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duke of puke
climber
boulder, co
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Jul 11, 2013 - 02:01am PT
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Okay, the voice of reason here.
First off, the folks that talk of paving the one 10th of a mile to get to the entrance have to be sport climbers. Tell me I'm wrong, but those people are insane on insisting that all has to be smooth and clean or it's just _such_ an inconvenience, to them _and_ their cars. People like this are how I got my name.
Second, didn't pitbull suggest that the low lifes will increase vagrant-ism, thereby causing more cop calls, and then suggest he'd do things that cause more cop calls? Seems contradictory. Contradictory people are to be ignored.
Third, I've been poppin' into Eldo for 30 yrs now, and it just seems a Hostel at the mouth of this one-road canyon is a dumb idea. Eldo is not the same as the Tetons. If they were serious about a Hostel in a place that can absorb it, they'd put it in Boulder so people wouldn't have to drive there at night anyways. Even Camp 4 had the Lizard Lounge. There's not one in Eldo. And if the AAC had any smarts at all, they'd put it up in Estes Park, where's there's more than one dirt road, and the expanse behind it is far more copious, just like the Tetons. RMNP camp sites are catered to RVs and screaming kids so there's more than a small demand. And there's many a Lizard Lounge to be had right off the paved roads!
Fourth, thanks for the videos guys. They made my day!
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philo
Trad climber
Is that light the end of the tunnel or a train?
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Jul 11, 2013 - 11:09am PT
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A low impact walk to and from Hostel has many benefits are larger "campground" doesn't.
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JLP
Social climber
The internet
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Jul 11, 2013 - 12:04pm PT
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Estes already has a hostel.
Fact: Most climbers are going to get in their car and drive to Avalon to climb grid bolted 7's that are rated 9+.
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Snowmassguy
Trad climber
Calirado
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Jul 11, 2013 - 03:01pm PT
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^^^If you offer to stand at the park entrance with a sign denouncing the hostel/lodge, Pitbull or similar will certainly put you up for a few nights.
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blahblah
Gym climber
Boulder
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Jul 11, 2013 - 03:18pm PT
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Contrary to the opinion of some on this thread, my impression was that it's a tremendously beautiful place and the climbing looks absolutely stellar. I'd love to climb there but there doesn't appear to be an easy destination for someone without a vehicle. I need to be able to reside somewhere in fairly close proximity to the climbing. Is there any cheap/free camping nearby (my bowel movements tend to be very small if that's a factor).
Did anyone on this thread express an opinion that Eldo is not a beautiful place? I must have missed that. While beauty is subjective, I've never heard anyone who likes rocks/cliffs/canyons/mountains dis Eldo from that perspective.
The climbing is debatable; I think everyone would have to admit that the better routes are very good, but there are a lot of schwag routes, choss, short cruxes, and less than ideal pro(in large part because of very strict rules on adding fixed pro). I'd say it's clearly a very good local area, but perhaps something less than a major travel destination. As is often observed, there's a reason why you see so many Greenies in WY and UT and elsewhere, but not so many of them around here!
There is no cheap/free camping nearby in the sense that it is at all workable without a car. If you have a car, you can make some things work, but it's still not close; be prepared to drive a ways.
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newAAC
Trad climber
Denver, Colorado
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Jul 11, 2013 - 03:26pm PT
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All,
I have to say that within all the banter here there has been a fair bit of useful input. Thank you for that.
Pasted below is the text of the letter I just sent to the Eldorado Community. The bottom line is that we are not going to buy the Post Office building. In conversations with our members and others, we have come to learn that there is real demand for something and we are going to keep looking.
One story before I move on to the letter. In 1983 I made my first climbing road trip to the West. My first stop, in my 1965 pick up truck (still driving it, now with half a million miles on it), was Eldorado. The camping in what is now the lower parking lot was just what I needed. Hopefully we can find something similar for climbers today.
