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TYeary
climber
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Mar 19, 2009 - 02:17pm PT
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No offense ment to anyone, but speculation on just what happened, by individuals, or goverment agencies, leads to mis-information. There will be an accounting of what happened and why. Out of respect to all involved, we should refrain from second guessing until those directly involved have given their full, factual report.
Respectfully,
Tony
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bvb
Social climber
flagstaff arizona
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Mar 19, 2009 - 02:41pm PT
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a few years back someone close to me died, and i drew some comfort from this passage.
Have patience with everything unresolved in your heart
and try to love the questions themselves ...
Don't search for the answers,
which could not be given to you now,
because you would not be able to live them.
And the point is, to live everything.
Live the questions now.
Perhaps then, someday far in the future,
you will gradually, without even noticing it,
live your way into the answer.
rainer maria rilke
rest in peace woody.
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apogee
climber
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Mar 19, 2009 - 03:16pm PT
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A balance must be struck between respect for Woody and the grieving that we all must do, and the need to understand what happened.
When someone close to us is hurt or killed (especially when climbing related), it is natural to want to know why it happened, to help make sense of a seemingly random event. To not know is confusing and heightens the fears that we all have- this need to know should not be considered 'vulturous behavior', as long as it is done in a respectful manner.
The need to know is what tends to result in speculative, inaccurate media reports- the media responds as quickly as possible simply because people want information as soon as possible. Woody's accident is frightening and a reality check for us all of the tenuousness of life- information about it helps to rationalize those fears.
For right now, I concur that it is most appropriate for the emphasis to be placed on the appreciation and remembrance for Woody, while the investigation is being completed. It sounds as though Wendell is doing a good job of gathering this information, and I suggest that speculation about this tragedy be withheld until good, solid information can be made available. From what I knew of Woody via his presence here on ST, this seems completely consistent with his personality.
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Gene
climber
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Mar 19, 2009 - 03:30pm PT
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....and if I may tag onto apogee's thought, let's put the information, details and analyses of the accident in another thread at the appropriate time.
gm
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Matt
Trad climber
primordial soup
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Mar 19, 2009 - 03:51pm PT
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i fully agree that people asking, "what happened, what happened!" are a bit out of line.
there are always things to be learned from these unfortunate events (and sometimes from more fortunate the events too), but there is simply no urgency in that interest.
the people involved are dealing with stuff. they should deal with their own stuff. they should be allowed to deal with their own stuff. when they feel like sharing some of their stuff, that's the time to be interested, not before.
just look at the resource the AAC publishes in ANAM-
it's not important how long before the publishing any of those incidents occurred. the information is out there and it's helpful to all of us in many ways, but the time-line is not what makes it valuable.
what's more, if anything at all happened that could have been prevented by this or by that, it doesn't spoil anyone's memory of anyone else or tarnish anyone's legacy (as a person or as a rock climber).
we all play a dangerous game.
there are lots of ways to make the game safer (or make it seem safer?), but those are not the only ways the game is played, and we all know it.
best wishes and blessings to everyone who could use a few extra.
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jstan
climber
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Mar 19, 2009 - 04:53pm PT
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Because experiences like this are so unhappy one naturally wants to learn as much as possible. Otherwise there is absolutely nothing positive. Two things I have learned:
1. After climbing for awhile without getting injured or worse it gets too easy to forget what it is that can happen in a split second. Woody's accident is re-normalizing us all as we type.
2. In the day to day rush we lose sight of what is at risk when we take a chance. Quite unbeknownst to us, each of us affects the people around us and they invariably feel the loss when we go. When we contemplate taking a risk we need to take them also into consideration.
Woody was important to us.
Now we have to go on.
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Domingo
Trad climber
El Portal, CA
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Mar 19, 2009 - 06:18pm PT
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I see a lot of people saying "condolences but we need details so we can learn", and while I see where they're coming from, it's pretty obvious the people who know the details AREN'T ready to discuss it yet, so why don't the people in the former category give it a rest? It seems clear the constant nagging isn't going to get you information...
Still keeping everyone in my thoughts.
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Mar 19, 2009 - 06:41pm PT
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hey there locker... say, i have seen also, what the media does... very sad...
say, back when rodeo cowboy lane frost died... media folks jumped in...
it started for good, as there was a movie made...
but---SADLY SO--they did not stick to facts and sadly even more so, they were supposed to...
they worse yet, made the father look like a bad-guy...
:(
well--all in all, it DID lead the family making a website of truth...
and the REAL STORY of lane frost's life is now able to be found... he loved the lord and was a good to all that he met...
and---he did not have a bad relationship with his dad or his wife...
AND THE BIGGEST "HE DID NOT"
was---he did not turn his back on the bull, the way they showed it...(making him look VAIN and neglegent)
real film clips prooved this, in the rodeo archives...
media can sure mess up, seems worse so when hollywood gets into it, and big bucks are a foot...
