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Blight
Social climber
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"I find the Old Testament contradictory in places to the Gospels."
Well, it is.
And it's supposed to be.
Some parts of the bible are an instruction manual which tells us what we should do. But a lot of it tells us what not to do. It's not just an instruction manual, it's a history of christian thought, with bad stuff from the past left in so we can learn from past mistakes - "those who fail to learn from history are condemned to repeat it".
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
Arid-zona
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Tell us about the part where Jesus rode dinosaurs.
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Blight
Social climber
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"Peace Love and Joy are Christ emotions. Anger, fear, pride, lust and greed are ego emotions"
What a fashionable mix of buddhism and christianity. Nice buzzwords. Completely out of context and misunderstood though.
Jesus was often angry. And exasperated. And irritated. His disciples made him very angry many times with their small-minded attitudes towards things like the romans and women.
Jesus was afraid too. When he was given up to be crucified he said that he didn't want to go through with the suffering and pain.
We often hear it said that christians should be calm, passive - doormats really. We hear it said that a christian should "turn the other cheek", taken to mean that they should allow themselves to be abused without ever defending themselves or their beliefs.
I've touched on the reason already in this thread: those who abuse christians would like them to be passive because abusers want to play the bully without risk of retaliation. But there's nothing, not a thing, in the bible or in the life of christ to suggest that jesus or his followers were passive or silent.
The early christians were passionate and driven. They travelled huge distances to spread the word, shouted it in city squares and to huge crowds, and were often tortured and killed for their beliefs.
I'm sure a great many atheists would love for christians to be meek and quiet becasue that would mean they weren't a threat anymore - and indeed we Moosie mixing it up with some trendy cherry-picked ideas from buddhism to try to make exactly that point. But that's not how Jesus lived his life and not how I live mine either.
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Ed Hartouni
Trad climber
Livermore, CA
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Blight quotes Santayana, a popular quote no doubt we're all familiar with... here is another:
“History is always written wrong, and so always needs to be rewritten.”
—Life of Reason: Reason in Science, Scribner's, 1906, p. 45
And Santayana is an interesting philosopher to quote in this long discussion... especially given how he lived his life and for what his philosophical thoughts were.
here is the longer quote:
"History is always written wrong, and so always needs to be rewritten. The conditions of expression and even of memory dragoon the facts and put a false front on diffuse experience. What is interesting is brought forward as if it had been central and efficacious in the march of events, and harmonies are turned into causes. Kings and generals are endowed with motives appropriate to what the historian values in their actions; plans are imputed to them prophetic of their actual achievements, while the thoughts that really preoccupied them remain buried in absolute oblivion. Such falsification is inevitable, and an honest historian is guilty of it only against his will. He would wish, as he loves the truth, to see and to render it entire. But the limits of his book and of his knowledge force him to be partial. It is only a very great mind, seasoned by large wisdom, that can lend such an accent and such a carrying-power to a few facts as to make them representative of all reality.
Some historians, indeed, are so frankly partisan or cynical that they avowedly write history with a view to effect, either political or literary. Moralising historians belong to this school, as well as those philosophers who worship evolution. They sketch every situation with malice and twist it, as if it were an argument, to bring out a point, much as fashionable portrait-painters sometimes surcharge the characteristic, in order to make a bold effect at a minimum expense of time and devotion. And yet the truly memorable aspect of a man is that which he wears in the sunlight of common day, with all his generic humanity upon him. His most interesting phase is not that which he might assume under the lime-light of satirical or literary comparisons. The characteristic is after all the inessential. It marks a peripheral variation in the honest and sturdy lump. To catch only the heartless shimmer of individuality is to paint a costume without the body that supports it. "
George Santayana
[url="http://books.google.com/books?id=A7ye4YrD0VkC&pg=PA323&dq=intitle:life+intitle:of+intitle:reason+inauthor:Santayana+date:1900-1910&lr=&as_brr=0#PPP16,M1"]Life of Reason[/url]
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Lynne Leichtfuss
Social climber
valley center, ca
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Blight, we are all uniquely made blessed with different personalities which express themselves in a variety of ways. Matthew, Mark, Luke, John, Peter all acted differently.
Peter cut off someones ear and jesus had to make a repair. John always spoke about love.
I am a jesus follower, not a hindu, buddhist etc. I believe the bible is the inspired word of god.
I do not think jesus was "Often" angry.
Have a great Tuesday,
Joy and Peace with lots of the love of christ thrown in. Smiles
Lynne
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John Moosie
climber
Beautiful California
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Now thats funny. Blight, your main complaint on this thread is that people attack creationist without provocation. Then, without provocation, you go and make fun of my beliefs. I am a creationist.
