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BLUEBLOCR
Social climber
joshua tree
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Aug 27, 2014 - 09:08pm PT
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Found some Jehovah's Witness literature in my door today. It poses three "Big Questions".
1. What is the meaning of life?
2. Is god to blame for our suffering?
3. What happens when you die?
I have found my answer to all three.
1. Life's meaning is whatever each of us makes it.
2. I have no evidence any god exists so the question is ill defined.
3. Your heart stops, your brain goes inactive and that is the end of your part of the party.
Twenty years ago I would have been very surprised to see god questioned as in question 2.
Is some doubt beginning to creep in?????????
Have you ever had a scientist show up spreading The Good News of Evolution?
NO. Because it ain't Good News!lol
Question 2, every good christian knows Man is solely responsible for suffering! It's only secularist that pronounce "If God is so great, why would He allow suffering?" i guess you expect Him to put His foot down everytime a law was broken? God allowed man free-will inorder for him to get a taste of being a Judge.
How about question 1, you pretty much hopped and skipped that one!
What's YOUR honest meaning of life? To Procreate?
And #3, Yea your body goes to dust, but doesn't the JStan energy/spirit move on? Even Light gets recycled.. ...along with EVERYTHING else!
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Wade Icey
Trad climber
www.alohashirtrescue.com
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Aug 27, 2014 - 09:19pm PT
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every good christian knows Man is solely responsible for suffering!
what do the bad ones know?
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Byran
climber
San Jose, CA
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Aug 27, 2014 - 09:39pm PT
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What about the two thousand or so people who saw Jesus after his resurrection? Were they all delusional?
Uhhh....
Yes. Yes they were.
Just like the two thousand or so people who have seen Elvis Presley after his resurrection.
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jstan
climber
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Aug 27, 2014 - 09:42pm PT
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I'll put things back in their original order:
How about question 1, you pretty much hopped and skipped that one!
What's YOUR honest meaning of life? To Procreate?
Not at all. Without even realizing what you are doing you are assuming everyone is tracking the same meaning(s). Not. It's your religious bent showing up again. Procreation? Open your eyes for a moment. This planet is overburdened with us. And in general we learn an individual has the potential to contribute something truly exceptional only after they have lost the ability to procreate. Almost without exception, none of us has such a potential.
You have told us on several occasions what you think is meaningful. You have already agreed with my point.
Question 2, every good christian knows Man is solely responsible for suffering!
Then why do christians cause so much suffering? And why would a "good" and all powerful god give such heinous power to people with free will? Watch the news.
And #3, Yea your body goes to dust, but doesn't the JStan energy/spirit move on? Even Light gets recycled.. ...along with EVERYTHING else!
Mike, be very careful when tempted to use the words, always, never, or everything. It is the same as saying, "Ignore this. What I am saying is patently wrong."
Light can be absorbed, be converted to thermal energy and with time the systems with that energy become less and less able to do work. Do you really think the spirit of a photon is still recognizable when it degrades to small bits of energy possessed by who knows how many atoms? You need to understand what you mean by "moving on". Your meaning is so emotionally loaded you can't break through and see it.
As for evolution if you wanted, you could go read what Darwin had to say. Darwin is not in one of your circles.
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Tvash
climber
Seattle
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Aug 27, 2014 - 10:48pm PT
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Jonestowners, the Raleans, jihadist suicide bombers - plenty o folks dying for lies out there. All you need is faith. Reality not required. Fervency means nada.
We are energy, matter AND information. Energy and matter are recycled - our information - who we were - and what differentiated us from a few pounds of water, carbon, and a handful of other elements, is destroyed. If you want to believe that few pounds of elements that remains is still you, knock yourself out. Don't feel bad if the phone stops ringing.
There is no historical proof HeyZeus existed - unlike Washington et al.
The Bible is not a historical document - at all. No authorship, for example…but that's just the beginning of the unknowns there. All those folks who saw Jesus after his resurrection? - the story was made up, juuuuuust like all the other religious myths of the period. Why is Isis a myth but Jesus isn't? Plenty of 'documentation' for the existence of Isis (way more, in fact - he's literally plastered all over Egypt.) Hmmmmm.
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BLUEBLOCR
Social climber
joshua tree
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Aug 27, 2014 - 10:49pm PT
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be very careful when tempted to use the words, always, never, or everything.
Yea, fair enough.
You still only answered with another Question though.
As far as photons, do we not see "most" things move on to become something else?
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Tvash
climber
Seattle
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Aug 27, 2014 - 10:54pm PT
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Information. Gone forever. Take someone's cremation urn and try to reconstruct a single one of their memories from it.
Write back when you've cracked it.