Here's the letter:
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July 10, 2013
Dear Eldorado Springs Community Members and Other Interested Parties;
I want to inform you that after a great deal of thoughtful investigation into the possibility of turning the Eldorado Springs Post Office building into a lodging facility, the American Alpine Club has decided not to proceed with the purchase of the building.
Our investigations into this project have been comprehensive. We have looked into zoning, parking, traffic, impact on local systems and to the community in general. We listened to local citizens. We have assessed the demand for lodging from the climbing community. We filtered all this new information through the lens we use to make decisions about when and where to pursue lodging for climbers.
The American Alpine Club seeks to get involved when notable climbing destinations – such as Eldorado Canyon – are not served by inexpensive lodging options. If a need for lodging exists at an iconic climbing area, we try to establish campgrounds or dormitory-style facilities for the climbing community. Typically we locate these facilities within walking distance to the crag.
Climbers seeking to test their skills either in the Canyon or other Front Range climbing locations need better access to reasonably priced places to stay. Given our decision not to move forward with the purchase of the Post Office, this demand will remain unfulfilled for now.
In this process, we learned that the number of climbers seeking lodging in the Front Range is greater than the Post Office space can meet. As many of you have pointed out, there is simply no room to grow or expand in the Post Office building. The demand for lodging from the climbing community suggests that we need a property that can be expanded over time – even if we must delay the project and compromise on our walking-distance criterion.
Eldorado Canyon remains the central Front Range objective for traveling climbers. So we will continue our search for something with a little more room to grow, but still within easy carpooling or biking distance from the beautiful place many of you live beneath.
I hope we find a great location for climbers who visit the Front Range. If we do we will strive to be great neighbors there. I also hope we can count on you to come out in support of our plan if we find something that is a better fit.
Respectfully yours,
Phil Powers
AAC Executive Director
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Don Paul
Big Wall climber
Colombia, South America
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Jul 11, 2013 - 03:27pm PT
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Re: where to camp for free. There's national forest land up by Rocky Mtn Park. Also possible to guerrilla camp up on magnolia road in Coal Creek Canyon but beware all the criminals doing the same.
* I forgot to mention, there are some old mine shafts in Boulder Canyon that supposedly have people living in them. The locals may be hostile there, I have never tried it.
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Crackslayer
Trad climber
Eldo
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Jul 11, 2013 - 03:33pm PT
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Word Phil good choice
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Helene Donovan
Social climber
Eldorado Springs
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Jul 11, 2013 - 04:16pm PT
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Thank you AAC, Phil Powers and Mark Kroese, AAC is lucky to have such great leaders! You can count on my support for an alternative spot for lodging or camping for climbers in Boulder County.
Thanks again for making a difficult decision and weighing the options for the climbers and the Eldorado community.
Have a great summer!
Helene
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blahblah
Gym climber
Boulder
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Jul 11, 2013 - 04:28pm PT
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Phil--I like the letter, I am not an AAC member but will consider joining, good luck.
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fluffy
Trad climber
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Jul 11, 2013 - 05:00pm PT
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Also possible to guerrilla camp up on magnolia road in Coal Creek Canyon
Magnolia Rd. isn't actually in Coal Creek Canyon...it's off Peak to Peak just S. of Ned. And it's not the place it was after the huge Forest Thinning Project (clear cutting) that just took place up there.
Phil, thanks for the diplomacy. Here's hoping Burris is able to learn from this and adopt an attitude more representative of your organization's philosophy.
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goatboy smellz
climber
Nederland-GulfBreeze
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Jul 11, 2013 - 05:15pm PT
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Lovegasoline
Trad climber
Sh#t Hole, Brooklyn, NY
Jul 11, 2013 - 11:55am PT
What are the options for camping at Eldo now?
Is there any cheap/free camping nearby (my bowel movements tend to be very small if that's a factor
Just drop some acid then head to The Sink like last time.
Meet up with some cool folks then go back to their place and listen to Pink Floyd.
I don't remember any sleeping and I don't think you can do that on a daily basis.
