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Craig Fry
Trad climber
So Cal.
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Apr 13, 2016 - 08:42am PT
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Cults use lies, and misinformation to keep them in a cult like bubble
The Democratic party does not do this, nor does Bernie
or most of his supporters
Cult like as a Party? No
There are cultish members of any group
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dirtbag
climber
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Apr 13, 2016 - 08:49am PT
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Craig- I think Democrats are ignoring just how poorly their party is doing in 2 respects. First, the fact that they are losing repeatedly basically everywhere that isn't the White House. Second, there is a similar rift in the Democratic party as we are seeing in the Republican one. It's not as extreme, but the ignorance on the far left that Sanders has uncovered has been truly breathtaking when you take it all in. While the schadenfreude is impossible to enjoy, Democrats would be better served in addressing the problems that they are encountering. If the Republican party "breaks" this year, they will only be "broken" so much as they have lost the White House and maybe the Senate. They will still overwhelmingly control most of the states, the House and they will probably be able to retool and build using the midterms as an easy place to win in the interim because Democrats just refuse to actually show up.
I agree.
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 13, 2016 - 08:56am PT
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Err...schadenfreude is impossible to avoid, not enjoy.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Apr 13, 2016 - 08:57am PT
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The center/lefties, the Democrats of Europe, are in widespread retreat there, also. The only
thing that they've got going for them there is the immutable EU bueaucracy which they
created and which has become the anchor around their neck, too. People are sick and tired
of the onerous regulations and they've finally realized those regs are a huge drag on the
economy.
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Craig Fry
Trad climber
So Cal.
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Apr 13, 2016 - 09:03am PT
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The center/lefties are in retreat because they are getting beat back by the right wing and big money
As long as money can buy politicians, we are screwed
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Bushman
climber
The state of quantum flux
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Apr 13, 2016 - 10:13am PT
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A World Outside Disney
Here's the church and here's the steeple
Open there doors and there's all the sheeple
Following others into the abyss
The way we all act you know something's amiss
Religion and politics stirred like a brew
Mix in a toxic philosophy too
Addicting the mind like a dangerous drug
From genius to moron we all get the bug
To drool in our Starbucks and stare at our tubes
Listening like zombies to media boobs
Gathering in clusters spellbound by the thrall
No clue of the circumstance behind it all
History be damned we repeat all in rote
Righteously forging ahead to misquote
Patriot mantras and morals of old
No matter how dated or covered with mold
When slavery and racism ran in our genes
Sexism and rape an acceptable means
For predicting the outcome of children to come
Where abuses and torture would make our minds numb
To follow a leader whomever they be
Who lines the path primrose we all should be free
To denigrate our neighbor and trot out a lamb
Oh sacrifice we must let our conscience be damned
Onward you soldiers and follow if you must
Don't take time to reason what's logically just
With patience and kindness no longer in vogue
We're all ruthless sheeple who do what we're told
There's a world outside Disney progressive and wise
Respecting the sovereignty of each of our lives
Just talk to a human who's not from these lands
And you just might remember what we have in our hands
The blood of our brothers won't buy us a plot
But pays for our stewardship likely as not
And the right to move forward instead of go back
Where men's lives were only worth gold in a sack
So here's the church and here's the steeple
Open the doors and see all the people
In a church that's a nation the steeple a light
Where power reserved is more mighty than might
But ruthless sheeple would still come and would go
Who's handed the reins something nobody knows
Throwing lives under buses a political fact
But threading a needle requires more tact
That's how things always are and they always will be
In a world complicated changing constantly
Less concerned by who governs we take or we give
In a world outside Disney where the rest of us live
-bushman
04/13/2016
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Hardly Visible
Social climber
Llatikcuf WA
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Apr 13, 2016 - 12:27pm PT
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Nice poem Bushman.
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Lorenzo
Trad climber
Portland Oregon
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Apr 13, 2016 - 01:14pm PT
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Ted Cruz once argued that the state of Texas should be allowed to ban the sale of dildos, artificial vaginas, and vibrators
I'm glad he wasn't in Oregon. What would we have sent the Ranch Stupidians?
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Apr 13, 2016 - 01:19pm PT
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The center/lefties are in retreat because they are getting beat back by the right wing and big money
That's not why they're having their asses handed to them in Europe.
They've failed, plain and simple.
