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raymond phule
climber
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If Ammon fell 10 or 20 times on it, and even got injured, then A3+ is PDH. And is there a route he fell more on?
But doesn't this show one problem with aid ratings, that an aid rating is a danger rating that might get mixed with a difficulty rating.
50 m of good hooks above a big ledge would probably result in a A5 rating due to the danger.
What aid rating would 2-3 extremely difficult hook moves above a good piece and a clean fall result in?
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Hummerchine
Trad climber
East Wenatchee, WA
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Not everybody who choses to try to put up a route is obligated to be the very finest or boldest climber on the planet for that route. If that were true, all the face routes below 5.11 would be X rated put up by soloists and 5.14 climbers.
so true
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donini
Trad climber
Ouray, Colorado
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A climb is what it is regardless of the rating. Only climbers care about (often to excess) the rating. You can either get up a climb or you can't.
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philo
Trad climber
Somewhere halfway over the rainbow
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^^^ Truth he speaks Yes ^^^
There is a transient magic that only the FA climber's can know or feel.
They are the only ones who do not know if it will go.
Once done the path remains to be followed but the magic is gone.
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deuce4
climber
Hobart, Australia
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Coz, I don't reckon Grossman to be an egotist--certainly a cantankerous bastard, but pretty mellow when you talk to him in person. Like a lot of Arizona climbers. Certainly he's been coming off as a major grump regarding this climb.
Where was your hard aid lead? Never heard about it, must have been after I left the ditch?
You're probably right abut Gerb--he did most of his best stuff after I left the valley, his climbs are probably the true test pieces of the late 80's/early 90's.
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philo
Trad climber
Somewhere halfway over the rainbow
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I bet the cleaning was serious biz as well. Good job Kait.
+1
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'Pass the Pitons' Pete
Big Wall climber
like Ontario, Canada, eh?
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Philo - Kait really had to face down a lot of fear, belaying Ammon through so many long falls. She said it was really tough.
Silver - the route was harder than just beer. Rumour has it the Jameson was pulled out during critical emergency moments!
Coz - emphatically concur that Gerb is a sandbagger. The "A3" diorite pitch on Continental Drift was arguably the hardest pitch I've climbed on El Cap, definitely the real deal. And Kevin Thaw's Extraordinary Alien pitch was harder still, though a completely different kind of hard. Ask Neil.
Incidentally, I received an email from one of the Big Three last night, reminding me that while there were indeed three Choppers, there were only two Shitters, and to please quit suggesting that he was a Shitter, when it was merely a can of Dinty Moore. So to him, I extend my heartfelt apology. ;)
Edit: LAP's post two below is factually wrong.
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donini
Trad climber
Ouray, Colorado
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This thread is immortal but what happened to all the talk about a film, did common sense prevail?
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LAP
Boulder climber
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Shitters.
Steve Schneider
Bill Russell
Who stewed?
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Studly
Trad climber
WA
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I just got my Rock and Ice in the mail, and read the new Wings of Steel article. One of the most captivating and well written climbing articles ever! Good job Ammon, wow.
Kept me on the edge of my seat.
i KNOW THE TRUTH AND i HAVE BEEN SET FREEEEEEEEEEEEE
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murcy
Gym climber
sanfrancisco
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Thanks for the pics, ECP. Nice!
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philo
Trad climber
Somewhere halfway over the rainbow
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"Who Stewed?"
lol
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Captain...or Skully
climber
Where are you bound?
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I'll send you one, treez.
PM some particulars. Easy Peasy.
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nature
climber
back in Tuscon Aridzona....
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you should divert that fish to KorFest.... ;-)
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couchmaster
climber
pdx
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They're just being passionate about something they love, and most of the rest of us don't view it that way so they become more adamant. Thats' all. Probably have a streak of the artist inside of them. Grossmen, and Mimi seemed like two of the coolest people in the Valley, can't understand their persona here, strange.
Weld-It, didn't "Otto Graph" do the first ascent of Porcelian Wall? Not the one in Yos, this one:
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Prod
Trad climber
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Hey Ammon,
Nice write up. Thanks.
Prod.
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sac
Trad climber
Sun Coast B.C.
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RIGHT ON MAN!! RIGHT ON! ^^^^^^^
Thanks for the psyche , and breath of good climbing air.
Yeah!
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Hummerchine
Trad climber
East Wenatchee, WA
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Riley Wyna
Trad climber
A crack near you
Oct 7, 2011 - 07:50pm PT
Got carried away there when I got the mag....no need for another thread
Waaaaahhhhoooo
Congrats to Ammon and Kate on a great article and hard fought adventure.
And a big, big congratulations to Richard and Mark for writing such a sick book and for putting up one of the hardest routes anywhere under horrible pressure of every kind.
And much love to Steve and Mims for fighting for ethical purity because it is important ...
My thoughts...
In a world full of corruption, cowards and poor ethics, where I have to see the blood of dying old people sucked for every drop and dollar they can produce and I sometimes want to take a flame thrower to the whole damn thing: It is an honor to be a climber where how you live and what you do does matter. I recieve inspiration right now from both sides and I believe there is a path here where everyone can find some vindication. And with some more communication even forgiveness, apologies and mutual respect.
Much love to all climbers
It's good to be alive!
Yaahhhhaaaa
Cheers....
Riley
One week and um big wallling again myself
Eat it suckas
Holy Crap, dude...
Where did you come from?
I mean, get real...you blow into the most contentious and in many ways obnoxious climbing thread EVER? And you think you can just join sides with everyone and see their point of view???????????????????????????????????
Are you completely INSANE??????????????????????
I'm just messing with you, your post is not only insanely cool, but just might be the most reasonable thing posted to date on this topic. Very nice...
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