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Crimpergirl
Sport climber
Boulder, Colorado!
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Whatever you do, don't skimp on the stool softener. Getting through surgery without a lot of that is not for the faint of heart! Get well soon.
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Big Mike
Trad climber
BC
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Prune juice helps move things too!!! I hate the stuff but i drank lots of it in rehab!!
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donini
Trad climber
Ouray, Colorado
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Heal up quickly Ammon! Consider the activity that caused the injury....0 sum game.
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David Nelson
climber
San Francisco
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Largo asked if an MD might reply, in his Oct 30 post. I have been reading the posts and can make a few comments. I have not posted on Supertopo for a while, some here may remember me.
I am 62, a Board-certified orthopod and now hand surgeon, climbed in the Valley in the 70's, even taught a while. Was out a while, then when i was 50, went up the Captain, but holding onto the coat tails of Chickenskinner, who did all the leading. Then did the same on HD.
Ammon's injury, without an X-ray, must have been an open tibia and fibula fracture. We don't use the term "compound" anymore. Vegasclimber corrected me and said that there was a vascular repair, so it was a III C open fracture, meaning extensive soft tissue stripping and a vascular repair (see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gustilo_open_fracture_classification);. The importance of the classification is that the rate of infection and amputation go up as the rating goes up. The external fixator (I have designed one for the radius) allows for stability for the bones and soft tissues (necessary to prevent further damage, prevent infection, set the stage for osseous healing). It is put on when the risk for infection is too high for a plate or intramedulary rod. The tubes and black foam, covered with what looks like Saran wrap, are a wound vac. It is designed to help control edema, infection, and to clean up the fluids (blood, serum) that are oozing out. The serial trips to the OR are to debride dead tissue and check for infection. The general rule is another look in the OR every 48 hrs until ready for definitive care, ie, IM rod or plate.
The flap, if any, is to substitute for missing skin and close the wound.
Did I cover all the points?
Ammon, ignore anything I said if it contradicts your docs. They have the data, I do not. I am merely guessing for the entertainment of our television audience.
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Clint Cummins
Trad climber
SF Bay area, CA
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Jeff mentioned at the screening of his film tonight that he got a text from Ammon, and the surgery well extremely well.
He also mentioned that Ammon's youtube video has over 800,000 hits.
It's age-restricted now, for "graphic" content.
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Vegasclimber
Trad climber
Las Vegas, NV.
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Thanks for your post Doc, much appreciated.
Ammon had an open tib/fib with two tib fractures. He had a 70% circumferential wound from the bones exiting and the tendon retraction at the time of injury. He had a severed artery but thankfully the vascular surgeon on duty was able to clear some major clotting and damage and stretch and suture the artery.
Ammon came out of surgery really well today, no grafts needed, no patch either. Plated the tib and when the doc came in yesterday he said that would pack any vacancies in the bone with donor bone material. Go pirate go!
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ElCapPirate
Big Wall climber
Reno, Nevada
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Great news!!! Indeed, the surgery went better than ever expected. The swelling was low enough and I had enough muscle and tissue in the surrounding area that they didn't have to borrow anything from my thigh or abdomen.
So, no grafting or flap patch (aaiighh) for the pirate, which simplifies the recovery tremendously. I would have lost 10% of the strength in the borrowed area if this procedure was needed, psyched they didn't have to disrupt any other areas of my body. I was supposed to be in ICU for two days after the surgery but wasn't necessary since they didn't have to do the extra prosedure. Looks like my recovery time will be a lot faster, as well. Nothing but great news since the brutal impact.
Thanks for all the positivity here at ST. I feel the love and truly appreciate everything.
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ElCapPirate
Big Wall climber
Reno, Nevada
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Consider the activity that caused the injury....0 sum game.
Donini, I have nothing but the utmost respect for you as an individual and your amazing accomplishments, as a climber. You've been one of my heroes for many, many years. But, this comment reflects both naivety and hypocrisy, especially comparing jumping to the alpine game.
Just like you can't compare a lap on Nutcracker with K2. You also can't compare BASE jumping exits and the many different ways you can execute a jump.
It's hard to wrap your brain around something you haven't personally experienced. You simply can't say one is more dangerous or risky than the other. I've never jumped anything harder than, say, A2... In my mind. I feel like I've definitely put myself in way more danger with my climbing passion than jumping.
Lots of love, matey!
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madbolter1
Big Wall climber
Denver, CO
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You simply can't say one is more dangerous or risky than the other.
It's sad to me that you would even have to "defend" anything at this level, particularly on a forum such as this one!
You have every right in your person to take ANY risk with your person that in YOUR and YOUR mind ALONE provides an acceptable risk/reward ratio. There CAN be no "judging" here of the risks you take and the contexts in which you take them. Who here DARES to "judge" or even question what rewards you "ought" to be seeking via this or that "risk?"