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JEleazarian
Trad climber
Fresno CA
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Apr 13, 2016 - 01:28pm PT
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Europe has a different demographic from the U.S. because of declining populations of citizens of working age. The European welfare state relies on keeping a ratio of workers/beneficiaries at least constant, if not increasing. It suffers the same issue Social Security and Medicare suffer here -- as does every Ponzi scheme.
John
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Craig Fry
Trad climber
So Cal.
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Apr 13, 2016 - 01:35pm PT
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Neo-con economics are what failed, it's failed every time, please state a historical account when it wasn't a failure
liberal economics has not failed, most countries have no problem using it.
Liberal economics just won't be used to fix the problems the neo-cons caused because the conservatives are still in charge, like here.
SS and MC would be fine if Neo-cons wouldn't try to make it fail by underfunding it.
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Norton
Social climber
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Apr 13, 2016 - 02:48pm PT
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John posted:
It suffers the same issue Social Security and Medicare suffer here -- as does every Ponzi scheme.
John, you seriously believe SS and Medicare are "Ponzi schemes"?
you do realize that SS operates as a surplus with 2.7 trillion dollars in trust?
and has lifted tens and tens of millions out of extreme poverty since the 1930's?
yes John without "fixing" legislation such as raising the income to deduct cap, SS
will eventually run out of funds to pay 100% of benefits, in roughly another 18 years,
and surely you would agree that a future congress will have the will and intelligence to raise the cap and perhaps add "means testing" to deny benefit to Warren Buffet, etc?
or: does the very idea of say people paying into SS and then dying before age 62,
or some other way people can get screwed, the real reason you denigrate the single great social benefit program in American history by now calling it a Ponzi scheme"?
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Contractor
Boulder climber
CA
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Apr 13, 2016 - 05:23pm PT
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Yeah John, that's a classic poor analogy.
Consider if Bush and the Wall Street gang would have had their way in the privatization of Social Security.
Imagine the irreversible carnage if retirees would have transferred taxpayer guaranteed, retirement money to the stock market prior to the Great Recession.
That probably would have resulted in bread lines for many of us.
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Jon Beck
Trad climber
Oceanside
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Apr 13, 2016 - 07:26pm PT
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Just watched the town hall with Cruz's family. The claim was made that Heidi's father, Peter Nelson, climbed Mt. Everest. A quick google revealed that he had was on a 1991 expedition, however he did not summit.
http://publications.americanalpineclub.org/articles/12199122602/Asia-Nepal-Everest
On October 2, Nelson joined Lowe and Culver at Camp IV. That night Nelson developed pulmonary edema and descended to Camp II where his condition was stablized with the use of a pressure bag.
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Gary
Social climber
Where in the hell is Major Kong?
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Apr 13, 2016 - 07:31pm PT
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surely you would agree that a future congress will have the will and intelligence to raise the cap and perhaps add "means testing" to deny benefit to Warren Buffet, etc?
I hope not. SS is for everybody, Bill Gates included.
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rottingjohnny
Sport climber
Shetville , North of Los Angeles
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Apr 13, 2016 - 07:43pm PT
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Social Security , the Ponzi scheme , would go away if Americans could latch on to the billable hours scam...
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 14, 2016 - 06:45am PT
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John posted Europe has a different demographic from the U.S. because of declining populations of citizens of working age. The European welfare state relies on keeping a ratio of workers/beneficiaries at least constant, if not increasing. It suffers the same issue Social Security and Medicare suffer here -- as does every Ponzi scheme.
Europe has a different demographic problem than the US because it has the same demographic problem as the US?
Norton posted John, you seriously believe SS and Medicare are "Ponzi schemes"?
No, he doesn't. But he can't help getting a rise out of people now and then.
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August West
Trad climber
Where the wind blows strange
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Apr 14, 2016 - 02:54pm PT
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I think Democrats are ignoring just how poorly their party is doing in 2 respects. First, the fact that they are losing repeatedly basically everywhere that isn't the White House. Second, there is a similar rift in the Democratic party as we are seeing in the Republican one.
Much of the Democrats poor showing is due to gerrymandering. I'm too lazy to look up the exact results, but in one or more of the last mid-terms, Democrats got more total votes in both the House and Senate but the Republicans ended up in control of both houses. Wyoming having the same number of senators as California is the reason in the Senate. The House is largely due to gerrymandering, although I have read that some of it is due to highly democratic urban areas that tend to end up naturally gerrymandered. (I would think R's would get the same in rural areas, but it may not all cancel out.)