:(
well, just sharing, as so many other have suffered this way, too... stay strong, all....
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Steve L
climber
Sur
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Mar 19, 2009 - 07:00pm PT
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One of my fondest Woody memories came a few years back. Woody, locker, a young lady (her name escapes my memory now), and I were meeting in JT for a day of fun. I was late driving out from LA, so the gang left word at CC as to where they would be climbing, and headed for the crag. About thirty minutes later I was running up the hillside to meet everyone at Cowboy Crags. Light headed from the hurried scramble up, I finally reached the group only to look upon the monstrosity that I would soon be climbing. Woody was already on lead, Locker was on belay, and the young lady was looking at the ground, too afraid to look at the dynamic duo in action. The climb went up a flake about 30 feet to a rusty old quarter incher, from there the route traversed left a ways to a second rusty old quarter incher, then to a crack to the top of the formation. Aside from being rusty and old the second bolt was a good 10 feet too far on the traverse to prevent the leader from decking on the sharp boulders below. Oh and did I mention that the route probably hadn't been climbed in twenty years? As Woody slipped and slid his way across to the second bolt, the ground party was treated to a shower of bb's from under his feet. I'm not sure who was more scared, Woody climbing on marbles, or us holding our breath below. As always, he fuking stuck the moves, made the clip and finished the climb. Locker seconded and then it was my turn. I nearly sh-t my pants on the traverse. All I could think was how the fuk did he nail that? That memory always makes me smile and shake my head. Remembering that balls to the wall approach has gotten me through many an Elvis leg.
Some of the posts from that day should still be on Mountain Project. Cling Peaches 5.9R (yeah right)
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Mighty Hiker
Social climber
Vancouver, B.C.
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Mar 19, 2009 - 07:19pm PT
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We all miss Woody.
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TGT
Social climber
So Cal
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Mar 19, 2009 - 07:32pm PT
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Hey Locker,
Woody thought it was kind of cool to have at least one "grown up" around here.
The reactions to her posts were fodder for between route discussions in the gym.
He kinda liked having her around.
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Mar 19, 2009 - 07:47pm PT
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This is getting crazy.
Locker, my friend, ease down.
Lois, you've said your piece, but to some you don't fit. This is a time to respect that.
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TGT
Social climber
So Cal
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Mar 19, 2009 - 08:18pm PT
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There have been threads here and elsewhere about deaths of those I've never met that deeply affected me.
Lois will always be at the outer fringe of the campfire, but she's still a fringe member and Woody liked her.
Now Lois,
Don't start in with the keyboard diharea or I might change my mind.
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Todd Gordon
Trad climber
Joshua Tree, Cal
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Mar 19, 2009 - 08:28pm PT
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Woody looks down from heaven ......and chuckles.........If it had to do with climbing, politics, history, or education;.....Woody was on it.......and Woody seemed to more than "put up" with our B.S......he seemed to enjoy it;.....carry on...............................................
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Matt
Trad climber
primordial soup
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Mar 19, 2009 - 08:32pm PT
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(as an aside, are we about to witness the ULTIMATE in ST thread lowest-ification?)
nothing like a twisted but compelling distraction to keep one's mind of of grief...
very well-
carry on.
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happiegrrrl
Trad climber
New York, NY
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Mar 19, 2009 - 08:41pm PT
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"and Woody seemed to more than "put up" with our B.S......he seemed to enjoy it;"
I have to admit that I only recently realized that Woody sometimes wrote things with the intent of egging people on(to make a fool of themselves). It was, to him, I think, a real source of amusement. I can't recall him ever doing it to ME specifically..... hmmmm, better change the subject quickly. hahahaha
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Hardman Knott
Gym climber
Muir Woods National Monument, Mill Valley, Ca
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Mar 19, 2009 - 09:40pm PT
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Bump to keep this climbing-related thread on the first page...
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Karen
Trad climber
So Cal Hell
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Mar 19, 2009 - 09:46pm PT
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I wish this was all just a sick joke. Damn it, I miss you Woody !!!!
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paganmonkeyboy
climber
mars...it's near nevada...
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Mar 19, 2009 - 10:29pm PT
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My condolences to the family and friends - this is so very sad.
-Tom
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ß Î Ø T Ç H
Boulder climber
the greasewood ghetto
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Mar 19, 2009 - 10:39pm PT
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By Woody Stark
Jan 28, 2005
rating: 5.10a
I led this route last weekend. I rate it 10a, and that's a reduction from what others that day would have rated it. Giving it an R is not adequate; it's X. If you don't quite get to the second bolt, you ground. We even back belayed all who followed. It's a great route; however, the bolts need to be replaced and at least one added.
By Woody Stark
Jan 29, 2005
rating: 5.10a
Okay, let me put it this way: there is a point between the two bolts on the traverse where the belayer might as well put the rope down and take a nap because his attention is no longer an issue.
That collection of posts from mountain project is rad .
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