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Tvash
climber
Seattle
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Jan 29, 2015 - 01:56pm PT
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Jebus worked the End Times story pretty hard. "Get on the boat before it's too late!"
It's probably an very old one - annihilation must have figured large in the minds of early hominids for some very good reasons.
It's more about personal annihilation, though - an inconvenient reality we all face. How to deal with it? Escape reality is one strategy.
It's also about the pleasure of seeing one's enemies finally getting what they so richly deserve. Folks who pine for that tend to embrace the whole End Times thing.
The whole 'It's prophesied' line is just another form of 'Hey, it
's outta my hands. I'm just following orders." A moral disconnect if there ever was one. "Let's clean this place of all the riffraff." Nothing new there, either.
If the shite ever does come down, and it would appear that there may well be some self-inflicted pain on the menu in coming decades, God will protect his chosen - the very wealthy.
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Lorenzo
Trad climber
Oregon
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Jan 29, 2015 - 02:08pm PT
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Jan 28, 2015 - 11:26pm PT
Still waiting for where in the bible you get this idea of Fallen Angels and Lucifer.....
belay-on
Isaiah 14:12,
How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!
that was an easy one
nice talk!
Nope, you ain't off the hook. Isaiah specifically links The fall of the Morning star( happens in cycles) to the fall of Nebuchadnezer. he's making a point about how God decides who's worthy ... Turns out to be Cyrus who becomes the new anointed one.
who were the Nephilim the sons of, again? The bible tells us once.
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Tvash
climber
Seattle
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Jan 29, 2015 - 02:14pm PT
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Klimmer
Mountain climber
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Topic Author's Reply - Jan 29, 2015 - 07:21pm PT
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Lorenzo,
Get up to speed on Satan, aka Lucifer, the Dragon, The Father of Lies, and many other names he has and goes by, and also his minions The Fallen Angels. And yes the fallen angels, a group of them did have offspring with earthly women, and the offspring are Nephilim. The Bible is very clear about this.
There are many very complete studies, books, articles that go into great thorough detail throughout the Tenahk (Old Covenant) and the B'rit Hadasha (The New Covenant). I'm sorry you can not see the forest through the trees. You are in a very serious theological hole you can't seem to get out of.
Study.
Survey of Bible Doctrine: Angels, Satan, Demons
https://bible.org/seriespage/6-survey-bible-doctrine-angels-satan-demons
I'm moving on to other arguments.
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Lorenzo
Trad climber
Oregon
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Jan 29, 2015 - 10:03pm PT
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Nope,
Not what the bible says. Here goes. The story starts with the genealogy of the line of Adam, ending here:
"So all the days of Lemeḵ were seven hundred and seventy-seven years, and he died. And Noaḥ was five hundred years old, and Noaḥ brought forth Shĕm, Ḥam, and Yepheth. (Genesis 5:31-32 ISR98)
Then we get into the Sons of God thing:
"And it came to be, when men began to increase on the face of the earth, and daughters were born to them, that the sons of Elohim saw the daughters of men, that they were good. And they took wives for themselves of all whom they chose. And יהוה said, “My Spirit shall not strive with man forever in his going astray. He is flesh, and his days shall be one hundred and twenty years.” (Genesis 6:1-3ISR98)"
So, pretty unmistakeable the the Sons of God married daughters of men. God, knowing everything, knows bad stuff is coming, so he limits man's span. The people before then are living, like, 900 years. For reference, Adam is called a son of God ( who else would be his father?)
Now here is the key part:
The Nephilim were on the earth in those days, and also afterward, when the sons of Elohim came in to the daughters of men and they bore children to them. Those were the mighty men who were of old, the men of name. (Genesis 6:4 ISR98)
(For reference, when I was born, there were Nazis on the earth in those days. Doesn't make my father or me a Nazi.)
So the timeline says the Nephilim were on the earth before there were children of the marriages being born, as well as afterward when the children were being born.
Even in the bible, children aren't around much before they themselves were born. Not even Jesus. The children can't be Nephilim.
And the children being born are the mighty men of old, not Nephilim. Alternatively in that passage, the Nephilim were the mighty men of old! But they are neither identified as fathers nor sons of anyone. The topic doesn't come up.
Notice the bible says nothing about fallen women. It says the daughters were good ( some translations say fair)
The only place the bible says who was the Father of the Nephilim is in Numbers. They are the "Sons of Anaq" , a Cannanite king. Three of them are named. They are Giants and Goliath (10 ft tall) is of their line. The King James Bible uses the word Giants where the Hebrew bible uses Nephilim.
The Egyptians mention Anaq in their records. He's one of the few early characters who can be identified from an outside source.
I think you need to study more. Try it for comprehension this time. You are letting doctrine ( and bad SciFi) dictate what the bible says. It should be the other way. Don't you believe the Bible is the sacred word of God?
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Flip Flop
Trad climber
Truckee, CA
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Jan 29, 2015 - 10:52pm PT
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Lorenzo
Trad climber
Oregon
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Jan 29, 2015 - 11:10pm PT
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Moon Nazis aren't real?
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Klimmer
Mountain climber
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Topic Author's Reply - Jan 29, 2015 - 11:23pm PT
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Lorenzo,
You are on your own planet theologically. And I mean alone. Perhaps you are starting the 1st Church of Lorenzology?
Listen to the Jews, they know the Tenahk (Old Covenant). The Messianic Jews also know the B'rit Hadasha (The New Covenant). The two go hand in hand. Both Books were written by Jews. They are Jewish books. G-d had them write it. It was solely their responsibility to bring The Good News to the world and to bring the Messiah to the world for salvation and they did. They carried the water for G-d for thousands of years. The Rabbinic Sages have studied the word of G-d since it was first written down in Hebrew. Yeshua didn't come to start a new religion, simply Judaism with the Messiah. Messiah has come as prophesied and to he died for the sins of the World. G-d takes bad things and bad events and turns them into good things.