MOST people are living entire lives FAR riskier than yours, with their utter lack of exercise, terrible diets, nasty habits and addictions, and the list goes on and on. And the PATHETIC thing is that they take all these very real risks with little to no intentional awareness or even reward for their entire lives! And then when the have a heart attack or stroke at 55 (or earlier), everybody wrings their hands and talks about how "cruel" death is to have snatched them away so young.
Honestly, it makes me sick, this virtually complete lack of INTENTIONAL living.
LIFE is a zero-sum game, and NOBODY gets out of it alive! But most people live totally unintentional lives without ever getting out of the box or knowing WHO and WHAT they are.
Unlike my feelings for them, I HONOR what you've been seeking, and you have NOTHING to "defend" or "explain" to anybody on these threads! And some people here that have gone to the edge themselves in various contexts ought to know better than to wag their fingers in the SLIGHTEST!
I, for one, for whatever it's worth, simply HONOR you, Ammon. And I'm jazzed that things are going even better than we dared to hope. You've got much more road to walk, and you'll be doing it on both feet! Awesome!
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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hey there say, david nelson...
not much into the stop-look-and-see mode... more like a mama-mode. so thank you from us folks that try to understand, as well... :)
ammon... this was very fortunate for you, very good outcome of what
you surely know could have been far worse...
prayers and well wishes, and 'happy hug to the mom', as she share's
your joy and gratefulness... :)
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climbski2
Mountain climber
Anchorage AK, Reno NV
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Such good news to wake up to this morning. Pretty cool to see you sending this project as admirably as we have seen you accomplish so many others.
I never cease to be amazed by the human body. It's also amazing how much difference being in athletic condition can make regarding reducing the severity and occurrence and healing of injury. The body responds very complexly with mental attitude. A great attitude affects the team too. Success is no accident!
It's difficult to express how much I respect your consideration for others. As shown by the time you have taken from the beginning to keep all of us concerned about you informed. It even showed in that video.
Keep healing up strong!
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sempervirens
climber
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Zero sum game? I had to google it. It's a game where one's winnings are equal to another's losses. Like for example: 5 poker players all start with 10 dollars and any winnings for one (or more) players would be exactly equal to one (or more) players' losses. If at the end of the game the total winnings of the players is +10, then the total losses must be -10, added together you get a zero sum.
How does that relate to base jumping? One-life in, one life out? Sorry for the drift, but I thought it worth discussion.
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Vitaliy M.
Mountain climber
San Francisco
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Great news about your surgery! Recover fast and keep charging as you did Ammon!
Watched the movie about Wings of Steel and your 2nd ascent of it yesterday. You seem like a really good dude with a lot of passion for outdoors. Sending positive vibes your way, and hope you avoid major injuries in the future. Injuries suck since they prevent people from getting out and do what they love...
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rwedgee
Ice climber
canyon country,CA
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So do you have insurance or who is footing(pun) the bill ?
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jstan
climber
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In pursuits dealing with objective dangers, actual risk is highly dependent upon the ability of the person. This is not something another person can accurately judge. Subjective danger, as in the real mountains, can be another matter altogether. Don Whillans was no wussy but he knew enough to come down off the Eiger when it was in full flower.
The risks we undertake depend critically upon what we take as our objective. I can't talk about anyone else's objectives so I can only speak in the first person. My objective has been to enjoy all of my life to the fullest and to walk without a great deal of discomfort to the crematoria. When I have looked back on an adventure that could just as easily have gone badly, I take that as data. Any brush with trouble, is a "whoa Nellie" moment. My judgment has been called into question.
Luck, not me, decides when it will come and when it will not.
Ammon, get better as fast as you can.
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Largo
Sport climber
The Big Wide Open Face
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Thanks David for the update.
Great news that you didn't need a muscle graft. I don't know for the life of me how you could have such a big open fracture plus that big ass eliptical cut, with twin wound vacs, and not have to fill the holes with your own tissue. They must have used silly putty or something. Man, that's a miracle they could pull that off.
I'll call you soon.
JL
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Ammon don't stick his head in no hole!
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Karl Baba
Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
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I think things are going well as a reflection of your positive, good vibes approach to this development and life in general.
Making the best of it, shining your light
Wishing you the best bro!
peace
Karl
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happiegrrrl
Trad climber
www.climbaddictdesigns.com
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Keep it up, Ammon!
I have to admit also that I'm surprised to read that there probably will be no skin graft. How does the skin grow over and cover all that meat? (Though I guess it does - my own brother accidentally blasted a chunk of his shin off, stupidly having a loaded sawed-off shotgun in a vehicle and shining deer. His leg looked like hamburger at the time, but I don't think he ever had any skin grafts.)
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madbolter1
Big Wall climber
Denver, CO
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It's a disappointment, Ron, to be sure. But, you could still get a very cool pair of greaves made up, a la the style below. They would even offer a bit of protection, whilst looking cool!
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