The Massive Ark on the Moon (very OT, but of high interest)

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lostinshanghai

Social climber
someplace
Apr 19, 2012 - 03:24pm PT
It is obvious you did not read my post earlier on threats. Klimmer
healyje

Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
Apr 19, 2012 - 04:11pm PT
Klimmer: It seems you're both US veterans, am I right? Right-wing and can't tolerate others thinking outside the box. Sad really.

Veteran, check. Right-wing? Hmmmm, this is exactly what I'm talking about - how on the third planet from the sun would you derive that assertion / belief from anything I've ever written in this thread or on ST for that matter?

Klimmer: Seems you can't fathom or stand the thought that people want to talk about interesting ideas and beliefs, and like to ask deep questions, regardless how "out-there" it all sounds like and seems. Many of us don't see eye-to-eye, but at least I'm being respectful. Most of us who are talking about these ideas and beliefs are. Those who think these ideas and beliefs are nuts, are intolerant, unbelievably rude, throwing out ad hominem attacks constantly, and threatening.

As I've said, I've probably downed more scifi and fantasy than you have, believe the universe is positively teaming with intelligent life, and am completely open to ideas and deep questions, regardless how "out-there" they may seem.

Where I start having a hard time is when those "out there" ideas start making the transition into shared beliefs supported by a circular loop of manufactured, self-reinforcing 'evidence' which then begins to reverberate until making the inevitable leap to conspiracies. At that point it starts becoming dangerous and just another form of cult. And again, this paranormal business, relative to the public, is done exactly the way indigenous genocide is conducted and the direct cause of incidents like the Solar Temple and Heaven's Gate. In fact, your entire deal is virtually indistinguishable from the latter two other than in 'execution'.

So, as someone who can do a short drive to see our nation's indigenous genocide still hard at work and who did some work with Leo Ryan you'll forgive me if I take this stuff seriously.

Klimmer: You can sit-back and think it's all as serious as someone talking about Santa Claus, The Easter Bunny, or Leprechauns. I'm not threatening anyone. The message of Jesus Christ isn't threatening.

I find it more serious because most folks don't really believe in Santa Claus. The Jim Jones, Marshall Applewhite, and Joseph Di Mambro weren't threatening either - at first.

Klimmer: Emmanuel's message is about peace, love, and hope. UFOs/ET are a part of this discussion, because the Good Book has a great deal to say about them. Just watch Ancient Aliens on The History Channel if you don't think so.

It's entertainment fiction and after a good start the History Channel has morphed into joke the same way Oprah's network did once she sold it. And that the History Channel has received withering criticism for chasing ratings with paranormal fiction is no surprise. What is a sad surprise is how many uneducated saps there are sucking this down like so much sticky syrup and pablum.

Klimmer: Perhaps talking about truth and trying to wrestle it out intellectually you feel threatened by that? So then simply don't click on this thread. Go away and leave others alone. If you and Lost continue doing what you do, both of you are just coming across as intolerant and narrow minded right-wing bullies, and dangerous ones at that.

"Talking about truth" - that leap sums it all up and is exactly how genocides and mass suicides get rolling. Actual common sense (let alone intellectual) criticism appears to be the only thing really threatening in this thread. Again, it may all seem like harmless fun to you, but from media and psychological perspectives your whole shtick here is indistinguishable from the Tea Party, right-wing and fundamentalist extremists, and your coupling of scifi with religion the very hallmark of various mass suicide cults.
lostinshanghai

Social climber
someplace
Apr 19, 2012 - 05:13pm PT
Klimmer;

So I am assuming you agree with Ted Nuggent saying: "We need to ride into that battlefield and chop their heads off in November," Nugent said of the Obama administration.

Is that freedom of speech, I guess rape, murder is ok as well. OPPs that's not speech that is an act. Thinking it and saying it is different.

I think you have rightwing mixed up or do not understand the idea or thoughts.
Klimmer

Mountain climber
San Diego
Topic Author's Reply - Apr 19, 2012 - 05:49pm PT
You said in your own made-up and make-believe world . . .

