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elcapfool
Big Wall climber
hiding in plain sight
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You should go.
You'd probably count as at least two...
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Matt
Trad climber
places you shouldn't talk about in polite company
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please, it's the desert, they really don't need any more hot air
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dirtineye
Trad climber
the south
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YOu gotta admit, that was funny
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atchafalaya
Trad climber
California
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First, this was asserted:
"For some people (mostly men, because the conditioning of the culture exacerbates evolutionary psychological differences in the nature of the sex drive), sex and love can be wildly seperate, OR one, "depending"." (WTF???)
Then,
"i also love all the refrences to "in this culture" and the like. do you wanna know what makes grown men need to shag every girl they meet? it's not biology, it's not the need to father more children, it's just low self esteem, plain and simple."
Cybele, Matt, get a grip on yourselves. Theres a third simple, reasonable explanation; shaggings fun!
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Matt
Trad climber
places you shouldn't talk about in polite company
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shaggin's a hoot, no question, just don't be tellin her you won't be shaggin everyone else and then go doin it, after you said you wouldn't. that's got nothin ta-do w/ shaggin, and everything to do w/ what kinda man you wanna B, and whether you deserve the love you take from someone under those pretenses.
fatty- you're like an 8 year old, same dumb jokes, again and again and again, year after year after year...
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Landgolier
climber
the flatness
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ECF wrote:
"I've known Pete personally for more than 10 years. And for your information, most of his "tips" are directly stolen from Chongo, who I have known for even longer. Pete will tell you he edited Chongo's book, Chongo will say the same, but add the word plagerize... I've got his number, wanna call him?"
woah woah woah, timeout on the field. Chongo has a phone?!?!?!
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nature
climber
Flagstaff, AZ
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I have emailed HK Ted Titaniums first name - I've known it for many many years. I don't want the beer so ECF can have it (mostly because of the stories I heard from him via email).
HK - you bought the subaru? yikes!
Blow - the Humboldt Assassin does have a nice ring. Too bad he never lived there. He hooked up with us (the Humboldt Crew) in JTree in the mid-90's. He fit right in so we "admitted" him to the madness. It helped he started bringing the kegs from SF :-).
cybele, it would be one thing is it was only about the mistakes. I've now heard first hand from the other three that were on the Muir Wall with the CA. Mistakes happen. We all know that. At one point I engaged the CA in discussion about the Muir. He never admitted to his mistakes. His trip report for the Muir is ridiculously different than that of the other three. He pretty much lied to me in an attempt to get the discussion dropped. The Canadian Death Knot is/was real and almost sent Ted Titanium from the top of EC to the valley floor. The mistakes are one thing. The extent to which he did things that were beyond not cool makes me ill to listen to. He has done some walls and succeeded. But the quote from Tim via ECF is scary "Just let other people find out for themselves. Sooner or later someone's going to get killed. It won't be us."
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Hardman Knott
Gym climber
Muir Woods National Monument, Mill Valley, Ca
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Nature wrote:
I have emailed HK Ted Titaniums first name - I've known it for many many years.
I don't want the beer so ECF can have it (mostly because of the stories I heard from him via email).
OK, the beer will go to ECF - incidentally, yours was the only correct guess
(out of a whopping 2 responses).
HK - you bought the subaru? yikes!
Yep - and the POS blew the head-gasket in Sac coming back from
Strawberry on a day when it was like 105 degrees in the shade.
On the bright side, I got a few good weeks out of it...
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nature
climber
Flagstaff, AZ
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I should have said: I kindly defer the beer to ECF for enduring the epic known as the Muir Wall.... I really wish I had figured out who he is a year or two ago. I'll need a large stockpile of beer for once we finally meet.
fun trivia question.... second letter 'a', last letter 'r'. wheeee!
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elcapfool
Big Wall climber
hiding in plain sight
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Lan-
I should have been more specific. I know the number of the person he is staying with, as I am a friend of their's too.
Chongo, land line, yeah, that's hilarious!
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WBraun
climber
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No no
I hear thru the grapevine he has a cell phone.
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elcapfool
Big Wall climber
hiding in plain sight
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Are you sure they didn't say a "phone in his cell"?
