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Fritz
Social climber
Choss Creek, ID
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God wouldn't hate America as much, if we only had God in our schools again & of course more guns.
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10b4me
Mountain climber
Retired
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I blame Obama.
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Gary
Social climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
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I'm thinking of getting the little woman a kevlar vest for Christmas. Something that could be worn as an undergarment. Any suggestions?
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c wilmot
climber
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With every event that occurs we end up glorifying the actions by sensationalizing the crime in our media.
Every time this occurs it incentivezes, encourages, and normalizes such behavior.
By allowing ourselves to be outraged and entertained by such crimes we only work to encourage those who are mentally ill and suicidal into going out with a bang
It's almost like a morbid contest at this point
Most of these shootings/attacks all seem to have the same MO: an angry individual who has failed in life decides to commit suicide via mass carnage
We have set a precident that will be hard if not impossible to overcome
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Jon Beck
Trad climber
Oceanside
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Newsbud, for those who find Infowars to be too sensible.
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Patrick Sawyer
climber
Originally California now Ireland
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“Newsbud”, and he says some of us are brainwashed. Too funny.
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Patrick Sawyer
climber
Originally California now Ireland
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This may be somewhat off topic than healthcare but it is a national issue, I believe.
Re: Mass shootings
C. Wilmot, I agree with your post (08:07 PT), but where is the line to be drawn by responsible news gatherers/reporters? These things need to be reported but on the flip side does it encourage other nutcases to do the same?
And at what point does the coverage cease, lest others copycat?
Not quite the same, but perhaps along the same vein. From the movie The Dead Pool (1988), when the character Gus Wheeler, who claims he is the Dead Pool killer, and says he is about to torch himself (just for the news coverage):
Gus Wheeler: “No! Nobody ever paid any attention to me before. In order to get attention, you gotta do something.”
Samantha Walker (reporter): “Did you have anything to do with the deaths...of Johnny Squares and Molly Fisher?”
Wheeler: “No, I just said that so you'd listen!”
Walker tells her cameraman not to film. That is Hollywood, so to speak.
In reality C. Wilmot, what is an editor or producer going to do? Choices have to be made. Responsible media has a duty to the public, but what if some deem that duty to be a detriment?
As with everything (just about) it is not a case of black and white, the shades of grey are there.
I worked news on KTVU Ch 2 (Oakland, now a Fox affiliate), worked on nationals in England and Ireland, a journalist for over 44 years in five countries. I sort of know the media, I am certainly a student of it.
How to provide news coverage and yet not sensationalise it? I know, and have seen, editors who have debated that at the time of such events. I have been in those newsrooms.
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Fritz
Social climber
Choss Creek, ID
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I confess to knowing nothing about Newsbud.
The folks at Media Bias/Fact Check say this on the subject:
Factual Reporting: MIXED
Notes: Newsbud (NB) is a right wing, conspiracy and anti-government site founded by, among others, Kurt Nimmo, the former lead editor and writer for Infowars. What sets NB apart from other sites of this type is that the stories are, for the most part, well written and contain numerous sources. The bias of the writing is also more subtle than sites such as Infowars, but just as prevalent. Both as an overtone to all the stories as well as the sometimes questionable sources and / or the conclusions drawn from the source material. Additionally, many of their sources are other NB stories, or work the author and editors have done elsewhere.
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Good writing, copious sources, and the lack of over the top hyperbole present on similar sites cannot, however, mask the overall intent and agenda of NB, and earns them a rating of Conspiracy. (D. Kelley 6/12/2017)
https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/newsbud/
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Paddy, yer insider’s viewpoint is always appreciated. After a month in Olde Blighty this summer I have to say that BBC coverage, I’m thinking of the Grenville coverage, can swerve dangerously close to sensationalist. However, in the end they almost always salvage the show with some degree of astuteness and rationality. I aver that is due to their education and the ‘BBC culture’. La Femme grew up listening to the BBC daily in deepest darkest Afrique (in English, mind you) so we listen to it via sat radio in our road trip rig constantly. It is delightfully strange driving some remote four-wheeler road in Wyoming hearing “This is the BBC.”
ps
A trip to the Royal Observatory at Greenwich will avail you as to the proverbial 4 beeps on the hour! ;-)
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Patrick Sawyer
climber
Originally California now Ireland
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Yes Fritz, there is so much noise out there (Infowars and Kos being just two examples), it can be difficult to get the straight and narrow.
So this is where critical thinking (skills) come into play, in my opinion. While I am a liberal (no kidding some may say) I do read and peruse non-liberal, read conservative, media. Perhaps even some alt-left and alt-right, just to try and keep a pulse on matters.
Do they still teach critical thinking in school? Some of my J-high and high school teachers, and most of my professors sure thought highly of critical thinking.
EDIT
Two things Reilly. Yes, the BBC can sometimes seem like it is sensationalizing, if so not near as just about any Western news organization. (I turned down a job with the Beeb in August 1989, that is another story though.)
Secondly, Greenwich Observatory is so cool.
(And if I seem to flip between British and American spellings, it is either the spell check, or that I worked on Jazz Express magazine in London BITD, and the editor, she insisted American contributors had their spellings kept the same, and British likewise with theirs. Not sure if William Safire would agree with that, but then he probably would).
(Either that or I am a schizophrenic Gemini, where one part of the brain, one of the twins, doesn't know what the other twin's half is doing.)