Apr 19, 2012 - 02:13pm PT
Klimmer;

So I am assuming you agree with Ted Nuggent saying: "We need to ride into that battlefield and chop their heads off in November," Nugent said of the Obama administration.

Is that freedom of speech, I guess rape, murder is ok as well. OPPs that's not speech that is an act. Thinking it and saying it is different.

I think you have rightwing mixed up or do not understand the idea or thoughts

What the heck is OPPs???

You can't threaten people with physical harm in speech. That is not freedom of speech. TN is a whack job. Your dribble is very similiarly scary and way whack.



What I said . . .

I have no more choice than to send-off an email to Chris Mac and alert him to your very obvious threats. You are a very, very scary person.

The threats in this country come from people who think and do as you do.

Last time I looked we have a Constitution and Bill of Rights. We have freedom of speech and freedom of religion. We do not have freedom to threaten anyone, even if they differ in philosophy, religion, thought process, or what have you. It's called tolerance. The True Christian faith is peaceful to the point of loving your enemies and doing good to people who persecute you. It never picks up a weapon to do harm to others.

You've crossed the line many multiple times here on ST.



How can you honestly keep spouting the same 100% USDA Bovine Dung, over and over again? Do you not know how to read english? Do you really think I would ever agree with what Radical Right-Wing Ted Nugent ever has to say? Are you serious? I'm a Veterans for Peace Member, Amnesty International Member, an ACLU member, and a Sierra Club member. Can you really be serious????

It's like I'm talking to a wall. A very dense wall.

What I said . . .

Seems you can't fathom or stand the thought that people want to talk about interesting ideas and beliefs, and like to ask deep questions, regardless how "out-there" it all sounds like and seems. Many of us don't see eye-to-eye, but at least I'm being respectful. Most of us who are talking about these ideas and beliefs are. Those who think these ideas and beliefs are nuts, are intolerant, unbelievably rude, throwing out ad hominem attacks constantly, and threatening.

I'm not doing that to anyone. You can sit-back and think it's all as serious as someone talking about Santa Claus, The Easter Bunny, or Leprechauns. So be it. That's your opinion. I'm not threatening anyone. The message of Jesus Christ isn't threatening. Emmanuel's message is about peace, love, and hope. UFOs/ET are a part of this discussion, because the Good Book has a great deal to say about them. Just watch Ancient Aliens on The History Channel if you don't think so.
lostinshanghai

Social climber
someplace
Apr 19, 2012 - 06:33pm PT
When people say to me “Are you threating me”, I respond by saying “no”. They then say well what is it? I respond by say “Making it a promise”. They can’t throw you in jail for a promise, a threat yes.

As for your “I'm a Veterans for Peace Member, Amnesty International Member, an ACLU member, and a Sierra Club member. Can you really be serious????

Just having a card or paying dues does not count. When do you take the time to go to one of their meetings and speak up and deliver your rants? Seems to me all your time is searching the truth for one or two people to agree with you.

Still haven’t answered that question as of yet.

Klimmer play your game, you have the right to say anything you want but limited in some, you are wasting my time on someone who has a narcissistic personality but who am I to say; maybe you are a genius with an IQ of 140+ or just gifted.

Hey did you find the island by the way.

GC said it before on he is right just feeding you so you need to leave you alone, maybe then you will go away.

Fat chance
Klimmer

Mountain climber
San Diego
Topic Author's Reply - Apr 19, 2012 - 06:50pm PT
As I've said, I've probably downed more scifi and fantasy than you have, believe the universe is positively teaming with intelligent life, and am completely open to ideas and deep questions, regardless how "out-there" they may seem.

Where I start having a hard time is when those "out there" ideas start making the transition into shared beliefs supported by a circular loop of manufactured, self-reinforcing 'evidence' which then begins to reverberate until making the inevitable leap to conspiracies. At that point it starts becoming dangerous and just another form of cult. And again, this paranormal business, relative to the public, is done exactly the way indigenous genocide is conducted and the direct cause of incidents like the Solar Temple and Heaven's Gate. In fact, your entire deal is virtually indistinguishable from the latter two other than in 'execution'.


HJ,

Huh????

So you believe the Universe is teaming with life.