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WBraun
climber
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Hahaha lol
They also say he is working as a busboy in a restaurant or something like that? Is this true?
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Blowboarder
Boulder climber
Back in the mix
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"Blow - the Humboldt Assassin does have a nice ring. Too bad he never lived there. He hooked up with us (the Humboldt Crew) in JTree in the mid-90's. He fit right in so we "admitted" him to the madness. It helped he started bringing the kegs from SF :-)."
I dub him that not for where he hailed from but for the diabolical sickness he hooked me up with minutes after meeting him for the first time.
Humboltd>Okanogan, at least as far as horticulture is concerned. And to think I once believed different.
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Landgolier
climber
the flatness
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wait, I forgot, there is photo proof that Chuck has a phone
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Karl Baba
Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
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A lot of humanity on display in this thread. I wish ya'll well with life, love and learning from it all.
Funny that, even with the venom displayed, there's still move love or compassion intact than after many relationships. Nice.
Your love is your love. If somebody doesn't honor it properly, you shouldn't shut down your big heart, just consider the source and act accordingly (such as keep an arm's length in some cases)
I've seen Pete be a dog before. Not as bad as his worst accusers say, but bad enough. Seems like he's owned up to a few things and got better. Since he had a long way to go, it's easy to imagine that he's not a saint yet and folks would be wise to communicate their expectations with him in total clarity to have a better chance of avoiding wiggle room and misunderstanding.
and to think i thought this thread was just a typo for "Pete's Peg is Seen Lost in the Racy Warm Hole."
What was I thinking?
Karl
Edit: I think it's to Pete's credit that he hasn't posted to this thread, despite several opportunities to say "told you so" or "not" or at least "but." It wouldn't have accomplished anything. If all if his past sins, or all of any of ours, were available for analysis on the net, it would be pretty ugly.
The thing is, we all still have to live with ourselves, do better with ourselves, and move on. I don't think we should invalidate anyone completely but most of all we should never invalidate ourself either, even if we need reform. So I wish all well on the next round of trying to get it right, and that includes me.
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cybele
Ice climber
finally, west of the Mississippi
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Matt, I do agree with everything you have said. (You go and figure out what the contradictions are, if they even are...) Janet, ouch, there's always another side to a story. I think things depend a lot on what is said and promised between two people, which only the involved parties know (no, I don't want to know, thank you). And, also, my personal feelings about what I am ok with in my own lover are not necessarily the same as what I can intellectually accept about an acquaintence.
And elcapfool--
yeah, uh, like, i have the big Chongo aid book and have read it, it being a free gift from him as a present for painstakingly editing his physics philosophy book "Face of the Observer." I never said Pete's my friggin guru or something. But really how many would or could spend a benji on a handprinted book? How realistic is that? (When I complained to Chuck about the price, he said the it was correct given the printing costs. I can't help but notice the huge margins and wordy wordiness. I love Chongo but that book could easily be half the size and hence half the price yet with vastly the same content. I guess I speak from the dirtbagger mentality here...)
Alas, perhaps you mistake my comfort with grey areas as stupidity.
I think having a dangerous experience with Pete naturally should shadow your opinions about anything regarding the man. There is no way he can ever undo what that experience did to you inside. Obviously my experience was different.
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Landgolier
climber
the flatness
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Cybele wrote:
"But really how many would or could spend a benji on a handprinted book? How realistic was that?"
The method for getting your hands on it might be kind of jingus, but considering that it takes about $3-4 grand in gear just to have a shot at getting a single naked ape up the big stone, a C-note for a book on how to actually make it is a pretty good deal. Regardless, "he wasn't disseminating the knowledge in an accessible enough format" is not much of a plagiarism defense.
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Karl Baba
Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
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I remember Pete crediting Chongo numerous times for his ideas, and Chongo's huge book was partially made possible by his collaboration with Pete.
And in fact, the vast majority of publicity for the very existence of Chongos book and how to get it came from Pete's postings.
add to that the fact that plagerism is of words, not practices. I doubt John Long developed more than a tiny share of the techniques cataloged in his books either. Once the knowledge is out there, we share it.
That doesn't mean there weren't kinks and misunderstandings or abuses in the relationship between Pete, Chongo, the Book and the Net. Those are devils in the details I know know.
Peace
Karl
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