Yes, they missed their Messiah, but G-d knew that would happen. They had a hard heart as a nation. But G-d loves his Bride. He has never left her for long or for good. He is a G-d of his word. He will keep his promises to the nation of Israel and the Jews. It was prophesied that they would miss the first coming of their Messiah as a nation, and the good news would go to the nations and it did, it happened. However, 10s of thousands of Jews individually came to know their Messiah in the first centuries after Yeshua went back to the father. They were the first believers. Judaic Synagogues would become Messianic Judaic Synagogues when the light went on and they received their Messiah. Then the Gentile nations got a hold of the Good News and radically altered it, and not for the better, and it became very anti-Semitic.
HaShem has made a way for the nation of Israel to return to G-d and one day soon the veil covering their spiritual eyes as a nation is coming off and they will believe and accept Yeshua HaMashiach as Messiah. They will cry for him as a mother cries for her only begotten Son.
The age of the gentiles is rapidly coming to a close and G-d turns his attention to the Nation of Israel to save his chosen people.
Lorenzo, don't start a new religion. Too much confusion out there already. Seek G-d and ask a Messianic Jew or a Messianic Rabbi for spiritual guidance and help.
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Lorenzo
Trad climber
Oregon
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Jan 29, 2015 - 11:25pm PT
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I at least, can read. I just follow what the good book says.
You follow what priests say. They all say something different. That's why we have wars.
I didn't know you accepted YHWH had a Bride. Most modern Judeo-Christianity doesn't accept Ashura.
The folks three millenia ago did, though.
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Klimmer
Mountain climber
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Topic Author's Reply - Jan 29, 2015 - 11:45pm PT
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Yes, I listen to what The High Priest says for sure, and to do what he says to do. Sometimes I fall flat on my face and fail. But he pulls me back up, dusts me off, and puts me on the path again.
Our High Priest is non other than Yeshua HaMashiach. Adonai. G-d. Emmanuel. Lord of Lords, and King of Kings.
And you should listen to him too. You're into your own erroneous interpretation of the Word of G-d and that is how we get Mormonism, Church of Scientology, driving off the road recklessly, and many other bad turns that lead to spiritual ruin.
Galatians 1:8 (KJV)
"But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed."
By the way, that would be a Fallen Angel that would attempt to do that. They are tricky buggers for sure. They can even appear as an Angel of Light. They are deceivers. They are liars. Don't be fooled.
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Lorenzo
Trad climber
Oregon
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Jan 29, 2015 - 11:56pm PT
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‘I am יהוה, and there is none else – there is no Elohim besides Me. I gird you, though you have not known Me, so that they know from the rising of the sun to its setting that there is none but Me. I am יהוה, and there is none else, forming light and creating darkness, making peace and creating evil. I, יהוה, do all these.’ (Isaiah 45:5-7 ISR98)
Do not the evils and the good Come out of the mouth of the Most High? What? Should mankind complain, A living man, because of his sins? Let us search and examine our ways, And turn back to יהוה. (Lamentations 3:38-40 ISR98)
Forget Satan and moon ships. Turn to God.
I'm pretty sure you don't know the origins of Satan, either.
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BLUEBLOCR
Social climber
joshua tree
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Jan 30, 2015 - 12:07am PT
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Notice the bible says nothing about fallen women. It says the daughters were good.
good job narrowing it in. do you really think those guys were 900 yrs old, or the planet is 6000 yrs old? the bible is a spiritual manual, and must be traversed as so. what's the spiritual wealth of a man/woman = Man,of a bodily life span being reduced from 900yrs down to 120yrs? the part about Love i don't hear many talk about is, how to love oneself. there tries to be a lot of talk about "loving ones neighbor", when Really isn't that all about "loving ones self"? Frankly, coming from a material world, by passage from a mother and father, i can decifer the love that can happen between a man and a women APART from everthing else. There's nothing like it on the planet. Along with that it becomes reproduction. Where else in reproduction do you see that streamlining of love? So without reproduction, or the material need, where could there be Love?
If God, the God of Love, is spiritual(he must be because he aint here), and also the "One" God. Why does it take two of us mortals to understand Love? IE, man and woman, man and grandmother, man and daughter, and yes man and man.yes i said it!
it would be hard to express Love being only One!?
Could this be the downfall of the spiritual world?
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Lorenzo
Trad climber
Oregon
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Jan 30, 2015 - 12:15am PT
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Don't look at me, I'm not the one who thinks fallen angels and Lucifer got it on with somebody's daughters.
The ark on the moon, though....
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BLUEBLOCR
Social climber
joshua tree
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Jan 30, 2015 - 12:28am PT
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i hear ya dude
but whatever entices Love. know what i mean
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Lorenzo
Trad climber
Oregon
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Jan 30, 2015 - 12:30am PT
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Nice concept. Nobody seems to be going there on a global scale.
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BLUEBLOCR
Social climber
joshua tree
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Jan 30, 2015 - 12:35am PT
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i hear a lot of peoples talk about uninhabiting the 'I'.
but how are we to love one another if we can't first love ourselfs?
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BLUEBLOCR
Social climber
joshua tree
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Jan 30, 2015 - 12:38am PT
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i sure like ur words Lorenzo
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Gary
Social climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
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Jan 30, 2015 - 07:04am PT
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I know enough Hebrew to know that Elohim is plural. What gives, monotheists?
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BLUEBLOCR
Social climber
joshua tree
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Jan 30, 2015 - 07:32am PT
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^^^the father, son, holyspirit triune, try sucking that through a straw.
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