But others who have evidence and know that "they" are here already are whack and that people thinking this way will lead to death camp cults?

Really?

Crazy stuff there HJ. Really crazy.




Please debunk Leslie Kean's book:

UFOs: Generals, Pilots, and Government Officials Go on the Record [Paperback] Leslie Kean (Author)
http://www.amazon.com/UFOs-Generals-Pilots-Government-Officials/dp/0307717089/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1334874911&sr=8-1


So from your circle of reasoning we can then assume that Generals, Pilots, NASA astronauts, and Government Officials who know the truth and have witnessed these phenomenon and have the other collaborating physical evidence of UFOs/ETs being here are going to start death camp cults? Is this right HJ? Do I have your circle of reasoning correct?

Maybe we should just round them all up and put them in prison or worse, huh? They are at a minimum commiting thought crimes. We just can't have that. (sarcasm)

War is peace. Lies are Truth. Where have I heard all that before? Oh, yea, George Orwell's 1984.

Please lay off the right-wing hallucinogenics.


Klimmer

Mountain climber
San Diego
Topic Author's Reply - Apr 19, 2012 - 07:05pm PT
Apr 19, 2012 - 03:33pm PT
When people say to me “Are you threating me”, I respond by saying “no”. They then say well what is it? I respond by say “Making it a promise”. They can’t throw you in jail for a promise, a threat yes.


Lost,

So you are saying you are making it a promise to carry out your threat, right? Well, that goes waaaaaay beyond threat level.

You are truly bent and really, really wrong. Sad.





I'm just going to have to ignore you and HJ.


Note to self:

Just ignore "Lost" and "HJ." They have serious emotional issues and can't tolerate anyone with different thoughts, religious faith or faith at all, or those curious about the natural world around them who ask questions and seek for truth. They are both absolutely intolerant. They both have a radical right-wing bent being former military, and are prone to threats of a violent nature.

Duly noted. So be it. Ignore them.
lostinshanghai

Social climber
someplace
Apr 19, 2012 - 08:13pm PT
"maybe you are a genius with an IQ of 140+ or just gifted"

No, to the above more like 55-70. Did you cheat on your teachers credentials?
Tony Bird

climber
Northridge, CA
Apr 19, 2012 - 08:26pm PT
klim, c'mon out to the gordonfest saturday night. at least dr. F has promised to be nice. he's not as lean as he looked in the bouldering guide, but if we stick close to his shirttails, he'll keep the peace. i'll show you two V0's and a V1 i developed with my clients last year.
healyje

Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
Apr 19, 2012 - 10:04pm PT
But others who have evidence and know that "they" are here...

Again with the huge leap - there is zero 'evidence' of any kind and no one who "knows" has ever produced a shred of 'evidence' other than hearsay.

The Cash-Landrum incident is a perfect example of a case where a plethora of a case where on the surface there should be an endless supply of physical evidence of thermal ground effects, effects of ionizing radiation, radar tracks from IAH 19 miles away, etc., etc. In reality, there was miraculously never more than hearsay and the claimed and observed medical conditions were entirely consistent with ionizing radiation exposure.

The whole run of the NIDSci is another example - never produced anything of any substance of any kind that wasn't just a rehash of unoriginal material plagiarized from elsewhere. In short, there has never been a shred of undeniable, uncontroversial, obvious, persistent, straightforward, repeatedly observable evidence - ever , for any form of UFO or paranormal activity. Get some, put it on display at the Smithsonian or your backyard and I'll be a believer.

Klimmer

Mountain climber
San Diego
Topic Author's Reply - Apr 19, 2012 - 10:42pm PT
Tony and Dr. F,

Thanks, but I can't.

It would probably be fun, but its my B-day and the kids are excited about going to Disneyland, seriously, that's the truth. If I blew that big event off, I would be on the poop list for sure and for along time.

The Gordonfest shouldn't be planned on Muir's B-day, not a good day for me, my B-day too :-)

Sounds like it will be fun though. Crank some way-rads and don't drink too much.