The FS land surrounding Nederland is the closest free legal camping.
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Janet Robinson
climber
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Jul 11, 2013 - 05:21pm PT
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Thanks to all the climbers and residents who have shared their thoughts regarding the hostel.
Thank - you Super Topo for giving us the opportunity.
Thank- you Phil Powers, Mark Kroese and the AAC Board for considering all the issues and for reaching a timely decision. Thanks also Phil for updating both the Eldo community and Super Topo.
All the Best to the AAC with their search for the right spot.
Janet Robinson.
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JLP
Social climber
The internet
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Jul 11, 2013 - 06:14pm PT
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The FS land surrounding Nederland is the closest free legal camping. Actually it's probably either Gross or Lefthand - which one is better will depend on how capable your 4x4 is and your tolerance for firearms.
The 101 on FS camping in the USA - find the "MVUM" or "Motor Vehicle Use Map" for the area. It is the final word and legal documentation on where you can legally drive off road and camp on FS land. Check the legend for "Dispersed Camping". Google these terms.
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goatboy smellz
climber
Nederland-GulfBreeze
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Jul 11, 2013 - 06:24pm PT
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Lefthand and Gross have militant homeowners nearby that will report your ass to the sheriff if they see you out there with a full camp.
I'm talking about setting up a tent and leaving it there undisturbed type of camping. If you call camping coming in at 11pm and out of there by 6am then I guess your recommendations are valid.
You can do the same thing driving up Boulder Canyon, parking at one of the turnouts then hiking five minutes into the woods to get some shuteye, but that's not camping, it's getting by.
I still recommend the ACC should look for properties on University Hill to replace the International Hostel that recent closed. Most of the fixer uppers that are already zoned for 20 plus are in the $625K to $800K range.
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JLP
Social climber
The internet
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Jul 11, 2013 - 06:33pm PT
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Lefthand and Gross have militant homeowners nearby that will report your ass to the sheriff if they see you out there with a full camp. Yeah the locals hate it, but they can't do sh#t. It's government land. There is legal camping in both areas. 14 days, all the usual rules. Check the map. The sheriff can do nothing. Rednecks and thieves are a bigger issue. The camping at Gross is rather nice, actually, but you need a 4x4, and though it's close to Boulder as the crow flies, it's a long drive, even with the shortcuts a heavier 4x4 can get you. Lefthand is a popular OHV and shooting area...
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goatboy smellz
climber
Nederland-GulfBreeze
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Jul 11, 2013 - 06:42pm PT
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So it's better to spend an hour rolly pollying up a 4 wheel drive road where the local's are hostile than a 30 minute drive zipping up Boulder Canyon where you have several restaurants, bars, live music, and legal MMJ access because on the map it looks closer?
Obviously you have never bandit camped around town.
I love how this thread keeps rolling along.
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crunch
Social climber
CO
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Jul 11, 2013 - 07:03pm PT
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Thanks Phil, I'd not thought of the idea of the 20-person hostel being too small right from the get-go. Makes sense.
The Post Office site would for sure have little chance for expansion. Hope you find somewhere suitable.
For current camping opportunities, Golden Gate State Park, just down the road to the south, is about as close as any theft-free, leave-your-tent-up place:
http://www.parks.state.co.us/PARKS/GOLDENGATECANYON/CAMPING/Pages/GoldenGateCanyonCamping.aspx
A nice summer alternative is one of the many campsites around Estes Park.
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kcangi
climber
Eldorado Springs, CO
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Jul 12, 2013 - 12:15am PT
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Most climbing from downtown Boulder is within five miles, give or take a football field.
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Bob D'A
Trad climber
Taos, NM
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Jul 12, 2013 - 12:18am PT
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Another self righteous post by KC. How much in taxes do you pay in Eldo last year?
This thing was dead in the water from the start..I think the AAC had the right intention trying to provide some sort of affordable lodging for climbers in the Boulder area. The best of luck to them on their mission, I hope they find a better location and better folks to deal with in their quest.
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