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Norton
climber
The Wastelands
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How about a bunch of mentally deranged Libtards screaming at the sky?
"New World Order" (Twice banned), you honey boo boo, do not have the depth of intellect to be a "libtard"
but likely are enough of a coward to be a "conservative"
don't like being called names? then stop calling other people names first, and grow up
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guyman
Social climber
Moorpark, CA.
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Moose... I don't think your logic is working.
Have fun in the Stronghold.... get Jim to go to Zappa Dome.
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Fritz
Social climber
Choss Creek, ID
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A friend emailed this youtube link to me today. A pleasant little Trump-mocking ditty for your pleasure.
Randy Rainbow, Desperate cheeto
[Click to View YouTube Video]
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10b4me
Mountain climber
Retired
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El Salvador is far more dangerous than America
Have you been to El Salvador?
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NutAgain!
Trad climber
South Pasadena, CA
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Topic Author's Reply - Nov 9, 2017 - 09:03pm PT
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I am asking nutagain- if violence is a contagion- then why do we allow the alleged vectors of said contagion to settle here?
I think that's a reasonable question and concern. My response might seem like a deflection but it will circle back to the main point.
One of the things I think our society should value and fund more: emotional education. I think overall this is getting better. When you start digging around, there are lots of programs (either government-sponsored or from NGOs) such as court-ordered Anger Management courses, Alcoholics Anonymous and related 12-step programs, Al-Anon, support for victims of violent crime and domestic violence programs. For example:
https://victims.ca.gov/resources.aspx
https://www.mocadsv.org/multi-language-materials/
http://www.ncdsv.org/ncd_linksimmigration.html
However, most of these programs are reactive, prescribed in response to some sort of personal or family crisis. We have no national strategy to be proactive about this thing that dramatically affects all of our daily lives. I think we should have more explicit emotional education as part of our public schools, at least sufficient to underpin healthy behavior for peaceful coexistence in a world populated by folks of very different values and beliefs. If we focus just on the behaviors without the emotional underpinning, it can lead to a sort of fakeness, a social veneer of "political correctness" and compliance for the sake of social norms without substance or empathy to address what people are really feeling. This is like an abscess over an emotional wound. We need a societal way to pick up the slack of what many people don't get in their families- how to develop a sense of self-love and identity, to contribute to a community and feel belonging and acceptance in a group, etc., and role-models and active teaching for compassion and empathy. If we neglect this part of our citizens' development, we create a ripe media for the infestation of violence.
So the issue is not just in keeping out the stored negative energy of violence that immigrants have experienced... the violence within our borders exacerbates the predicaments of refugees: language barriers, lack of money/home/support networks, ongoing stresses of families separated, perhaps a lack of relevant skills for earning a living in this environment, or at least language and soft-skill cultural barriers to gaining employment leveraging their areas of expertise.
The emotional education resources that we all need can be extended to accommodate the stress of the refugee predicament in general, and coping with violent experiences in particular.
I found this example of a program that helps with the logistical things for refugees, to reduce ongoing sources of stress for food/shelter/clothing, community resources, gaining employable skills, etc. They operate around the world and have many local centers in USA:
https://www.rescue.org/united-states/los-angeles-ca#how-does-the-irc-help-refugees-and-immigrants-in-los-angeles
I'm not familiar with the organization, but I couldn't see anything specifically about coping with violence or emotional issues in general. Maybe in the hierarchy of needs, food/shelter/clothing and the ability to earn money to get these things are easier to understand and more obviously pressing needs. But this seems to create a vacuum of unmet needs for the emotional stuff and it is a risk factor sowing the seeds for future violence in our country.
Dialing in more specifically to the original question:
We need to target the contagion, not the people carrying it.
Perhaps because we have so little societal understanding of the disease of violence, what causes it and how it spreads and how to manage it, that we fear it and confuse the contagion with the vector. It's one thing to say we are killing mosquitoes to stop Malaria or Dengue Fever. It's another to say we are killing humans or quarantining/incarcerating them in camps to block the inflow of violence to our country.
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Delhi Dog
climber
Good Question...
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I think we should have more explicit emotional education as part of our public schools, at least sufficient to underpin healthy behavior for peaceful coexistence in a world populated by folks of very different values and beliefs. If we focus just on the behaviors without the emotional underpinning, it can lead to a sort of fakeness, a social veneer of "political correctness" and compliance for the sake of social norms without substance or empathy to address what people are really feeling. This is like an abscess over an emotional wound. We need a societal way to pick up the slack of what many people don't get in their families- how to develop a sense of self-love and identity, to contribute to a community and feel belonging and acceptance in a group, etc., and role-models and active teaching for compassion and empathy. If we neglect this part of our citizens' development, we create a ripe media for the infestation of violence.