I don't think I would invite "HJ" and "Lost" though. They might show-up with superior fire-power and actually want to use it, looking for anyone thinking outside the box. How dare anyone think beyond what "the State" (aka Big Brother) allows. We just can't have that. (sarcasm)


Edit:

HJ,

Read Leslie Kean's book.
Russ Walling

Gym climber
Poofter's Froth, Wyoming
Apr 19, 2012 - 11:04pm PT
klim, c'mon out to the gordonfest saturday night. at least dr. F has promised to be nice. he's not as lean as he looked in the bouldering guide, but if we stick close to his shirttails, he'll keep the peace. i'll show you two V0's and a V1 i developed with my clients last year.

Really, both you dudes are as crazy as the day is long... but come on out. You got no worries, I'll buy you some beer, Dr. F will watch your back and I'll watch your front. Anyone even looks like they might want to lay a finger on you (which will never happen cuz they are all keyboard pussies) I'll stomp their guts out. If you guys decide to beat me up, then all bets are off and I'm calling Dr. F to protect me.

Seriously, it will be fun and a good time. Bring your ex'es!
Tony Bird

climber
Northridge, CA
Apr 19, 2012 - 11:32pm PT
klim, i think you take your discussions seriously here. meeting in person adds some real dimension to it. craig and i gave each other a little autobiography last year and i think it made a world of difference. you learn not to throw rocks at someone who is real and you know a bit about where they're coming from.

you're giving us martha excuses. mary would be at the party. john muir wants you to come too. he was the premier rock climber of his day. bring kids, todd will change diapers. disneyland is n.w.o. keep your kids away from there.
healyje

Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
Apr 20, 2012 - 02:03am PT
I've been to one of the Gordon Ranch throw-downs and the crew that rallies around the family is as good as ST has to offer - even Russ (though Suze is the business). Any time you have a chance to hit a ranch party up I'd jump at it and besides, as fearsome as I am person, I won't be there.

News today - a real interestellar travel mystery:

http://phys.org/news/2012-04-team-anomaly.html

Mimi

climber
Apr 20, 2012 - 02:09am PT
Klimsey, if anyone even tries to lay a tinfoil hat on your sorry ass, I'll fly down there myself and fukemup. Got that! Be there, aloha.
Tony Bird

climber
Northridge, CA
Apr 20, 2012 - 08:28am PT
as fearsome as I am person, I won't be there.

whew!

if anyone even tries to lay a tinfoil hat on your sorry ass

um, mimi, that's not where you put a tinfoil hat.
sandstone conglomerate

climber
sharon conglomerate central
Apr 20, 2012 - 09:04am PT
Looking to apprentice to a skinwalker, preferably Navajo, but Ute will do I guess...prefer the giant bullet-proof wolf form , but will settle for weasel shapes and speed running. Thanks.
Tony Bird

climber
Northridge, CA
Apr 20, 2012 - 09:26am PT
loose talk about skinwalkers doesn't play in indian country, sandstone. don't you know better than that?

i advise you to read the book. at least you noticed that the nickname is a bit anomalous. there's a reason.
sandstone conglomerate

climber
sharon conglomerate central
Apr 20, 2012 - 09:38am PT
The indigenous had much deeper ties to the earth than the wasichu could ever imagine. I've read the accounts, and don't deny that strange things have happened there. I keep an open mind. Hell, I like the idea of skinwalkers prowling in the dark. Keeps things interesting. I just don't want any of that corpse powder blown in my face, unless corpse powder is some kick-ass strain of ganj coming at me from the business end of a bong, ya know? Speaking of the Navajo, have you ever read Blood and Thunder, by Hampton Sides?
Tony Bird

climber
Northridge, CA
Apr 20, 2012 - 09:49am PT
yes, blood and thunder--a good chunk of history there.

hunt for the skinwalker is divided into three parts. the first is as entertaining a ghost/horror yarn as you could ask for. then it all starts to die down in the second part, when the NIDS investigation begins. there are still enough "special effects" to keep your interest, but not enough to begin to satisfy the ignorant skeptics who notice that no one managed to cram an alien into a test tube, and therefore declare the effort a failure. if you stay for the third act, you'll find it boring as hell, if you don't pay much attention to science. to me, it's the most intelligent speculation to date about the paranormal, and you will find that kelleher has much credentialed company.
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