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Karl Baba
Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
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Largo wrote
"I keep reading how gay "marriages" will destroy traditional marriages, or undermine their sacred value, and how this is all a huge threat to straight folk, but I haven't yet read how any of this treat is supposed to play out and how it's going to taint my marriage or mean any damn thing to me or mine? HOW is this threat supposed to materialize? "
Here's how society will fail it's traditional values of anal retention (maybe that's the wrong metaphor):
First, Boys in high school will discover strong sexual feelings but the high school girls won't be easy to score, but, since Gay Marraige will have made queerhood more respectable, they'll discover that other guys are EASY! Pretty soon, they'll be all used to easy gay sex without all the needless dating, sensitive talk and fuss.
Second, Girls in high school will discover their interest in guys becomes disappointing when the guys only seem to want sex and not dating, sensitive talk and fuss, but that other girls are masters of those things. Sorry guys, you're too crude for the girls who mature faster.
Third, allowing gay marriage is a step in the wrong direction, which will be to outlaw homosexuality and abortion at the same time (cause gays have lots of abortions) In the righteous society of the future, both types of sinners will be fed to lions in large stadiums in massive after-church events. It will be bloodier than MMA but with the same flair. (Lions with snappy names and outfits)
Once Obama shows his true colors (maybe that's the wrong metaphor) interracial marriage will also join banned unions. If God wanted races to mix, he wouldn't have color coded us.
;-)
Karl
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setherbugs
Social climber
Leuven, Belgium
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ok here's one problem i find with allowing gay marriage in relation to it's affect on society. allowing gay marriage opens the door to polygamy and here's why. if you allow gay marriage, then you must also consider other sexual preferences (we can't descriminate against them either). i won't even mention animal lovers. so why polygamy, well why should a bisexual only be able to marry one of their partners? can you imagine the emotional distress this would cause? it would be like the days in p.e. class when they are picking teams and you don't want to be the last one picked. the other partner is left in the cold. and what about hermaphrodites? they should be able to pick two partners as well, shouldn't they? and what about a bisexual hermaphrodite? they deserve at least 4 spouses. so if the aforementioned happens, we can only conclude the the mormons will also want to reinstate polygamy. and once polygamy is generally accepted, Hugh Hefner, if he's still alive, will become the next president. in some african tribes, the chief shows he's authourity by how many wives he has (an we all can see what a wonderful state africa is in). i can only imagine that hugh or warren jeffs are best positioned to benefit from this occurance. so if you want either of these two as president, please by all means continue to support gay marriage!
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Karl Baba
Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
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the only solution is to get government out of the marriage business.
Hefner can already have 4 girlfriends and enter into various contracts with multiple individuals. I'm sure he'd be relieved that he can't marry them all.
All the slippery slope arguments are kinda lame. We allow people to own guns but not plastic explosive nor napalm bombs or nukes.
We allow boxing but not fights to the death
We didn't allow women and blacks to vote but now we do but not dogs and cats
as much as people fear the return to biblical marriage values like polygamy, it's unlikely to happen and just as easy to do without being official.
Folks should look up the old arguments, fought long and hard, against freeing slaves, letting women and blacks vote, and so on, and figure how much of the predicted harm came to pass.
Perhaps the fact that we now have a mixed race president will assure some and confirm the fears of others
PEace
karl
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Chaz
Trad climber
So. Cal.
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Karl's 100% right when he says:
"the only solution is to get government out of the marriage business."
YES.
The Government ought not make any distinction at all whatsoever between married Americans and non-married Americans.
That's why I didn't vote on Prop 8. I figured a vote either way said The Government HAS a legitimate authority to insert itself between people at their most basic level; the family.
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wilcox510
climber
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"the no-fault divorce has had no direct effect on me (my parents will celebrate 50 years next month), but the effects on marriage have been devastating" - I don't understand the concept of "the effects on marriage". I am married, whatever the divorce rate is does not affect me or my marriage. If the divorce rate increases, it does not make my marriage weaker, neither will allowing gay marriages. As far as opening the door to polygamy, that's kind of stretching it don't you think? It would be easy and reasonable to have laws specify that marriage is between two (and only two) individuals regardless of gender. The Merriam-Webster dictionary has already acknowledged gay marriage, why can't you?
mar·riage - 1 a (1): the state of being united to a person of the opposite sex as husband or wife in a consensual and contractual relationship recognized by law (2): the state of being united to a person of the same sex in a relationship like that of a traditional marriage b: the mutual relation of married persons : wedlock c: the institution whereby individuals are joined in a marriage2: an act of marrying or the rite by which the married status is effected ; especially : the wedding ceremony and attendant festivities or formalities3: an intimate or close union
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
Arid-zona
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I'd be troubled too if people kept telling me that my parents were evil and that I was going to be screwed up because of them.
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bookworm
Social climber
Falls Church, VA
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again, wilcox, you're making a selfish argument...it's all about YOU...the no-fault divorce has been detrimental to marriage and society through the reasons i listed...your reference to the dictionary also points out your hypocrisy...you say my definition of marriage is wrong but only because it doesn't match your definition...you clearly want to discriminate against people who have their own definition of marriage, which might include marrying multiple partners or maybe even a sibling...ok, you claim same sex marriage won't hurt marriage or society, then explain how polygamy will hurt marriage or society...if you can't (without using my arguments against same-sex marriage because you clearly they're invalid) then the only way to prevent marriage "discrimination" is to allow everyone to define marriage however they please
the claim of discrimination is also weak...banning interracial marriages was clearly wrong because people have no control over their race...you will probably claim that sexual orientation is genetically determined, but we have complete control over our behavior...so even though i am genetically designed to spread my seed to multiple partners--which you evolutionists must approve--and have a very natural urge to do so, society encourages me to control my behavior because it is better for society and ME to do so
for states that have put the marriage question to ballot, the record is 30-0 against same-sex marriage...do you believe in democracy?
again, why not accept civil unions? call it a pilot program; 50 years from now, the facts might change people's minds...the people might finally be ready to move from acceptance to approval of same-sex marriage
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WBraun
climber
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Hey ????
Hahahaha you guys still here, hahahah
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setherbugs
Social climber
Leuven, Belgium
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seriously, why would supporters of gay marriage, not also support a bisexual being married to two people at the same time? is bisexual less of a sexual preference than the other? the thing about discrimination is that it has to start/stop somewhere, what people are saying now is that it should stop here, and remain how it has always been. a world without discrimination is not one that i would like to live in.
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sirloin of leisure
Gym climber
X
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werner,how are things?the climbing here sucks,but the mountain biking kicks ass..
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WBraun
climber
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sirloin
Lot's of old guys running around this weekend trying to climb the Nose. They have so far only gotten to the Ahwahnee for lunch.
Later they will go to El Cap meadows for the size-up ........
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WBraun
climber
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Gotta get some photos of these guys standing around the meadow ....
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Chaz
Trad climber
So. Cal.
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You might not want to put those pics in the Gay Marriage thread, Werner. People could get the wrong idea.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, Ca.
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and I didn't get to climb yesterday or today, so I'm super pissed at gays. F*#king gays!!!!
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, Ca.
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OMG!!1111!! ruok? TBL!!! LMAO!11!! LOL1!
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