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Craig Fry
Trad climber
So Cal.
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So you just speculate that there is, and have faith in your belief without any evidence what so ever
believe me
If there was any evidence, I would be so excited about it, and have many more questions....
Why should it be hidden? if it exists at all, we should be able to do all the investigations we want
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paul roehl
Boulder climber
california
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So you just speculate that there is, and have faith in your belief without any evidence what so ever
No, I don't speculate in either direction. I simply realize there's a lot that we simply don't know. I'm not willing to discount what I can't know. Your certainty with regard to consciousness is the only faith I see here.
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Craig Fry
Trad climber
So Cal.
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You said above there was consciousness without a brain
so it isn't you can go either direction, you have made your decision
all based on speculation, correct?
If something is possible but has no evidence, you have to accept it without question
Because as you say, "no one can know"
I did the reread, I have no corrections to put forward
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paul roehl
Boulder climber
california
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You said above there was,
I did not. You need to reread what I said. You might find it interesting.
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WBraun
climber
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God has the supreme brain.
Infinitely greater than any Fry brain.
Thus consciousness originated before the creation of all material manifestations .....
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paul roehl
Boulder climber
california
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I did the reread, I have no corrections to put forward
Really? Is that how science operates? A bit disingenuous don't you think?
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Mark Force
Trad climber
Ashland, Oregon
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God has the supreme brain.
Infinitely greater than any Fry brain.
Thus consciousness originated before the creation of all material manifestations .....
Because you say so?
I say Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy is a true travelogue.
Craig Fry, Do enough psilocybin and you will experience the consciousness in all things...I think so, anyway that's what did it for me. Take enough and it will be lasting or, wait, maybe that was just a psychotic break! ;-)
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paul roehl
Boulder climber
california
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consciousness existed before there was a brain, because it's here.
Here? It seems to be restricted to biological brains, does it not?
and there is no evidence of it existing before brains
the slow evolution of the brain explains consciousness,
are you saying that it existed before and was somehow transferred to biological brains?
Why? How? When?
Here you quoted only part of what I said. The actual sentence was "the potential for consciousness existed before there was a brain."
Science needs to do a better job than that.
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Craig Fry
Trad climber
So Cal.
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Mark
I experienced what you talk about in many different ways, I've had many experiences that were very spiritual, as in "all" of what you are talking about
I was a big Religious/Eastern Philosophy person for 20 years
but after 40 years of spiritual searching, this is where I am now
the farther you go down the road of spiritual searching, and delve into personal honesty and truth, the more likely you become an atheist
I guess you suckers will have to change your posts now after my edit
talk about reactionaryism, you guys go off with the slightest word tangle
so far, you got nothing
and embarrassing yourselves with your over the top reactions
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WBraun
climber
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Fry --- "I experienced it all"
No sane person would ever say this ......
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MikeL
Social climber
Southern Arizona
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rbord: Marriage is a physical aspect of humans life . . . .
I don’t think it is. What happens physically? I should hope marriage is a social and psychological event.
Contractor: My broader point was that dogmatic religion is much worse in my view.
I’d say dogmatic anything indicates a closed mind. I don’t think anyone has to restrict it to religion. I’d say there are a grand number of things that people believe without a question of a doubt that they don’t know because they’ve not read the research, they’ve not had the experience, they’ve never looked for themselves. Just about every “thing” is a belief.
Craig: I experienced it all
All? You must be God.
You are so over the top. It’s difficult to find anything that you write that one can take seriously. You seem to be in a constant rant.
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Craig Fry
Trad climber
So Cal.
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anyone have any evidence of non-biological consciousness?
No
so these reactions are all about trying to attack me because you have no acceptable response for providing evidence on your claims that I am wrong
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WBraun
climber
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Fry --- "anyone have any evidence of non-biological consciousness?"
Then he answers the question to everyone as "NO".
Again, no sane person does this .......
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Craig Fry
Trad climber
So Cal.
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Well than, please answer the question
Can you prove me wrong that there is no evidence?
all I need is evidence, then I'm completely with you guys
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WBraun
climber
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You're insane.
No one can talk to you ......
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Craig Fry
Trad climber
So Cal.
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^^^
You're insane.
No one can talk to you ......
and no evidence?
all speculation based on hope and faith that some God exists
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Mark Force
Trad climber
Ashland, Oregon
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Craig, Are you an atheist or an agnostic?
In practice, I'm a science-loving research wonk and metrics freak measuring and remeasuring stuff to understand what's happening as a doc and still believe there's a "ghost in the machine" that leaves room for vitalism.
I get your frustration with the spiritual materialism game. None of it means sh#t until the "rubber meets the road" and your religion/spirituality/philosophy/ethic leads you to make a difference that matters to someone else.
But, that's just my "matrix."
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Craig Fry
Trad climber
So Cal.
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After many years of spiritual searching and research
I became an atheist
not an agnostic
BUT
as all of us atheists agree upon, we look for evidence to prove us wrong
this hasn't happened yet, so we will have to maintain our position until it happens
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Studly
Trad climber
WA
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Craig Fry, I feel sorry for you you. Seek and you will find, knock and the door will open. Guaranteed. You've never really looked.
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Craig Fry
Trad climber
So Cal.
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I feel sorry for all the people that have beliefs in something that doesn't exist
I knocked years ago, I found what was on the other side of the door,
nothing
So many ancient religions that no one believes in, so why don't you accept them, apparently most of these people only believe in one belief that is promoted by big money, and reject all other religions just like us atheists
Money, it all comes down to what big money promotes
If you live in America, big money promotes Christian Propaganda
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