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Norton
climber
The Wastelands
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answer the questions, Mr. Dumas
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Patrick Sawyer
climber
Originally California now Ireland
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As in Alexandre?
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WBraun
climber
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Fritz -- "I confess to knowing nothing about Newsbud."
I'm in the same boat that's why I threw that link to that article here as I knew for sure the politards here would be all over it.
Hahahaha
It does shed some interesting light on things if it could be absolutely confirmed true.
But who knows?
Only the clueless brainwashed politards here claim all knowledge to this endless internet news horesh!t they present every day here .......
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crankster
Trad climber
No. Tahoe
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I read on Newsbud that a waitress in Modesto served a patty melt to Elvis over the weekend. She has his lip print on a piece of melted cheese. It’s him for sure.
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Norton
climber
The Wastelands
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National Mental Health professionals are now freed by the national association to offer their opinions on the psychic makeup of politicians
Regarding their assessment of Donald Trump - in short although not classically "mentally ill", very damaged
He is a first class Narcissist - consumed with a me first above all else personality
His compulsion to constantly and personally attack other people shows a low opinion of himself
deep inside he is afraid of his own lack of intelligence and hides it by insulting others
https://www.statnews.com/2017/09/29/trump-mental-health-book/
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Patrick Sawyer
climber
Originally California now Ireland
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Werner, whatever you are you are a provocateur. Perhaps like The Donald? Hah hah.
BTW, that is meant to be a friendly description. I don't always agree with you, often disagree with your stoopid statements, but...
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Patrick Sawyer
climber
Originally California now Ireland
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Folks, I think these are two pretty good articles (and there are a lot out there).
The first from the BBC. Yes the Beeb is somewhat liberal (not left wing), but I have found it always to be the one of the most objective news organizations on this planet.
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-41826022
And from the Irish Independent, hardly a liberal publication, to say the least, though not as conservative as The Irish Times.
https://www.independent.ie/world-news/north-america/president-trump/a-president-without-precedent-36285096.html
Of course these are just basically opinion pieces.
Fake news or not, history will determine that. In one way or another.
And as far as Fake News and the MSM is concerned, it is my experience that there are far more checks and balances, and the ability to say "mea culpa" when a mistake is made, with corrections, with MSM than in other media sources
Is MSM corporate controlled? Yes and no (I have worked on some of them). Are the so-called alternative media news websites free of influence? Ask yourself that. Do they have checks and balances?
When I was starting out in the early/mid-1970s, my professors and subsequently editors said: "If in doubt leave it out. Substantiate, substantiate, substantiate." Perhaps some of that has gone sadly by the wayside, but I will argue that the MSM it is still more objective and fact finding than many of the right and left "news" websites.
I have worked with a lot of good journalists on these so-called Fake News MSM organizations, and I call bullshit on Donald Trump and his ilk. He is the Fake News. And he can spout off as much as he wants, but time will tell. He doesn't fool me, does he you?
I am not a billionaire (just paid the phone/broadband bill, that hurt my finances, chasing my financial tail, who isn't). But I can smell sh#t, and while the Dems and Repubs reek of it, Donald is at the top (or is that bottom) of the sh#t pile.
He oozes crap.
It is so tiring to see my beloved country go down the drain. The end of an era. I'll be elsewhere when the sh#t hits the fan. Call me a coward, but for once in my life, I may be sensible.
EDIT
I will tell you what I am wary (weary?) of, it is that I am going to save up to make the July Sawyer family reunion in Washington, a state/territory the Sawyers have been in since 1843, the last one I was at was 1993 near Everett.
And I will be wary of being sucked into politics in any discussions on the day (I know Sawyers). I will say: "I did not travel some 5,000 miles, save for months, to discuss politics. I can spiel what I want online. I came here to see relatives I have not seen for years and meet new ones. And have a good time on the day."
And if I am lucky enough to ever make a Facelift in the Valley, I would just want to shoot climbing bull and climb. Politics can be so, yesterday. Not really, but if I was to make a Facelift, I'd probably have to sell a kidney in some third world country to finance such a trip to the Valley. And I happen to like my kidneys. Talking politics and shite is not worth the journey.
I may shoot the politard bull with you people online, but face to face, let's just climb, life is too short.
End of story.
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Patrick Sawyer
climber
Originally California now Ireland
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I fear that the rise of all these alternative news sites - are many of them for "real" (?) - are skewing the equation. Let us face it, news is also a business, perhaps the freedom of the press is enshrined in our constitutional DNA, but news does not come cheap. Especially well-produced objective professional news, with checks and balances.
However, are the big boys, so to speak, feeling the pressure?
Are economics driving the MSM? Yes, to an extent. Can one survive and sustain a proper news gathering disseminating apparatus on thin air. Of course there has to be a sound business model in order to survive. But that does not mean selling one's soul to the devil.
I have worked on a Murdoch title (I will not reveal, it is embarrassing, but I had rent and bills to pay, I was a news slut, but I never skewed the truth, I reported honestly, the editors skewed it, why I quit).
My point is, we are headed down an abyss.
I can go on but it is almost 2am and I am tired. I will continue later though, because it means a lot to me. True communications is the lifeblood of a healthy society, a health democracy, a healthy republic. Bye for now.
NB Who was the toughest person I interviewed? The late Maggie. She would chew up and spit Donald's head out. I did not agree with her politics and policies, but damn was she tough.
EDIT
So I won't bump this to the front page
C. Wilmot, this is an interesting read, especially the third 'section'
"The shooters are inspired by media accounts"
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-41890277
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