I prefer Democrats over the disaster that the Republican party has become. However, I agree that the Dems are not immune to populist anger. I expect Hillary to win the Whitehouse this election and, if the R's can nominate somebody like a Ryan/Kasich/Romney the Rs will win in 2020 and the Dems could then well have a party in chaos.
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Craig Fry
Trad climber
So Cal.
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Apr 14, 2016 - 07:40pm PT
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Continued story
How Fox News Unwittingly Destroyed the Republican Party
Hearst used his media network as an instrument of power by controlling the content and distorting the truth in order to manipulate public opinion for his own benefit.
So we have seen this playbook before. One would think that we would now be savvy enough to prevent this terrible abuse from happening again. But apparently not. It is astonishing that Mr. Murdoch has been able to recreate right before our very eyes the abusive practices pioneered by Mr. Hearst over one hundred years ago.
Today, the bottom line is money. Politics is secondary. While the media content is highly political, the purpose behind influencing politics is to serve the primary objective of protecting the big profits.
Just think what would happen if the Republican Party suddenly proposed a tax on excessive corporate media profits. This right-wing network would shift away from the Republican Party so fast your head would spin. Bill O’Reilly would be sporting tie-dyes and Birkenstocks.
Corporate profits is what led to the creation and expansion of this extremist right-wing media network. And it is indeed a cozy little business model. The network builds an audience by appealing to people’s fear, insecurity, and anger, and simultaneously directs its audience to support the right-wing political party that best protects the network’s own profits.
It’s like a rigged game. The content disseminated over the network masquerades as being objective and informative, but in reality the content has instead been carefully designed to promote the network’s own business interests.
Pretty nifty.
What is best for corporate profits, however, is not necessarily best for a democratic society.
From a political perspective, it is certainly not healthy to incite anger and hate within a nation’s own population. And it is not very wise to inflame hostility and rage against a nation’s own government. From a business perspective, sure, it is perfectly understandable because a corporation can exploit this and profit handsomely from it. But from a political perspective of creating a cohesive society and maintaining peace and harmony among the population, this is disastrous.
Responsible politicians certainly know better and would never endorse any enterprise seeking to inflame anger and hostility in the population. A true political leader would not participate in any such conduct, but instead would speak out against it. A true political leader would not condone the dissemination of false and misleading information, but instead would seek to correct it with accuracy. A true political leader would not sacrifice unity in society in order to capture a few easy votes, but instead would uphold his or her principles and integrity even at the risk of losing votes.
That is genuine political leadership. Doing what is best for society, even in the face of adversity.
But politicians in the Republican Party could not resist. The extremist right-wing network of Fox News and talk radio had built up an audience that could easily be exploited for political support. Even though the extremist media network was fomenting anger and hatred that is disastrous for society overall, the network could also be used to deliver political votes to Republican politicians.
And there it was. The Republican Party had made a deal with the devil.
An unholy alliance was formed. The Republican Party would allow the extremist right-wing network to promulgate its destructive propaganda throughout society in order to generate its enormous profits, and in exchange, the network would direct its audience to vote for the Republican Party.
The allure of easy votes was too great. Exercising true leadership was too difficult.
So for years and years, the extremist right-wing media network spewed out content full of anger, hate, and division. And Republican politicians jumped on the bandwagon. They began preaching the same destructive messages and appearing on the extremist right-wing network all across the nation.
And guess what? It worked.
The base of the Republican Party grew more and more angry. Their resentment against our very own government grew ever greater. Their sense of victimization became ever more acute. Their fury at the establishment boiled over.
And then, predictably, it backfired.
The base of the Republican Party became a Frankenstein. It became radicalized into an extreme movement that turned against the established order, including the leadership of the Republican Party itself. It has become a monster of its own that is now roaming the countryside and terrorizing the very political party that created it.
This is the reason behind the rise of candidates like Donald Trump and Ted Cruz. The Republican Party establishment despises these candidates, but the Party has no idea how to slay these dragons.
These candidates now pose the enormous threat of potentially causing a giant split within the Party that could lead to the utter destruction of the entire Republican Party itself.
It is a remarkable story.
The Republican Party has enjoyed its dance with the devil. Now it must pay the piper.
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