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Chewybacca
Trad climber
Montana, Whitefish
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Nov 15, 2011 - 03:33am PT
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Elk and deer are responsible for far more human deaths and injuries than wolves,bears,and cougars combined. Think of the children.....KILL ALL UNGULATES. Those tasty tasty ungulates...
On a side note...granny...if you don't make elk calls wolves won't run in your direction. Anyone who believes that 100lb wolf was attacking granny is a fool. It was searching out an elk bugle. Do any of you anti-wolf folk ever actually spend any time in the woods? I didn't think so...
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Jennie
Trad climber
Elk Creek, Idaho
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Nov 15, 2011 - 07:38am PT
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Wolves will come to elk bugles...so will Black and Grizzly bears as well as cougars. A neighbor down the road from my cabin claims to have taken eleven cougars with elk sounds.
Bull elk bugling declines sharply in early November and few or none are heard again until early September. But elk, both male and female, make chirps, mews, chuckles etc. year round. A wolf's hearing is much better than humans and they can navigate into elk sounds whenever a herd is actively communicating.
I've been out at night, as a child, with my dad recording elk sounds and seen predators come in and stalk a noisy herd. Wolf packs are much more efficient killing elk. In those days, the wolves hadn't moved into Island Park, though. Bears and cougars get elk calves and sickly animals but wolves take down healthy animals. Coyotes cut down some of the sickly too.
I doubt many newbie wolf hunters read supertopo...but if any do and weren't aware that bugles and elk talk bring in wolves... they are now.
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Srbphoto
climber
Kennewick wa
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Nov 15, 2011 - 11:12pm PT
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WOLF KILLING: Oregon court stays kill order for cattle-killing wolvesBy Associated Press
http://www.tri-cityherald.com/2011/11/15/1719121/wolf-killing-oregon-court-stays.html
SALEM — The Oregon Court of Appeals ruled Tuesday that conservation groups have a good chance of overturning a state order to kill wolves blamed for attacking livestock, and issued a stay that will remain in force until the lawsuit is settled.
The ruling filed in Salem set one condition: that conservation groups post $5,000 security against any livestock losses while the case is pending.
The Oregon Department of Fish and Wildlife issued an order in late September to kill two members of the Imnaha pack in Wallowa County, including the alpha male, after confirming by radio tracking collar data that the pack was responsible for another cattle kill in Wallowa County.
Conservation groups sued to challenge it, arguing the Oregon Wolf Management Plan, which allows wolves to be killed to reduce livestock attacks, does not comply with the state Endangered Species Act. While federal Endangered Species Act protection has been lifted for wolves in Eastern Oregon, the state act still covers them.
Steve Pedery, conservation director of Oregon Wild, said the issue was whether Oregon would do everything possible to prevent attacks on livestock, or resort to killing wolves whenever cattle are killed.
“I think killing those two wolves wouldn’t have done anything to reduce the likelihood of further livestock depredation,” said Noah Greenwald of the Center for Biological Diversity.“It would have left the Imnaha pack with the alpha female and one pup from this year. It’s pretty questionable they would make it through the winter. It would have very likely spelled the demise of the Imnaha pack.”
Pedery added that he thought that earlier kill orders carried out were a factor in the decision of two young wolves to leave the pack in early September. One of them, OR-7, has captured the hearts of people across the state since trekking some 300 miles.
At last report it was in the southern Cascade Range east of Butte Falls. Oregon Wild has started a contest to name it. The first entry, from a little girl in Wallowa County, was “Whosafraida.”
The Imnaha pack was the first in Oregon to breed pups since moving across the Snake River from Idaho, where they were reintroduced, and has been the only one of four packs known to exist that has been blamed for attacks on livestock — 14 livestock kills since mid-2010. Only one other pack has been confirmed to produce pups.
The Oregon Department of Justice, which represents the department, had not reviewed the case and had no immediate comment, said spokesman Tony Green. Oregon Cattlemen’s Association President Bill Hoyt said they were frustrated at the ruling.
“They had confirmed kills on the same ranch over a period of time and by the same pack,” he said. “The plan calls for after having multiple confirmed kills, they will take lethal control. That’s what the plan says.
“We didn’t like the plan to begin with. But we are learning to live with it. Now, all of a sudden we can’t even do that.”
The court found that while ranchers will likely suffer losses if the wolves aren’t killed, the Legislature has enacted a law to pay them for those losses.
Conservation groups have shown that killing the two wolves will cause irreparable harm to the Imnaha pack, and may cause irreparable harm to the reestablishment of wolves in Oregon in general, the court added.