Couldn't agree more.
I've been in education most of my life and have worked directly with youngsters for going on 31 years. I've been around a lot of this world and work with a diverse population (currently we have 54 nationalities in our school) in many of those countries.
The only thing I'll add is that I believe that virtually no religions of the world actually teach this and IMHO should and can be a big part in this effort. It may be the one thing those institutions can do to significantly make a difference in making this world a better place.
Thanks Nut for well thought out posts.
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Gary
Social climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
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Nov 10, 2017 - 11:33am PT
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Hey! just what we need, a stealth bomber to bomb goatherds:
It is here that Northrop is building the Air Force’s new B-21 bomber, a stealthy bat-winged jet that is being designed to slip behind any adversary’s air defense system and deliver devastating airstrikes for decades to come. The Pentagon is aiming to buy 100 of the bombers by the mid-2030s for at least $80 billion, though the exact amount is classified.
$80 billion my ass. $800 billion more likely. Should work well with the 1.5 trillion they want to give to billionaires.
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Norton
climber
The Wastelands
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Nov 10, 2017 - 12:06pm PT
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Moose's chart appears to be an accurate reflection of how mass murderers are categorized by the media, what exactly is the problem with it?
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drF
Trad climber
usa
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Nov 10, 2017 - 07:14pm PT
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Moose's chart appears to be an accurate reflection of how mass Nortloons are categorized by the media, what exactly is the problem with it?
Care to respond......L00ns????
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Ken M
Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
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Nov 11, 2017 - 12:21am PT
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Returning to the forum topic, I am astonished by the traction taking place on the issue of sexual assault. I am also amazed at how quickly it is transitioning over to the political realm.
The issues involving Trump seemed to not be relevant, but the allegations now are already crashing careers (as they should).
This Roy Moore issue turns out to be huge. The Alabama conservatives are taking the line of defense that Moore did nothing. But if he did, he did nothing different than Jesus. REALLY? That's the defense? Are these learned conservatives wearing overalls and holding pitchforks while they're saying that? The loss of that seat gives the GOP a 1-vote majority.
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StahlBro
Trad climber
San Diego, CA
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Nov 11, 2017 - 06:21am PT
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Moore supporters pulling the Jesus card was definitely a new low. Those kind of zealots are really scary.
If it was a liberal, they would be screaming bloody murder.
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10b4me
Mountain climber
Retired
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Nov 11, 2017 - 06:34am PT
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The loss of that seat gives the GOP a 1-vote majority.
IMO, the people, in Alabama will not vote for a democrat. The people in Alabama share the same feelings as Moore.
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Patrick Sawyer
climber
Originally California now Ireland
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Nov 11, 2017 - 08:33am PT
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Putting aside if there is any Russian collusion in the election or not, Putin and his pals in the Kremlin must be laughing at the state of America, with the political and societal divisiveness. With the obvious polarization. Some will say democracy is about compromise and consensus, if so then democracy seems to be dying in the US. Across the political spectrum and indeed social spectrum the gulf is widening. Will there be increasing violence in the streets regarding protests?
They must be chuckling at the fact that Trump believes (as he would) Putin over the US intelligence agencies, and Putin and pals probably figure that any hand the US may have had in the break up of the Soviet Union is now coming back to slap the US in the face.
They must be delighted that any real or imagined Russian influence is indeed influencing the state of America.
When some Americans are chanting USA, Trump and Putin in the same breath, where do their allegiances lie?
The times are truly changing.
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drF
Trad climber
usa
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Nov 11, 2017 - 10:32am PT
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The people in Alabama share the same feelings as Moore.
Typical bigoted statement by 10-.
What adick
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Happiegrrrl2
Trad climber
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Nov 11, 2017 - 04:20pm PT
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Oh, and what ever happened to all those women who accused Trump of sexual abuse/misconduct and wanted to sue him, when he initially decided to run for POTUS? Where are they now???
As I understand it, the time is coming, when you will know the answer to that and more that anyone with a sense of decency would ever want to know, about the depraved cruelty of men. Word is that Mueller has six sealed indictments on DT. Also, that each and every federal crime is also going to be charge via NYS Attorney General(and thus unpardonable)
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Norton
climber
The Wastelands
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Nov 11, 2017 - 06:27pm PT
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Oh, and what ever happened to all those women who accused Trump of sexual abuse/misconduct and wanted to sue him, when he initially decided to run for POTUS? Where are they now???
in court, ongoing sexual harassment lawsuit against the Pussy Grabber in Chief
we don't how many others he has paid off to be quiet over the years
you dumb sob
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WBraun
climber
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Nov 11, 2017 - 07:01pm PT
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Nothing gonna happen.
All will be swept under the rug.
They never do sh!t .....
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