Grow up dude. Study the ego. And yes, I believe that both Jesus and Buddha were the Christ. Krishna also. Many people have become the Christ. It is the Christ mind that is the only way to Peace. The Christ mind is the Way, the Truth and the Light. Any of us can become the Way the Truth and the Light when we put on the Christ mind. Putting on the Christ mind is a process. Jesus still had ego and did not give up the ghost of the ego until on the cross.
Read Kim Michaels book "I Love Jesus, I Hate Christianity".
Or make fun of me. Its your choice.
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andanother
climber
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Come on, people!
I'm still looking for answers about toenails and man-nipples.
Blight, you sure are long winded. How about taking a moment and explaining why God gave me those things.
The presence of nipples on men might suggest that we all have descended from females (or perhaps an asexual primate). But the Bible says that Adam was the first human, and then Eve came from him.
Why did God give Adam nipples? And what the f*#k are my toenails for? God gave them to me, so I'm sure they must serve a purpose. But so far, us humans haven't been able to figure it out. Is there something in the Bible that I missed? Or is this yet another example of religious people ignoring the facts that are right in front of their eyes?
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dirtineye
Trad climber
the south
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I know I know!!
God gave you toenails so you'd have something to pick the blight out from under, after a barefoot walk in a well used cow pasture.
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Blight
Social climber
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"I do not think jesus was "Often" angry."
Then you should read your bible! Jesus shouted at his disciples on quite a few occasions and he really lost his temper with money-changers in the temper and once even had a hissy fit with an olive tree!
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Blight
Social climber
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"without provocation, you go and make fun of my beliefs. I am a creationist."
I didn't even mention your beliefs about creationism. I certainly criticised your misappropriation of buddhist ideas and your mixing them with christianity, and I'll continue to do so, but if you can't handle your ideas being criticised then the internet may not be the place for you.
"Read Kim Michaels book "I Love Jesus, I Hate Christianity"
Kim Michaels claims to be the personal representative of Jesus Christ and to speak directly for him. That's not a view that's well supported by the bible. If you find something interesting in his books, good. I hope it benefits you. But I'd be very, very wary of anyone who claims that they speak for God perosnally and that everyone else is wrong.
"Grow up dude. Study the ego."
I have. And I agree with the view that, as has been said by several scholars, buddhism and christianity are compatible on a superficial level only. If you practice them superficially, mixing some buzzwords here with a dash of pseudo-psychology there, you may come up with something which looks attractive and smells okay.
However, go deeper and you'll find irreconcilable differences, particularly on the subjects of ego, dualism and interdependent origination.
Be clear about this: I disagree with you. My own findings and those of many scholars differ from yours. This is not making fun of you, it's just having a different view. Please don't take this personally.
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Blight
Social climber
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"the Bible says that Adam was the first human, and then Eve came from him."
Actually the bible says two different things: in genesis 1 it just says he created them, male and female, on the sixth day. In genesis 2 it gives the account of Adam being created first then Eve being created from one of his ribs.
Actually it gives a different order for the creation in the two chapters as well - in the first chapter God makes the animals first then man, in the second he makes man and then the animals.
I wouldn't treat the Bible as a chronological history of the world if I were you, it's only a couple of thousand pages long so you may have to face the fact that it's edited a bit.
;)
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andanother
climber
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Wow! The Bible contradicts itself?
No shit!
So, in order to beleive what the Bible says, you have to completely ignore other parts of the book? Even if the contradictions begin within the first few sentences of the book, and then continue throughout?
That's a great religion you got there, blight!
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, Ca.
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Andy, you need to take it all in the context it was written in.
I think you know this but are either trolling or are in some kind of atheistic denial.
...either way, whatever. Jesus and God prolly still love ya. Prolly.
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Ouch!
climber
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The father, the son, and holy spirit. Said to be all the same.
Are the son and holy spirit avatars?
Does this make the father a troll?
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, Ca.
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I hear ya Ouch. Ask a Catholic or a Jew if their the same though. It is the Holy Trinity, but are they really the same?
God created everything. Jesus saved us from ourselves by representing God on earth.
Just like Satan, God does not show himself. That's what faith is for. You must take one path or the other.
One is lies, deceipt, and confusion. The other is pure love, truth, and compassion.
It's really simple to me.
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dirtineye
Trad climber
the south
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Satan showed himself to Jesus, a man at the time.
It says so in the bible, so it must be true.
Sorry Bluer, yer wrong about the devil not showing himself.
Unless of course you don't believe the bible.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, Ca.
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did he show himself to man?
if he did he would lose the eternal battle.
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andanother
climber
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"One is lies, deceipt, and confusion."
Ain't that the truth. In the 15 years I spent going to church and pursuing christianity, I noticed those three things to be prevalent.
The Bible is full of lies. Some of it is open to interpretation, but much of it is purely false. This leads to deceit, an essential part of creating followers. And ultimately that deceit leads to confusion among anyone with half a brain.
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