While it is possible that the department’s feeling that killing wolves that attack livestock will build acceptance of wolves by ranchers, the Legislature has never expressed that point of view, the court wrote.
“There is no indication in the ESA that the legislature considered killing members of any specific endangered species, including gray wolves, as necessary to maintain the species at an optimum level or to ‘regulate’ the species,” the court wrote.
Acknowledging that nothing in the act prohibits the department from killing wolves, the court added that there is nothing that authorizes killing wolves, either.
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Jennie
Trad climber
Elk Creek, Idaho
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Nov 17, 2011 - 06:06am PT
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Near Stanley, ID two weeks ago.
O.K. Dingus, if you won't convince Fatty to call in air strikes...I bet Anders can command them to march single file onto a swift boat to Norway.
After they've finished their hamburgers, of course...
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Jennie
Trad climber
Elk Creek, Idaho
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Nov 17, 2011 - 06:22am PT
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...better hurry Anders before the United States Fish and Wildlife Service convinces Norway to “re-introduce” jackals. :-)
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Swami Jr.
Trad climber
Bath, NY
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Nov 17, 2011 - 10:19am PT
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This is insane. Wolves are just fine. They are, well, wolves. We need to stop being so disconnected from a healthy balance of nature.
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James Wilcox
Boulder climber
Santa Barbara
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Nov 28, 2011 - 12:46pm PT
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I'm guessing you're more likely to die from produce at
you local market than a wolf.
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couchmaster
climber
pdx
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Nov 29, 2011 - 04:20pm PT
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The first 2 wolfs to cross over into Oregon killed "27 sheep, a goat and a calf" in very short order in Baker County's Keating Valley.
Most of the sheep were just killed by the wolves for sport, not food, and left to lay. The locals and even fish and wildlife thought it might be domestic dogs till Fish and Wildlife got some camera shots.
They need to be managed, and yes, killed on occasion. That the wolves do have importance in the ecosystem only makes it more difficult to chose when or how to do this. But that's why we pay Fish and Wildlife experts good money, and we should let them do their jobs. And reimburse ranchers for loses.
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Nov 29, 2011 - 06:34pm PT
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Great photo Jennie. Pretty easy to see who the leader of the pack is.
Anybody ever see the desert wolf of the northern Sahara and Arabian Peninsula?
Beautiful animals.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Nov 29, 2011 - 06:37pm PT
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Ron,
The leader is the smart guy about 5 wolves back in line letting his minions break trail.
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Mighty Hiker
climber
Vancouver, B.C.
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Nov 29, 2011 - 06:46pm PT
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Can Oregon declare war on Idaho for this appalling attack?
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Nov 29, 2011 - 07:24pm PT
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I thought you were Norwegian not German.
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Hawkeye
climber
State of Mine
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Nov 29, 2011 - 07:34pm PT
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Can Oregon declare war on Idaho for this appalling attack?
oregon needs predator drones along the snake river to keep that riffraff out. apparently hells canyon was not a significant enough geographical feature" to keep the wolves at bay" if you will....
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sandstone conglomerate
climber
sharon conglomerate central
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Nov 29, 2011 - 07:36pm PT
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Why don't they just lace the dead livestock with strychnine like the buffalo "hunters" used to do. They could wipe out a lot more than wolves that way. Look at that pack roaming all free and sh#t. A bunch of potential rugs just walking through the snow like they have a right to be there...the audacity of those animals!
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Hawkeye
climber
State of Mine
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Nov 29, 2011 - 07:42pm PT
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i hope my comments were taken in jest. i have heard wolves in teh wild several times but not seen them. they would have migrated down from canada without the reintroduction to jellystone, assuming that they were protected. at some point, since man has altered the natural balance of nature we will have to control the population of wolves too. whether you agree or not, that is just the way that we have done things. name an animal (bear/coyote/elk/deer/bobcat/cougar) man tries to control the population of all of them.
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Nov 29, 2011 - 07:55pm PT
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Tries is the operative word.
No way man can kill off the coyote. We've killed so many stupid ones that the remainders are breeding geniuses.
EDIT
Oh shite the kiss of death 2 posts down
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Fritz
Trad climber
Choss Creek, ID
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Nov 29, 2011 - 09:51pm PT
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Thanks to Piton Ron for this quote:
Tries is the operative word.
No way man can kill off the coyote. We've killed so many stupid ones that the remainders are breeding geniuses.
From Fritz: "Coyotes & wolves are smarter than many ST posteurs!"
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donini
Trad climber
Ouray, Colorado
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Nov 29, 2011 - 11:52pm PT
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Fritz, many....or most? I'll go with most, myself included.
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