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BLUEBLOCR
Social climber
joshua tree
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Aug 27, 2014 - 11:12pm PT
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^^^it should be easier than the earth all by itself pushing up a pile of dirt causing DNA to form allowing us to stand-up and sing Happy-Birthday!
And where do you think this information came from or how it came to be?
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BLUEBLOCR
Social climber
joshua tree
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Aug 27, 2014 - 11:30pm PT
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- he's literally plastered all over Egypt.)
i'm pretty sure the Egyptians have recorded history of atleast Mosses and Joseph.
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Tvash
climber
Seattle
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Aug 27, 2014 - 11:33pm PT
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Why don't you research that while you're educating yourself about the 2nd Law of Thermodynamics - and how creating complexity from simplicity is possible by adding energy to the system.
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WBraun
climber
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Aug 28, 2014 - 07:39am PT
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Stooopid people are the biggest cause of war.
This thread is 99% full of stooopid people who also cause war without even knowing they do.
Stooopid stupid stupid people .....
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Tvash
climber
Seattle
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Aug 28, 2014 - 08:06am PT
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It's spelled "stoopit", Peacemaker.
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Tvash
climber
Seattle
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Aug 28, 2014 - 08:11am PT
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It's amazing to me how many die hard Christians
a) aren't at all familiar with scripture and
b) have no idea whatsoever where that scripture originated from
That's real faith, boy.
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High Fructose Corn Spirit
Gym climber
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Aug 28, 2014 - 08:21am PT
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the curse of knowledge...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Curse_of_knowledge
.....
Thank goodness I was raised on The Scientific Story.
For every ONE like me raised on The Scientific Story (incl physics, chem, bio, ecology, evo, etc..) there are 20 others in America who were raised on the Bible Stories.
Two distinct models for how the world works.
If change is this slow here in the internet-driven info age, imagine how slow it was 1000 years ago.
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timy
Sport climber
Durango
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Aug 28, 2014 - 08:54am PT
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Would you die for a lie, Timy?
If I never existed, then I couldn't die.
Read the article. It was in vogue at the time to take existing myths and conflate them into a writer's own story and claim it to be truth.
I don't know the truth, but if he did live, Jesus was just one of many travelling preachers. It was a common hobby at the time as well. Like Tvash pointed out earlier, Paul blew him up way later for personal gain.
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BLUEBLOCR
Social climber
joshua tree
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Aug 28, 2014 - 09:37am PT
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from fruity's link,
it was also found that for adults: "knowledge becomes a more potent curse when it can be combined with a rationale for inflating one's estimates of what others know".
See it all the time in kids, they just presume everyone else knows what they know.
As adults, we should work harder to talk our opinions out, and strive to understand opposing views. Some learn how to do this with an ear of love by the raising of children. i see those men that don't bare children tend to force their opinions on others without regard to where opposing opinions stem from. Thus the "my way, or the highway" attitude rises from the animal instinct. With the temperament towards murder. This is not a healthy way to teach a child, so why would it be good to teach a brother with such prejudice?
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Tvash
climber
Seattle
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Aug 28, 2014 - 10:51am PT
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Um...I know the opposing view. 8 years of religious schooling. a true believer until age 19 - and I apparently know A LOT more scripture than you do, even today.
I never had some Big Life Crisis That Brought Me To Jesus, though.
I do not attempt to 'teach' Christians. I simply present what I see as the fallacies and injustices of the religion - both in philosophy and its practice - for public discussion and invite comments on same.
Funny - I rarely get any critiques of any of my specific statements from true believers with the notable exception of John E. It's mostly the kind of idiotic strawmen and just plain nonsense, like the post above.
Hey, if you want to base your entire life on whatever, fine. I find it helps to know the origins and evidence for your most cherished beliefs, but YMMV.
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jstan
climber
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Aug 28, 2014 - 10:55am PT
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According to Devers, Moses is an Egyptian name. This past spring a group of Israeli archeologists released a final report stating that there was no direct archeological data connected to any of the biblical stories. We here in our cultural context are discussing the Bible which was created in its own cultural context. While we think, probably incorrectly that we know our context, few of us have the barest idea of what Abraham was all about. I didn't. Well, here is a start.
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/ancient/archeology-hebrew-bible.html
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WBraun
climber
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Aug 28, 2014 - 11:07am PT
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Tvash -- "I apparently know A LOT more scripture than you do, even today."
No wonder you spew all day every day in these types of threads.
Academics in scriptures means ultimately you don't really know sh!t and is very evident by all your daily spew ......
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Tvash
climber
Seattle
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Aug 28, 2014 - 11:33am PT
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Interesting article and site, Jstan. Thanks for posting.
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