the amount of times guns have saved someone.
You can have it both ways.
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madbolter1
Big Wall climber
Denver, CO
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How many people have lived because no one had a gun when things got out of hand?
Yes, and if you can figure out how to answer my question from above, please do let us know: Exactly how will ANY proposed gun laws keep guns out of the hands of criminals?
When you can insure that bad guys are not going to accost us in armed fashion, then and only then will you start to get some sympathy from me for your anti-gun cause. Meanwhile, I'll exercise my right of self-defense (that has NOTHING to do with the Second Amendment) with any appropriate means.
"Appropriate means" is any tools necessary to effectively respond to the sorts of threats I as an individual, or me and my family, are likely to encounter.
At present, that includes guns.
Show me how you are going to disarm criminals and whack-jobs, and if that can come to pass I will then not have any use for a gun.
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